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PostPosted: Mon Jun 06, 2016 9:59 am 
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http://www.chicagomag.com/city-life/May-2016/Well-Off-Millennials-Are-Flooding-Chicagos-Rental-Market/

My commute to work takes me down Milwaukee Avenue through Logan Square and Wicker Park. If you haven’t been there recently, that stretch is practically one long construction zone, in part due to new apartment-building construction. There’s L, for instance, a mixed-use development with a 200-space bike room, a bike-maintenance station, and 120 units that start at $1,575 for a junior one-bedroom and go up to $3,900 for a three-bed. (When the transit-oriented development at 1611 West Division went up in 2013, its 99 apartments went for $1,495 to $3,295.) The Aldi at Milwaukee and Leavitt, next door to the 606, just came down for a 95-unit building due later this year. Logan Square’s “twin towers” will add 213 units.

It’s a lot of new apartments, and if neighborhood trends hold, they won’t be cheap. So, who’s renting these?

Lots of people, it turns out. DePaul’s Institute of Housing Studies has a new report on Cook County’s rental market, and there’s been a dramatic change in recent years among its renters. Here are the top five groups, broken down by age and average median income (AMI), in terms of the raw number of renters. (For reference, Cook County’s average median income in 2010-2014 is $54,828.)

Renters between the ages of 25-34, making between 120 and 200 percent of the area median income—$74,000 to $123,000 in 2014—are now the biggest demographic in the county rental market.

In 2007, that demographic didn’t even make the top five; it consisted of 26,532 renters. That number more than doubled, adding an additional 27,902 middle/upper-middle class renters. Over the same period, renters making 200 percent or more of the area median income nearly doubled, rising from 10,809 in 2007 to 20,056.

And as the new developments suggest, many of those new renters are moving into relatively large apartment complexes.

The supply of units in buildings of five units or more increased by over 82,000 from 2007 to 2014. The increase in single-unit rentals also increased by more than 40,000. What stagnated? The classic Chicago two- and four-flats. Daniel Kay Hertz has written a great deal about this—how medium-density two- and four-flat rentals are being deconverted into luxury multi-unit buildings housing fewer people, or into expensive single-family homes:

But because Chicago’s zoning code fits so snugly over its neighborhoods outside of downtown – so snugly, in fact, that maximum allowed densities are frequently much lower than what already exists – builders have not been able to add much new housing. Instead, they maximize their profits by turning two-flats into luxury two-flats, or into mini-mansions for a single family. As a result, as places like Lincoln Park get more desirable than they’ve ever been, fewer people are able to live there, and its population remains about 40 percent below its peak, depriving the rest of the city of whole heaps of tax money that we might be able to spend on schools, roads, transit, and so on.

I watched this happen on my own block, when I lived on the border of Humboldt Park and Ukrainian Village; at one point, we had simultaneous deconversions from multi-unit buildings to single-family homes going on next door and two doors down. A third was happening kitty-corner to us on the next block. As Chris Hagan reported for WBEZ in March, West Town, Lake View, North Center, Lincoln Park, and Logan Square were vast outliers in terms of combined demolitions and new construction; it’s enough that planners and politicians are concerned about how decreasing density could affect commercial activity in thriving, wealthy neighborhoods.

And Hagan echoed what Hertz wrote:

In addition to demand for access to good elementary schools, there are legal reasons behind the transformation from multi-unit buildings to single-family homes: There’s little to stop a developer or homeowner who wants to deconvert.

The Chicago zoning code allows developers to build single-family homes in any residential area, but adding units requires city approval. That increases costs and complexities for any developer wanting to add density.

It’s not just zoning, though. There are more basic financial reasons why developers are inclined to build larger buildings and skip the two- and four-flats that have historically made up so much of the city’s rental infrastructure.

“From the financial side, particularly for a rental two-to-four, it’s not an easy financial thing to do … in terms of getting financing together, in terms of how you acquire the capital," says Geoff Smith, director of the Institute of Housing Studies. "The way it all shakes out is that it’s far more efficient and far more profitable to do big deals or smaller deals. The two-to-four-unit buildings that are new development are mostly condos.”

Like so much with housing, it goes back to the financial crisis, he explains.

“The default rates on two-to-four [flats] were much higher, because a vacancy on one of those units can be 25 percent, and if you’re relying on that income to pay your mortgage, it makes it a much riskier proposition. During the financial crisis, and even still, the underwriting got much tighter on those types of properties,” Smith says.

More difficult, expensive underwriting favors larger projects, but there are other financial incentives as well.

