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 Post subject: Re: Cubs land Zobrist
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 8:17 pm 
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Peoria Matt wrote:
Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:
I never understood the Zobrist fascination.


grindy....plays the right way....versatile


In other words, he's white.


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 Post subject: Re: Cubs land Zobrist
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 8:17 pm 
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5th in total position player WAR since 2009

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 Post subject: Re: Cubs land Zobrist
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 8:20 pm 
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He makes them better for now. Not sure how he'll age


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 Post subject: Re: Cubs land Zobrist
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 8:22 pm 
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cpguy wrote:
I understand the concerns but you gotta trust Maddon who managed Zobrist.

And they need to win the division to avoid the 1 game wild card trap.

Zobrist may only be good for 2 years as a regular but if that equals a world series championship, I will take it.


I never said to myself "If they can land Zobrist and Lackey, they are in great shape." I hope there is more to come.


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 Post subject: Re: Cubs land Zobrist
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 8:24 pm 
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Peoria Matt wrote:
cpguy wrote:
I understand the concerns but you gotta trust Maddon who managed Zobrist.

And they need to win the division to avoid the 1 game wild card trap.

Zobrist may only be good for 2 years as a regular but if that equals a world series championship, I will take it.


I never said to myself "If they can land Zobrist and Lackey, they are in great shape." I hope there is more to come.


Heyward??


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 Post subject: Re: Cubs land Zobrist
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 8:25 pm 
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Peoria Matt wrote:
cpguy wrote:
I understand the concerns but you gotta trust Maddon who managed Zobrist.

And they need to win the division to avoid the 1 game wild card trap.

Zobrist may only be good for 2 years as a regular but if that equals a world series championship, I will take it.


I never said to myself "If they can land Zobrist and Lackey, they are in great shape." I hope there is more to come.


Trusting Maddon is fine. But you can't trust him to make Zobrist younger. That's when Maddon had him.

They better win it next year. Cuz Lackey's and Zobrist's age will certainly catch up to them in 2017. But I still think they both could be bad next year. Look at Zobrist numbers last year. He was OK. That's about it.


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 Post subject: Re: Cubs land Zobrist
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 8:27 pm 
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Peoria Matt wrote:
cpguy wrote:
I understand the concerns but you gotta trust Maddon who managed Zobrist.

And they need to win the division to avoid the 1 game wild card trap.

Zobrist may only be good for 2 years as a regular but if that equals a world series championship, I will take it.


I never said to myself "If they can land Zobrist and Lackey, they are in great shape." I hope there is more to come.


Me either. I pray I'm wrong or I'm going to start believing the Baseball God is trying to torture me.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubs land Zobrist
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 8:30 pm 
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I enjoy watching theo with an open checkbook in free agency

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 Post subject: Re: Cubs land Zobrist
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 8:31 pm 
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good dolphin wrote:
I enjoy watching theo with an open checkbook in free agency


I don't think it's fully open.


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 Post subject: Re: Cubs land Zobrist
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 8:32 pm 
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Zobrist is not a franchise player, but rather a versatile switch hitting piece of hopefully a championship puzzle.

The price of poker was 4 years and 56M.

I like that they are rolling the dice.


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 Post subject: Re: Cubs land Zobrist
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 8:33 pm 
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I trust the plan. Other than the E Jax signing it has worked fine.


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 Post subject: Re: Cubs land Zobrist
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 8:38 pm 
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Beardown wrote:
Peoria Matt wrote:
cpguy wrote:
I understand the concerns but you gotta trust Maddon who managed Zobrist.

And they need to win the division to avoid the 1 game wild card trap.

Zobrist may only be good for 2 years as a regular but if that equals a world series championship, I will take it.


I never said to myself "If they can land Zobrist and Lackey, they are in great shape." I hope there is more to come.


Trusting Maddon is fine. But you can't trust him to make Zobrist younger. That's when Maddon had him.

They better win it next year. Cuz Lackey's and Zobrist's age will certainly catch up to them in 2017. But I still think they both could be bad next year. Look at Zobrist numbers last year. He was OK. That's about it.

3rd best offensive 2b in MLB last year.

Little better than OK


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 Post subject: Re: Cubs land Zobrist
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 8:39 pm 
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Wanted to hear some talk on this.

Larry has a show. But Lance is on now.

Why the hell is ESPN 1000 broadcasting a Virginia vs. West Virginia basketball game? :? Huge demand for this game in Chicago I guess.


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 Post subject: Re: Cubs land Zobrist
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 8:40 pm 
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Zobrist had a higher OPS than Pujols who hit 40 HR

Mildly surprising


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 Post subject: Re: Cubs land Zobrist
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 8:40 pm 
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Yeah. I looked at his numbers again. He did have a great OBP.


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 Post subject: Re: Cubs land Zobrist
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 8:44 pm 
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This is a 2016 run. Not a 2020 run.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubs land Zobrist
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 8:44 pm 
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rogers park bryan wrote:
Zobrist had a higher OPS than Pujols who hit 40 HR

Mildly surprising


#2016

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 Post subject: Re: Cubs land Zobrist
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 8:45 pm 
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Beardown wrote:
Wanted to hear some talk on this.

Larry has a show. But Lance is on now.

