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 Post subject: Re: Robin Ventura
PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2015 6:58 pm 
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Who in their right mind hires a guy to be the manager of a MLB team who has never before managed? Because he's a good guy? Unreal.

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 Post subject: Re: Robin Ventura
PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2015 7:07 pm 
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St Louis- Mike Matheny
Miami- Mike Redmond
Detroit- Brad Ausmus
Minnesota- Paul Molitor
Colorado- Walt Weiss


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 Post subject: Re: Robin Ventura
PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2015 7:08 pm 
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Hatchetman wrote:
bitch all you want, he's still better than jerry manuel.

Fuck I have been through Don Gutteridge

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I'm going to bounce from the spot for awhile but I will be back at some point to argue with you about this hoops stuff again. Playoffs have been great this season. See ya up the road.

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 Post subject: Re: Robin Ventura
PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2015 7:10 pm 
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Keyser Soze wrote:
St Louis- Mike Matheny
Miami- Mike Redmond
Detroit- Brad Ausmus
Minnesota- Paul Molitor
Colorado- Walt Weiss



Ozzie you dope

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I'm going to bounce from the spot for awhile but I will be back at some point to argue with you about this hoops stuff again. Playoffs have been great this season. See ya up the road.

I'm out.


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 Post subject: Re: Robin Ventura
PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2015 7:16 pm 
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I was just going with current managers but as always thanks for your 2 cents.


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 Post subject: Re: Robin Ventura
PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2015 7:22 pm 
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Not that it matters much but how the fuck the Sox start on the road only come home for three and back out. Seems like a bad deal.

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 Post subject: Re: Robin Ventura
PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2015 8:05 pm 
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Scorehead wrote:
Who in their right mind hires a guy to be the manager of a MLB team who has never before managed?
St. Theo did a mere 18 months ago.

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 Post subject: Re: Robin Ventura
PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2015 8:22 pm 
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Scorehead wrote:
Who in their right mind hires a guy to be the manager of a MLB team who has never before managed? Because he's a good guy? Unreal.

The Reinsdorf organization did the same thing with Vinny Del Negro in a sport where coaching experience is much more necessary.

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 Post subject: Re: Robin Ventura
PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 7:54 am 
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He is actively throwing games with his decision-making.


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 Post subject: Re: Robin Ventura
PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 8:03 am 
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Curious Hair wrote:
Scorehead wrote:
Who in their right mind hires a guy to be the manager of a MLB team who has never before managed? Because he's a good guy? Unreal.

The Reinsdorf organization did the same thing with Vinny Del Negro in a sport where coaching experience is much more necessary.


"It happens."

And Vinny probably got a lifetime supply of neckties as a parting gift.


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 Post subject: Re: Robin Ventura
PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 11:07 am 
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Keyser Soze wrote:
St Louis- Mike Matheny
Miami- Mike Redmond
Detroit- Brad Ausmus
Minnesota- Paul Molitor
Colorado- Walt Weiss

The difference being, those guys wanted to manage


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 Post subject: Re: Robin Ventura
PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 11:25 am 
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so you guys think having a .120 hitter bunt men into scoring position is a radically bizarre move?

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 Post subject: Re: Robin Ventura
PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 11:27 am 
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No.

Do. Your. Job.


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 Post subject: Re: Robin Ventura
PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 11:38 am 
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Hatchetman wrote:
so you guys think having a .120 hitter bunt men into scoring position is a radically bizarre move?

yes, when the next two hitters are batting .182 and .233.

if you believe the .182 and .233 averages aren't representative of their ability then the same should hold for the .120 hitter.


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 Post subject: Re: Robin Ventura
PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 11:45 am 
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you'd need to do more analysis to convince me it was definitely the wrong move. Never bunting is not the right answer.

make a probability tree.

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 Post subject: Re: Robin Ventura
PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 11:48 am 
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Hatchetman wrote:
you'd need to do more analysis to convince me it was definitely the wrong move. Never bunting is not the right answer.

make a probability tree.



Never bunting with two men on in an AL game is definitely the right answer.

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 Post subject: Re: Robin Ventura
PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 11:50 am 
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Hatchetman wrote:
so you guys think having a .120 hitter bunt men into scoring position is a radically bizarre move?

.275 career hitter


Dont give away outs.

There are times when it makes sense to bunt. Runner on second in a tie game with nobody out. When a pitcher is batting. Suicide squeezes, etc

Not when you have 2 on and none out and the pitcher reeling.


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 Post subject: Re: Robin Ventura
PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 11:51 am 
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rogers park bryan wrote:
Hatchetman wrote:
so you guys think having a .120 hitter bunt men into scoring position is a radically bizarre move?

.275 career hitter


Dont give away outs.