“When you get to the five-plus unit side of things, you’re in the multi-family, more of a commercial-lending universe,” Smith says. “And from a commercial-lending perspective, if you’re making a loan under like three million dollars, it just becomes really expensive to underwrite, because it’s the same price to underwrite a one-million-dollar loan as it is to underwrite a five-million-dollar loan, effectively, so lenders are just going to underwrite that five-million-dollar loan, because they get more fees from that. The servicing is more lucrative. So when you look at the lending trends, the financing is really going to these larger deals.”

The financial crisis also reduced the number of lenders who were more inclined to finance lower-density rental projects....


There's more of the article if you click the link.

Crazy to think Logan/Ukrainian/Humboldt are quickly becoming Chad/Trixies havens. The article states the $75K - 125K income segment has grown to support the increasing inventory but I still don't understand the insatiable demand. Well, actually I do, it just makes zero financial sense.

Rule of thumb is a max 25%-30% of take-home-pay should be allocated toward housing/rent. To support the 2K+ rents these units are going for you're looking at a minimum between $80K-$96K of take home. The math just doesn't add up at all when you factor funding retirement, savings, living expenses etc.

This has to be fueled by a "Keeping Up with the Chad/Trixie" fever. My guess is the allure of living in the "happening" parts of city has influenced Yuppies/Couples' choices into forgoing sound long-term financial decisions.


Last edited by Kirkwood on Mon Jun 06, 2016 10:00 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 06, 2016 10:00 am 
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i love how the mortgage on my house is less than what i would pay for a "junior one-bedroom" :lol:


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 06, 2016 10:12 am 
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Bagels wrote:
i love how the mortgage on my house is less than what i would pay for a "junior one-bedroom" :lol:

It's insane. And you know these people aren't just staying home firing up Netflix.

Crossfit, Brunch, Parson's etc. Shit adds up.

Living it up is awesome. I want to know how they swing it. Factoring all taxes/benefits and 401K I'm taking 56% of gross pay.

High earners are fortunate Social Security hits a ceiling just over $100K but the math still doesn't make sense.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 06, 2016 10:20 am 
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Just before Oregon I lived w 2 other guys on Cortland and Campbell for $900/month 3 bed. Now that same apartment would be closer to the $900 a piece than the old $300 share.

I just cannot understand where this demand comes from. Chicago is a nice city and I love it, but that's because its home. There's a lot of really aggravating bullshit about living here that's convinced me to move once already, and if it wasn't for my personal connection to the people here I wouldn't have come back.

People from Iowa, Michigan, Ohio etc. that are flooding into these neighborhoods (judging by the license plates) dont have that. So why come here? Why not NYC where people are less xenophobic and tribal, or LA for better weather... paying $1000/month for these neighborhoods is fucking insane.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 06, 2016 10:24 am 
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America wrote:
Why not NYC where people are less xenophobic and tribal

Only because everyone else there is from Iowa themselves. You think the East Coast can't beat us in xenophobia and tribalism?

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 06, 2016 10:27 am 
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They are flooding in from Big 10 schools, just as they have for years. Young, single , disposable income, no car a lot of times. My wife does leasing. Perceived amenities far outweigh anything resembling value. Have you been in a downtown office west of Franklin lately? They all look like a Dave and Busters.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 06, 2016 10:33 am 
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America wrote:
Just before Oregon I lived w 2 other guys on Cortland and Campbell for $900/month 3 bed. Now that same apartment would be closer to the $900 a piece than the old $300 share.

I just cannot understand where this demand comes from. Chicago is a nice city and I love it, but that's because its home. There's a lot of really aggravating bullshit about living here that's convinced me to move once already, and if it wasn't for my personal connection to the people here I wouldn't have come back.

People from Iowa, Michigan, Ohio etc. that are flooding into these neighborhoods (judging by the license plates) dont have that. So why come here? Why not NYC where people are less xenophobic and tribal, or LA for better weather... paying $1000/month for these neighborhoods is fucking insane.


boom in tech and corporate jobs

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 06, 2016 10:38 am 
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Bagels wrote:
i love how the mortgage on my house is less than what i would pay for a "junior one-bedroom" :lol:


Some people say that the financing on a mortgage is still too tight for a lot of people and that people don't want to be bogged down with home ownership. It seems to me that those people haven't thought things out very clearly.

The city wants density for a number of reasons. The market wants density. The developers are responding to this. At some point rents will be too (damn) high and home ownership will become more attractive. The flagging demand will draw rentals down and the development world will adjust accordingly.

I wonder if developers are being smart about making these 600 sf apartments convertible into larger condo units, because that correction is going to happen at some point.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 06, 2016 10:43 am 
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Kirkwood wrote:
Bagels wrote:
i love how the mortgage on my house is less than what i would pay for a "junior one-bedroom" :lol:

It's insane. And you know these people aren't just staying home firing up Netflix.

