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 Post subject: Re: Cubs vs Reds
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 8:01 am 
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 Post subject: Re: Cubs vs Reds
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 8:04 am 
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 Post subject: Re: Cubs vs Reds
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 8:07 am 
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Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
Lester will be fine. He's a winning pitcher. That probably isn't going to change. He knows how to pitch a baseball game. He's the last guy I'd worry about.

He will barely be a .500 pitcher for the Cubs if at all before it's over. Of course I'll take it if they win a WS while he's here but we wil see.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubs vs Reds
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 8:12 am 
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badrogue17 wrote:
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
Lester will be fine. He's a winning pitcher. That probably isn't going to change. He knows how to pitch a baseball game. He's the last guy I'd worry about.

He will barely be a .500 pitcher for the Cubs if at all before it's over. Of course I'll take it if they win a WS while he's here but we wil see.


Doesn't seem like money well spent in my opinion. He's paid to be great. Up until this point, he has been average to good.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubs vs Reds
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 8:17 am 
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It's all relative . He goes 3-0 in a post season WS winning year and it'll have been worth it. Now that he has the bats ( as if that were an excuse) he really should rip off a great year. If he's going to go 11-9 with a mid 3 ERA and a bad post season he's Jose Quintana at 4x the price. We wil see.

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Last edited by badrogue17 on Tue Apr 12, 2016 8:19 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubs vs Reds
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 8:19 am 
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badrogue17 wrote:
It's all relative . He goes 3-0 in a post season WS winning year and it'll have been worth it. Now that he has the bats ( as if that were an excuse) he really should rip off a great year. If he's going to go 11-9 with a mid 3 ERA he's Jose Quintana at 4x the price. We wil see.


I wish Quintana would go 11-9.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubs vs Reds
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 8:20 am 
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Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
badrogue17 wrote:
It's all relative . He goes 3-0 in a post season WS winning year and it'll have been worth it. Now that he has the bats ( as if that were an excuse) he really should rip off a great year. If he's going to go 11-9 with a mid 3 ERA he's Jose Quintana at 4x the price. We wil see.


I wish Quintana would go 11-9.

No run support .

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 Post subject: Re: Cubs vs Reds
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 8:22 am 
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badrogue17 wrote:
It's all relative . He goes 3-0 in a post season WS winning year and it'll have been worth it. Now that he has the bats ( as if that were an excuse) he really should rip off a great year. If he's going to go 11-9 with a mid 3 ERA and a bad post season he's Jose Quintana at 4x the price. We wil see.


I look at it as opportunity cost. What other assets could you have had with that money? Price, Zimmerman, Cueto, etc? I would like a guy that could throw over to first.... :)

But sure, if he is a playoff hero, then the price is well worth it. Until such time, I will remain a skeptic. At least the Cubs are trying.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubs vs Reds
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 8:28 am 
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badrogue17 wrote:
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
badrogue17 wrote:
It's all relative . He goes 3-0 in a post season WS winning year and it'll have been worth it. Now that he has the bats ( as if that were an excuse) he really should rip off a great year. If he's going to go 11-9 with a mid 3 ERA he's Jose Quintana at 4x the price. We wil see.


I wish Quintana would go 11-9.

No run support .


I got into it with some dumb kid in a Sox group on Facebook the other day because I was bored when the Board was down. He couldn't make any arguments and just kept insulting me and linking articles from Hardball Times and Fangraphs with the popular modern narrative that "W/L record is meaningless". I asked him if he really thought I hadn't read all those articles before. "Does it seem like this is the first time I've had this argument?" :lol: I can make his argument better than he can if I want to. I asked him if he thought Javier Vazquez was better than Mark Buehrle. He started ridiculing me and a micromob chimed in. Sox fans have irrational hatred of Vazquez. They said a comparison of the two was ridiculous. I agree, but only based on W/L record. On all the numbers that are considered things a "pitcher can control" Vazquez kicks the shit out of Buehrle. Most people don't even know what the fuck they're arguing.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubs vs Reds
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 8:35 am 
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good dolphin wrote:
leashyourkids wrote:
Darkside wrote:
Someone should do a wellness check on jorr and dolphin.

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mermaids are androgynous


Then how do they reproduce?

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 Post subject: Re: Cubs vs Reds
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 8:55 am 
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leashyourkids wrote:
good dolphin wrote:
leashyourkids wrote:
Darkside wrote:
Someone should do a wellness check on jorr and dolphin.

Image


mermaids are androgynous


Then how do they reproduce?


You are not the first to ask this

Image

They are eternal so their numbers are static

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 Post subject: Re: Cubs vs Reds
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 9:02 am 
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Lester doesn't have good enough stuff to miss his spots, that's the main problem. He also only works the bottom half of the zone so everyone is looking for it down there. If he doesn't paint the corners, he gets hit hard. Arrieta can get away with it more.


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 Post subject: Re: Cubs vs Reds
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 9:16 am 
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I don't think he threw an amazing ball game but he only gave up 5 hits and 2 BB in six innings. A couple balls were squared up...but the run scoring hit in the first was one of those seeing eye singles.

I'm not too upset by the way he pitched. It was made worse by the fact the Cubs were no hit through six.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubs vs Reds
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 9:55 am 
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Man, Cubs fans a fickle. Lester pitched just fine. He is off to a good start, which is great news for the Cubs.


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 Post subject: Re: Cubs vs Reds
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 10:11 am 
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Big Chicagoan wrote:
Man, Cubs fans a fickle. Lester pitched just fine. He is off to a good start, which is great news for the Cubs.



