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"Play until it hurts, then play until it hurts to not play."
http://soundcloud.com/darkside124 HOF 2013, MM Champion 2014

bombs? babies? Check out cubbiegirlpoopcup.

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http://www.amazon.com/While-Europe-Slep ... 0767920058

Interesting Chas. I do not know this author so would have to see his back story but this is what I was talking about. Even 10 years ago when I was in Europe for work there seemed to be a subculture. Almost like a servant class population. They do not need government sanctioned rules they simply seem to make their own underground society. Not too much different than the mafia maybe?

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Elections have consequences.

bawer is a gay activist and has written a variety of sociopolitical books. wrote an interesting book called "stealing jesus: how fundamentalism betrays christianity" a while back.

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I used to know a real modern day trojan horse but he still ended up getting the hep B.

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You know me like that.

Id like to dismiss this out of hand but there are parts of Islam that I still cringe at.


And that's not to say that all Muslims individually condone these terrible things, but Id think Id have to reconsider my affiliation with a group that does such things (As many former Catholics have done)

I don't think it is really fair to judge the whole religion but it is more than fair to judge the countries that use it as law or base their laws on it.

Hopefully that changes in my lifetime though.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

There are parts of every belief system/religion to cringe at.

People are abhorrent.

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See, that's the thing though. The knee jerk reaction for the apologists of Islam is to immediately bring up Christianity and/or the Crusades. We can't do anything about what occurred in the 1100s. The truth is, for the most part Christianity has become secularized and Westernized, to the point now where the Pope is actually changing doctrine to appeal to his "customers". There simply isn't a large, organized group of Christians that want to kill and destroy others who do not share their beliefs. (Except the Republican Party. j/k)

We have people on this board who have no problem with viciously attacking a women who refuses to marry homosexuals who also stand in defense of a religion that subjugates women and orders death for gays. That's pretty fucked up.

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Freedom is our Strength.

the gospels of jesus and the Koran are like night and day in tone. now if you want to lump in the old testament, then you're going to find some unpalatable stuff.

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Reality is your friend, not your enemy. -- Seacrest

Yes, there are levels though.

To say Islam is the same as any other religion or group is just not true.

Thinking gays go to hell and stoning woman for being raped (or insert latest disgusting act in the name of Islam) are not equal.

Not wanting gays to marry is a tad bit different than having the hanging of gays or stoning a rape victim to death or killing your daughter because she drove a car be a part of public policy.

Edit: RPB already touched on it.

Absolutely.

But I think saying "X religion is evil" is stupid.

It's the people who use X religion as justification for their abhorrent actions that are evil.

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His books and view point are interesting. I left out his background on purpose that the usual suspects could come in slamming him and the book and then I could sort of whip out the fact that the guy is left as all hell .

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When I am stuck and need to figure something out I always remember the Immortal words of Socrates when he said:"I just drank what?"

We really don't want to get into a "religion vs religion" comparison do we?

The Bible advocates some pretty horrible shit.

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Therefore X religion is evil. The actions are occurring because of the religion, not independent of it. And the only reason anyone defends Islam is because of its age and its size. No one would grant the same courtesies to the Branch Davidians or Warren Jeffs, for example.

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Freedom is our Strength.

The difference being that today in 2015 no large organized groups are acting out horrible shit based on the Bible.

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Freedom is our Strength.

You are 100% wrong,there are at least two religions I can name right off the top of my head that everyone will agree on as being evil. Satanism and Natzisum.

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When I am stuck and need to figure something out I always remember the Immortal words of Socrates when he said:"I just drank what?"

Yes, Id like to get into it. One is way less dangerous. (and that is from a critic of Christianity)

If we were only talking about the Koran saying these things (like the Bible says horrible things) then you'd have a point. We're talking about actions here.

If stories of Christians hanging gays, stoning divorced people and executing non Christians (for being non Christian) then we'll have to address them too.

Laveyan Satanism isn't evil. It's dumb, like all religion, but not really evil.

I am talking hard care, Church of Process type shit.

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When I am stuck and need to figure something out I always remember the Immortal words of Socrates when he said:"I just drank what?"

atheism is evil. plenty of atheists doing bad stuff.

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Reality is your friend, not your enemy. -- Seacrest

And I realize that as Americans living in a country founded by people who came in order to freely practice their religion, criticizing the religion of another is anathema to us. It's in our DNA not to do so. (Except Jews. Everyone always seems to find a way to make an exception for the Jews.)

That's one issue I have with the book Chas keeps referencing. The author suggests that America demands that her immigrants assimilate into our "melting pot". One walk down Devon Avenue and anyone will see how untrue that is.

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Freedom is our Strength.

I am not doing it in the name of atheism, however.

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Freedom is our Strength.

Everyone is evil.

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So you agree that it's the people, not the religion itself, that is evil.

A majority of Christians have "grown up" and realized not to take everything in the Bible literally.

Islam hasn't gotten to that point. At least not outside the Middle East.

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well that's sort of my point....sort of.

this is hopeless. if you read the gospels and read the Koran and think they are morally equivalent... fine.

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Reality is your friend, not your enemy. -- Seacrest

Too bad the ones that have grown up are the vocal minority...the ignorant vocal part screams like a toddler until everyone listens...

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Why not? The idea that all religions are equally bad or equally crazy is a folly. We go through this shit with Scientology, too.

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