people still debated me on it so I see your and raise you

_________________
O judgment! Thou art fled to brutish beasts,
And men have lost their reason.

Arrieta could regress by 25% from this year's numbers and he's still a legit #1 starter.

Let's make this simple.

Arrieta > Sale

_________________
Rick Hahn is the best GM in baseball.

No doubt, but he had the greatest second half in the history of baseball and his team still finished third.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Matthew, Tulsi, and Don

He's had a better season but I don't think anyone really believes that.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Matthew, Tulsi, and Don

Chris Sale's 2014 was a career year.

We'll see what this list looks like in 4 months:

http://m.mlb.com/news/article/107796584 ... g-pitchers

_________________
Rick Hahn is the best GM in baseball.

As a Chicago Cubs starter, Arrieta has:

66 Starts, 2.30 ERA, 5 CG shutouts, 431.1 IP, 2.65 FIP, 0.948 WHIP, 14.3 bWAR, and was 35-13.


In that same stretch (8/16/13 - today) Sale:

64 Starts, 3.02 ERA, 0 CG shutouts, 431.2 IP, approx. 2.95 FIP, approx. 1.090 WHIP, 11.6 bWAR (less since I used 2013 second half WAR rather than trying to calculate since 8/16/13), and was 27-20.


And again, the average earned runs per game between AL and NL is 0.30 per game.

_________________
Rick Hahn is the best GM in baseball.

and yet, you are alone in thinking he is better

_________________
O judgment! Thou art fled to brutish beasts,
And men have lost their reason.

IMU is right. Baseball didn't exist prior to the arrival of Arrieta.

_________________
You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

A few things:

1. non sequitur much?

2. Are you confused about the oft occurring result where individual performance is greater than team performance, or vice versa? If so, the board can try to help. To this point, was the 2005 version of Brian Lawrence a better pitcher than the 2015 version of Jake Arrietta because the Padres finished in first place? Even you're not this stupid.

3. If you think that Arrieta has the greatest second half in the history of baseball, maybe you missed when Randy Johnson smoked the NL in 1998 to the tune of a 322 ERA+.

And in 2014 Cy Young was reborn as Chris Sale and his team finished fourth?

_________________
Host of the weekly "We Fish ASA" podcast
Weekly columnist for the Northwest Herald
Bi-monthly columnist for Illinois Outdoor News magazine
Former host of The Outdoors Experience on WIND and The Great Outdoors on CLTV
http://www.wefishasa.com

Arrieta has a second half ERA+ of 491.

_________________
Rick Hahn is the best GM in baseball.

_________________
Rick Hahn is the best GM in baseball.

So? I'm not excited about the Sox going forward. I think the fact that a guy had to put up 500 ERA+ so your team could finish third might be a bit of a concern.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Matthew, Tulsi, and Don

Why would he be alone? Things could change next year, but Arrieta has clearly been better this year, and it's not really even close.

Sox fans seem to keep referring to some hypothetical future where their players always get better, but Cubs players are all just having "career years."

_________________

A #1 starter still only affects 20% of a team's games.

Better over the last 25 months, technically.

_________________
Rick Hahn is the best GM in baseball.

Also, way better beard.

_________________

leash doesn't read my posts.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Matthew, Tulsi, and Don

Foe list.

_________________

Over the course of 25 months, Arrieta has better stats. Even when weighted for league. Whether you want ERA, FIP, WHIP or W/L.

Arrieta wins them all.

Smellya later, hater.

_________________
Rick Hahn is the best GM in baseball.

I don't understand.

I thought being the fan of, and enjoying a team was primarily based on how many games the team won. So regardless of which place the team finished in, JOOR is a big proponent of being a fan of a team that wins a lot of games.

So based on that, the cubs will probably have the third most wins in the majors this year, so other than the Cardinals and Pirates (not yet) the Cubs and their fans will have either superior or vastly superior experiences this year compared to the fan bases of 28 other teams.

So which is it JOOR, is the place a team finishes in important or a "concern" or is it all about winning more games?

viewtopic.php?f=32&t=91853&start=25



Might as well stick a fork in this wasted year of your life.