You think Cub fans are bad? There were Sox fans in my Facebook group that wanted to cut Frazier after he went 0fer in the first game.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubs vs Reds
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 10:14 am 
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Big Chicagoan wrote:
Man, Cubs fans a fickle. Lester pitched just fine. He is off to a good start, which is great news for the Cubs.


Yes Lester is fine, average to good. But his body of work with the Cubs does not justify the money spent on him. That is my concern.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubs vs Reds
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 10:18 am 
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denisdman wrote:
badrogue17 wrote:
It's all relative . He goes 3-0 in a post season WS winning year and it'll have been worth it. Now that he has the bats ( as if that were an excuse) he really should rip off a great year. If he's going to go 11-9 with a mid 3 ERA and a bad post season he's Jose Quintana at 4x the price. We wil see.


I look at it as opportunity cost. What other assets could you have had with that money? Price, Zimmerman, Cueto, etc? I would like a guy that could throw over to first.... :)

But sure, if he is a playoff hero, then the price is well worth it. Until such time, I will remain a skeptic. At least the Cubs are trying.






I never wanted Lester, they got cheap and wouldn't buck up for Scherzer.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubs vs Reds
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 10:22 am 
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312player wrote:
denisdman wrote:
badrogue17 wrote:
It's all relative . He goes 3-0 in a post season WS winning year and it'll have been worth it. Now that he has the bats ( as if that were an excuse) he really should rip off a great year. If he's going to go 11-9 with a mid 3 ERA and a bad post season he's Jose Quintana at 4x the price. We wil see.


I look at it as opportunity cost. What other assets could you have had with that money? Price, Zimmerman, Cueto, etc? I would like a guy that could throw over to first.... :)

But sure, if he is a playoff hero, then the price is well worth it. Until such time, I will remain a skeptic. At least the Cubs are trying.






I never wanted Lester, they got cheap and wouldn't buck up for Scherzer.


Barring the first few months of last season, Scherezer has been worse than Lester.


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 Post subject: Re: Cubs vs Reds
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 10:23 am 
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David Ross has a .417 OBP


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 Post subject: Re: Cubs vs Reds
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 10:41 am 
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Big Chicagoan wrote:
312player wrote:
denisdman wrote:
badrogue17 wrote:
It's all relative . He goes 3-0 in a post season WS winning year and it'll have been worth it. Now that he has the bats ( as if that were an excuse) he really should rip off a great year. If he's going to go 11-9 with a mid 3 ERA and a bad post season he's Jose Quintana at 4x the price. We wil see.


I look at it as opportunity cost. What other assets could you have had with that money? Price, Zimmerman, Cueto, etc? I would like a guy that could throw over to first.... :)

But sure, if he is a playoff hero, then the price is well worth it. Until such time, I will remain a skeptic. At least the Cubs are trying.






I never wanted Lester, they got cheap and wouldn't buck up for Scherzer.


Barring the first few months of last season, Scherezer has been worse than Lester.




Few months is half a season, Scherzer had a better year than Lester last year and he will again this year.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubs vs Reds
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 10:53 am 
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Max had a 2.79 ERA and sub 1 whip last year...276 k's. It's not that close based on raw numbers.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubs vs Reds
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 11:14 am 
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Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
Big Chicagoan wrote:
Man, Cubs fans a fickle. Lester pitched just fine. He is off to a good start, which is great news for the Cubs.



You think Cub fans are bad? There were Sox fans in my Facebook group that wanted to cut Frazier after he went 0fer in the first game.


I've been kind of down on Sale since a little after the ASB. I don't feel he is dominating like he should and giving up a lot of cheap runs. I also think his response to every adverse situation is only to try to throw the ball harder.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubs vs Reds
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 11:36 am 
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good dolphin wrote:
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
Big Chicagoan wrote:
Man, Cubs fans a fickle. Lester pitched just fine. He is off to a good start, which is great news for the Cubs.



You think Cub fans are bad? There were Sox fans in my Facebook group that wanted to cut Frazier after he went 0fer in the first game.


I've been kind of down on Sale since a little after the ASB. I don't feel he is dominating like he should and giving up a lot of cheap runs. I also think his response to every adverse situation is only to try to throw the ball harder.


I agree. Sale obviously has the tools to be a great pitcher. But this isn't the steroid era where you can expect your team to pound the shit out of the other guy. These games are often decided by one run off a tight spot in the sixth or seventh. The Sox seem to have a lot of guys that make a bad pitch in those big spots much more often than one would like, including Sale.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubs vs Reds
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 11:46 am 
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We'll take Sale.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubs vs Reds
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 11:47 am 
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IMU wrote:
We'll take Sale.



He's locked up for awhile. Maybe we'll take Arrieta.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubs vs Reds
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 11:49 am 
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Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
IMU wrote:
We'll take Sale.



He's locked up for awhile. Maybe we'll take Arrieta.

I'm willing to offer fair value for what you've identified as a pitcher that makes bad pitches in important situations.

McKinney, Johnson, Sands and another Not-Top-30 Prospect of your choice.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubs vs Reds
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 11:51 am 
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Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
IMU wrote:
We'll take Sale.



He's locked up for awhile.

Rocky Marriage there. Divorce?


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 Post subject: Re: Cubs vs Reds
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 12:07 pm 
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I would be willing to trade Baez for Sale.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubs vs Reds
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 12:13 pm 
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leashyourkids wrote:
I would be willing to trade Baez for Sale.

Save him for the Trout deal.


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 Post subject: Re: Cubs vs Reds
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 1:10 pm 
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rogers park bryan wrote:
David Ross has a .417 OBP

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