There are times when it makes sense to bunt. Runner on second in a tie game with nobody out. When a pitcher is batting. Suicide squeezes, etc

Not when you have 2 on and none out and the pitcher reeling.

I disagree, but I see I am not in the norm with this thought.

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 Post subject: Re: Robin Ventura
PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 11:52 am 
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Hawg Ass wrote:
rogers park bryan wrote:
Hatchetman wrote:
so you guys think having a .120 hitter bunt men into scoring position is a radically bizarre move?

.275 career hitter


Dont give away outs.

There are times when it makes sense to bunt. Runner on second in a tie game with nobody out. When a pitcher is batting. Suicide squeezes, etc

Not when you have 2 on and none out and the pitcher reeling.

I disagree, but I see I am not in the norm with this thought.

Cool.


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 Post subject: Re: Robin Ventura
PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 11:53 am 
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rogers park bryan wrote:
Hatchetman wrote:
so you guys think having a .120 hitter bunt men into scoring position is a radically bizarre move?


Runner on second in a tie game with nobody out.



I think that's a loser over time too, but depending on the players involved on either side I can understand it in certain situations.

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 Post subject: Re: Robin Ventura
PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 11:58 am 
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you guys are dan bernstein wannabes. show me the numbers.

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 Post subject: Re: Robin Ventura
PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 12:08 pm 
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Hatchetman wrote:
you guys are dan bernstein wannabes. show me the numbers.

Here is a pretty good case.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1639658-explaining-why-the-bunt-is-foolish-in-todays-mlb


that's something that Anthony Castrovince of MLB.com dove into earlier this year using Run Expectations data from Baseball Prospectus. The Run Expectation with a runner on first and nobody out is higher than it is when there's a runner on second and one out, the situation usually created by a sac bunt.

The trend holds when discussing Win Expectancies in late-inning situations, which is something that noted sabermetrician Tom Tango tackled back in 2002. The win expectancy for a home team trailing by one in the bottom of the ninth is higher with a runner on first and nobody out than it is with a runner on second and one out. And so on.


But Im not a Bernstein wanna be. Mine is more the feeling of giving the pitcher an out and taking him out of hot water (2 on, none out)


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 Post subject: Re: Robin Ventura
PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 12:10 pm 
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rogers park bryan wrote:
Hatchetman wrote:
you guys are dan bernstein wannabes. show me the numbers.

Here is a pretty good case.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1639658-explaining-why-the-bunt-is-foolish-in-todays-mlb


But Im not a Bernstein wanna be. Mine is more the feeling of giving the pitcher an out and taking him out of hot water (2 on, none out)



I have no problem with a guy bunting to get on base. That's actually a high percentage play.

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 Post subject: Re: Robin Ventura
PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 12:11 pm 
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Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
rogers park bryan wrote:
Hatchetman wrote:
you guys are dan bernstein wannabes. show me the numbers.

Here is a pretty good case.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1639658-explaining-why-the-bunt-is-foolish-in-todays-mlb


But Im not a Bernstein wanna be. Mine is more the feeling of giving the pitcher an out and taking him out of hot water (2 on, none out)



I have no problem with a guy bunting to get on base. That's actually a high percentage play.

The article is mostly about sac bunts


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 Post subject: Re: Robin Ventura
PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 12:13 pm 
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There's certainly a time and place for sacrifice-bunting, but as Earl Weaver said, if you play for one run, that's all you'll get.

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 Post subject: Re: Robin Ventura
PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 12:14 pm 
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Curious Hair wrote:
There's certainly a time and place for sacrifice-bunting, but as Earl Weaver said, if you play for one run, that's all you'll get.

Mostly in the NL with pitchers.


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 Post subject: Re: Robin Ventura
PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 12:18 pm 
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well you see on average that may be the case though that data is way out of date. But in our situation is entirely different. on the road, down two, two men on, eaton melky and abreu at bat. I have not seen a statistical analysis of this.

the way eaton has been sucking ass I don't necessarily think it is dumb.

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 Post subject: Re: Robin Ventura
PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 12:23 pm 
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Hatchetman wrote:
well you see on average that may be the case though that data is way out of date. But in our situation is entirely different. on the road, down two, two men on, eaton melky and abreu at bat. I have not seen a statistical analysis of this.

the way eaton has been sucking ass I don't necessarily think it is dumb.



Then let's put him on the bench and let Schuck hit then. You're making an argument against Adam Eaton rather than an argument for bunting.

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 Post subject: Re: Robin Ventura
PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 12:49 pm 
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The only time I could see sacrafice bunts being a good thing is in the 9th if you are tied.

I can't imagine it ever truly helps when you are down.

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 Post subject: Re: Robin Ventura
PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 12:58 pm 
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So, is about every manager in Major League Baseball just dumb then?

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