If JOOR was a Cubs fan, he would be in Valhalla.

After all, his goal is to watch his favorite team play winning baseball.

So who cares about 3rd place vs. any other place. Someone who's favorite team is the Cubs, is probably at a 10 out of 10 on the JOOR fan scale. Why do you keep bringing up what place the Cubs are in if you are all about fans watching a winning team?



viewtopic.php?f=32&t=91853&start=50

I'm not sure what you're trying to say. I don't really think you are either. I'm sure the Cub fan is having a better experience this summer than I am.

Maybe you're in the wrong thread. The conversation was about the greatness of Jake Arrieta and how that bodes well for the Cubs future. There was some anger when dolphin pointed out that Arrieta will never be this good again. But I don't even think the biggest Cub optimist could believe he will ever have another half season where he puts up a 490 ERA +. The team finished third with him doing that. How will they finish when he does less than that? We'll see. Enjoy your multiple championships and stop worrying about Chris Sale and the failures of the White Sox.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Matthew, Tulsi, and Don

Here's what I'm saying:

1. Above you correctly pointed out that this thread is about Arrieta, yet you are the one who continually refers to the performance of the Cubs. So you can understand why someone would think that YOU are confused about the thread.

2. In prior threads, the threads I referenced, when presented your team "winning games" but not making the playoffs as a disappointment from a fan standpoint, your response was that watching your team win, is (a) very enjoyable, (b) vastly superior to the experiences of other fans, (c) insert JOOR bullshit here, etc. All regardless of what place the team finishes in. However in this thread, you continually reference how the Cubs are in third place and presumably will finish there (not yet). So what is it, you can't have it both ways, either watching a team win a bunch a games is great regardless of the position they finish in (your posture in the thread I referenced), or the thing that matters is the place that a team finishes in (your posture in this thread).

3. Also your premise is that because Arrieta will regress from his performance this year somehow dooms the Cubs to failure in the future, which assumes that all of the other components of the team, currently on the roster or not, will remain static in their performance. This is stupid, even for you.

I never said you shouldn't be enjoying this Cub season, no matter how sadly it's going to end.

And I don't think all the other Cub's performance will remain the same. Some will do better, some worse. You seem to have trouble reading and like the majority of Cub fans I know, you evaluate Cub players based on their best seasons.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Matthew, Tulsi, and Don

It upsets me that the Cubs can only win one World Series this year.

_________________
Rick Hahn is the best GM in baseball.

It has already been a very good season, where the team achieved much more than anyone I can think of had expected. To think they are going to win the World Series with just 1 great pitcher and 1 very good one, is probably not realistic. It's a year early for those kind of expectations to be remotely realistic. Evaluating Arrieta on this season and thinking he will repeat this level of performance is silly. He has been historically great. But the Cubs are starting 5 rookies, off of whom will probably have better seasons than this one. Castro has been the hottest hitter in baseball for the last month, but his overall season has been far short of a career best. Rizzo has had a great season, even if he's hitting only around .230 over the past 30 games. Who besides Arrieta is having a career year? Fowler? He has more homers than any previous years and is 3rd in the league in runs scored, but will probably not be with the team next season, so nobody is counting on him next season. Coghlan has more homers than any season before, but his rookie year he hit .321 with more runs scored and more RBI. Montero has had seasons batting in the .280's with as many as 86 RBI and he has just 53 this year. So who besides Arrieta is having a career year?

_________________
Go Cubs!!!!

This is what I'm talking about. This year's Cubs are a really good team. You expect them to keep getting better. They're going to win 95 games. Do you have any idea how many Cub teams have won 95 games in the history of baseball?

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Matthew, Tulsi, and Don

This is their euphoria talking. There is no room for logic at this point until the off season for Cub fans no matter what you point out to them. At this point they fully expect they will get Price and win 102 next year.

_________________
Elections have consequences.

BTW, the answer is 10.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/CHC/

_________________
Elections have consequences.