That's incorrect. He and the other pitcher had different jobs. The other pitcher had the much easier job of shutting down the Braves.

The three guys with the most losses in baseball (Kluber, Miller, Cashner) were all in the bottom 10 in run support

That's not a coincidence.

Fernandez has averaged about 4.5 runs per game run support in his career. He would certainly win less games if he was on a team scoring 2.66




Anyway, even you might have to make an exception (a la the 14-13 Felix year) Miller had two winning seasons before going to a team that was legendarily bad. Kluber too.

The team Felix was on averaged two full runs less than many of the teams he faced. As bad as Atlanta's offense was last year, that wasn't the case. Philadelphia and Miami had similar offenses to Atlanta. So did the Mets for most of the year. Miller made 13 starts against those three teams.

I'm going to save this thread to bring out at the end of next year when this guy is getting pilloried by Cub fans and 312player has awarded him a cute derogatory nickname. And then I'm going to say, you traded for a guy who lost 17 games. Why did you expect him to be so much better?

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Matthew, Tulsi, and Don

Cubs and Braves deal is dead. Gordon Wittenmeyer again proves to know absolutely nothing about anything.

I think the Cubs dodged a bullet.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Matthew, Tulsi, and Don

I think GW made the whole thing up, honestly.

GW n Lavine are both full of shit, none of these local guys have any idea what is really going down. I think the asking price is too steep for Miller right now.

_________________

Run support exists and matters and you know it deep down in your heart. You've just built up so much hate for people who shun W-L that you wont listen to reason

Again, its not a coincidence that two all stars (Kluber and Miller) who previously had winning records led their leagues in losses and lack of run support in the same year.


Oh and before this year he was 26-18. How does that work? Is he that guy or the 17 loss guy?

How bout Kluber? When he wins 15 next year is the thought on your end that he just had a bad year (even though all his numbers besides wins were nearly the same)?

A pitcher has to pitch the games he's in. If he's a good pitcher he doesn't come out on the losing end more often even if he's "supported" by a AAA offense. Can you imagine any circumstance where Kershaw or Bumgarner loses 17 games? Barring a bad injury, of course you can't. Because they're good pitchers.

How much "run support" is enough so that we can call a pitcher a bum when he loses?

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Matthew, Tulsi, and Don

Yes of course. We saw it this year with Kluber. Im leaving work right now so let's pick this up another time. (nothing new to go over anyway haha)

RPB going to jump down the W/L rabbit hole with JORR.

Zobrist choosing between the Cubs and Mets

Castro to Yankees.

RUMORED

I was wondering if you had heard something.

Hopefully he chooses the Mets.

_________________
Be well

GO BEARS!!!

Jesse Rogers
‏@ESPNChiCubs

Theo says the Cubs are getting closer to a deal. They are trying to sync up a trade and FA. That sounds like Zobrist/Castro move, IMO

I'd rather have Castro than Zobrist at this point in their careers. Money not even a factor.

But the money is a factor. Cubs fans starting to learn why Theo got ran out of Boston.

Since Maddon managed both, gotta trust his opinion.

Zobrist is the smarter and more versatile player for sure.

Maddon has never liked Castro.

No one really has


He's good. I'll miss his crazy ass

Luke Blaize ‏@ltblaize 8m8 minutes ago

We knew the bullpen fight in Mesa would be rough, but think about the rotation battle. Hammel vs Warren vs Cahill vs Wood vs etc.

Hammel has been stellar in the first half of each of the past 2 seasons. If they are smart, they bring him back and slot him in as the #5, but if he begins to struggle again after the break, just release him at that point and stretch out Warren. In the first half of 2015, Hammel was almost as good as Arrieta and better than Lester.

_________________
Go Cubs!!!!

I wonder about Maddon a little. Not because I think he is not good but I do not know enough about him regarding players he has had. I am sure this move had to come with his input. Either he asked Theo to go get him or at the least Theo said to Maddon what about this?

Either way we are about to learn of Maddon keeps his personal feelings about past players in check while making these decisions. Hopefully he is not one of these guys to take on his older ex players blindly.

_________________
Elections have consequences.

Well, he has his woobie now. Anything less than a WS appearance has to be a disappointment.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Matthew, Tulsi, and Don

All good trade chips (albeit for a minimal return) although Szczur would be a good keeper for CF depth.

Phil Rogers ‏@philgrogers 23m23 minutes ago

In addition to Javy Baez, #Cubs talks w/#Rays re: pitching have included Matt Szczur, Dan Vogelbach and Christian Villanueva.

Maybe the Rays will trade Archer for those near busts

This is great. Straight out lies. Those are thow in players that he is portraying as centerpieces of a trade

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O judgment! Thou art fled to brutish beasts,
And men have lost their reason.

I think Zobrist books the magicians.

_________________
Proud member of the white guy grievance committee

It aint the six minutes. Its what happens in those six minutes.

2/3 of the way there.

_________________
Rick Hahn is the best GM in baseball.