Why the hell is ESPN 1000 broadcasting a Virginia vs. West Virginia basketball game? :? Huge demand for this game in Chicago I guess.



Baseball has been on ignore all week thus far as we talk about the Bears.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubs land Zobrist
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 8:45 pm 
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Darkside wrote:
This is a 2016 run. Not a 2020 run.
It better be. There is going to be a lot of bad money on the 2020 Cubs.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubs land Zobrist
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 8:51 pm 
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Frank Coztansa wrote:
Darkside wrote:
This is a 2016 run. Not a 2020 run.
It better be. There is going to be a lot of bad money on the 2020 Cubs.

THERE'S BAD MONEY ON 2020 FRANK.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubs land Zobrist
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 8:57 pm 
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A few thoughts:

1. If somebody put a gun to my head and said I had to bet my life on Ben Zobrist having a better 2016 offensive season as a Cub leadoff hitter, or Starlin Castro having a better season as a Cub #6 hitter, I'd bet on Zobrist.
2. Paying $3.75M in each of 2016/2017 to have Baez come in as a defensive or injury replacement for Soler or Schwarber with Zobrist moving to the OF, instead of bring in a Denorfia type guy... almost worth it
3. The pitcher isn't crap. He's probably worth a chunk of the extra $7M from Zobrist's salary over Castro's for 2018/2019.

All in all, I like the transactions.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubs land Zobrist
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 8:59 pm 
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Zobrist is a nice player, but I do not like this deal. Frankly, the money would have been better spent on Denard Span, who would have come cheaper too. They had Castro and Baez already as well as Tommy LaStella, so even if they dealt Castro (which they have of course) they were covered at 2nd. Is Zobrist an upgrade? .....Sure, but they need a CF, not another 2B and Zobrist has said recently that is where he wants to play full time now. I guess Baez will be a utility guy and play 3B, 2B, SS and maybe even some OF. If they still get Span, Heyward or Fowler to play CF, fine. But this was too much money for an older player IMO.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubs land Zobrist
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 9:02 pm 
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He plays a lot of positions equally poorly but this will be another guy who strict saber Chicagoans will be saying has intangibles

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 Post subject: Re: Cubs land Zobrist
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 9:03 pm 
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Elmhurst Steve wrote:
Zobrist is a nice player, but I do not like this deal. Frankly, the money would have been better spent on Denard Span, who would have come cheaper too. They had Castro and Baez already as well as Tommy LaStella, so even if they dealt Castro (which they have of course) they were covered at 2nd. Is Zobrist an upgrade? .....Sure, but they need a CF, not another 2B and Zobrist has said recently that is where he wants to play full time now. I guess Baez will be a utility guy and play 3B, 2B, SS and maybe even some OF. If they still get Span, Heyward or Fowler to play CF, fine. But this was too much money for an older player IMO.


I would like to see what Baez can do in CF.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubs land Zobrist
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 9:06 pm 
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Baez is the wild card in all this but chances are he will get 300+ AB's unless they trade him for a proven arm or maybe an answer to CF.

I have read where Theo has said that getting a defense first CF for this season is an option and they are playing Baez in CF in the winter league as we speak.

Span remains an option but he has bad hips and to me seems like a DL stint waiting to happen and he will cost at least 5-6M on a 1 year deal.


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 Post subject: Re: Cubs land Zobrist
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 9:17 pm 
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I do like that Zobrist walks more than he strikes out. When he has a runner at third and less than 2 outs, chances are good he will put the ball in play and score the runner. When he has the potential tying or winning run on 2nd and nobody out late in the game, he will likely advance that runner, if not score the runner. Cubs have a nice group of power hitters (Schwarber, Rizzo, Bryant and Soler unless he gets dealt), but getting a guy who has a high OBP and doesn't strike out often, is good.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubs land Zobrist
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 9:19 pm 
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good dolphin wrote:
He plays a lot of positions equally poorly but this will be another guy who strict saber Chicagoans will be saying has intangibles


Your manager can barely conduct press conferences without falling asleep.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubs land Zobrist
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 9:22 pm 
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leashyourkids wrote:
good dolphin wrote:
He plays a lot of positions equally poorly but this will be another guy who strict saber Chicagoans will be saying has intangibles


Your manager can barely conduct press conferences without falling asleep.

Not my manager!


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 Post subject: Re: Cubs land Zobrist
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 9:23 pm 
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America wrote:
leashyourkids wrote:
good dolphin wrote:
He plays a lot of positions equally poorly but this will be another guy who strict saber Chicagoans will be saying has intangibles


Your manager can barely conduct press conferences without falling asleep.

Not my manager!

But you're on that manager?

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 Post subject: Re: Cubs land Zobrist
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 9:27 pm 
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Elmhurst Steve wrote:
I do like that Zobrist walks more than he strikes out. When he has a runner at third and less than 2 outs, chances are good he will put the ball in play and score the runner. When he has the potential tying or winning run on 2nd and nobody out late in the game, he will likely advance that runner, if not score the runner. Cubs have a nice group of power hitters (Schwarber, Rizzo, Bryant and Soler unless he gets dealt), but getting a guy who has a high OBP and doesn't strike out often, is good.


Yep, he's a pro.


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