Crossfit, Brunch, Parson's etc. Shit adds up.

Living it up is awesome. I want to know how they swing it. Factoring all taxes/benefits and 401K I'm taking 56% of gross pay.

High earners are fortunate Social Security hits a ceiling just over $100K but the math still doesn't make sense.


Sounds like my daughter. Her and her husband work downtown so they live downtown. She just sold her 4 year old car because she hardly uses it. She gets her groceries from Peapod and uses a zipcar when needed.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 06, 2016 10:50 am 
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Our city center is far less dense than those across the world. There is plenty of room for more.

Chicago was pretty much population neutral, which was bad. However, population trended a lot younger and the city core increased substantially in population, which is good

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 06, 2016 10:55 am 
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The wife and I rent. Reason being I cannot see us buying a condo in the city for 350K+ that the area we live in go for. The wife works in the city and I work from home so we only need one car.

We are just biding our time until we move out to the burbs and get a house etc. May as well do it while we can, until we start popping out babies. We live comfortably and put quite a bit into savings.

We are reaching a breaking point when it comes to rent though. Starting to not make much sense where the rents have jumped to (More than doubled since we moved to the city). This will probably be our last lease.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 06, 2016 10:58 am 
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Given registration sticker scam I bet car ownership raw numbers could be found. Though, I wonder if ownership really has decline because for every "I sold my guy" person there are two car households. All my friends except one are two car households. There's a handful of people in my office who commute from the city. I did for a year and it sucked ass so back to the burbs I went.

I could understand not wanting a car if you live RN/NN/GC and work downtown but I couldn't. Car = freedom

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 06, 2016 11:01 am 
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America wrote:
People from Iowa, Michigan, Ohio etc. that are flooding into these neighborhoods (judging by the license plates) dont have that. So why come here? Why not NYC where people are less xenophobic and tribal, or LA for better weather... paying $1000/month for these neighborhoods is fucking insane.
Because it is twice or three times more expensive there and you can drive home rather than fly home for the holidays.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 06, 2016 11:02 am 
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good dolphin wrote:
Our city center is far less dense than those across the world. There is plenty of room for more.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 06, 2016 11:08 am 
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Boilermaker Rick wrote:
America wrote:
People from Iowa, Michigan, Ohio etc. that are flooding into these neighborhoods (judging by the license plates) dont have that. So why come here? Why not NYC where people are less xenophobic and tribal, or LA for better weather... paying $1000/month for these neighborhoods is fucking insane.
Because it is twice or three times more expensive there and you can drive home rather than fly home for the holidays.

Most of them dont own cars though (I know this contradicts my license plate theory, but that's just a straw-polling method).


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 06, 2016 11:11 am 
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It's mildly interesting that Chicago doesn't draw in a lot of Minnesotans. They seem much happier to stay put around the Cities than their Wisconsin/Michigan peers.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 06, 2016 11:19 am 
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Curious Hair wrote:
It's mildly interesting that Chicago doesn't draw in a lot of Minnesotans. They seem much happier to stay put around the Cities than their Wisconsin/Michigan peers.

Very true! I've ran in the Big 10K (Yes, I'm one of these people) and they hand out a shirt representing the school of your choice in the goodie bag. I saw more Penn State runners than Minnesota which I found surprising.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 06, 2016 11:26 am 
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Minnesotans can be pretty clannish, in both my experience and my sister's: if you're among people who grew up together or even close to together, you're a ghost. St. Louis is like this too with their first question always being where you went to [high] school, but at least Minnesota isn't a shithole.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 06, 2016 11:37 am 
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Don't these fucking people have student loans?

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 06, 2016 12:02 pm 
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formerlyknownas wrote:
Don't these fucking people have student loans?


In state tuitions at Big Ten schools (other than our shithole Illinois, of course) are pretty reasonable. Add grants and scholarships and you can get out the door at under 10K per year.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 06, 2016 12:46 pm 
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good dolphin wrote:
Bagels wrote:
The city wants density for a number of reasons. The market wants density. The developers are responding to this. At some point rents will be too (damn) high and home ownership will become more attractive. The flagging demand will draw rentals down and the development world will adjust accordingly.

Lotta bored NIMBYs keep themselves engaged by fighting high density housing. Pretty interesting to see growing number of multi-family buildings knocked down to construct their suburban oasis within a city neighborhood.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 06, 2016 1:41 pm 
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Kirkwood wrote:
Pretty interesting to see growing number of multi-family buildings knocked down to construct their suburban oasis within a city neighborhood.

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 07, 2016 1:00 pm 
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http://chicago.eater.com/2016/6/1/11797882/chicago-dive-bar-rescue-feature
Quote:
"The dirty secret of operating a new business where an old business used to be is, if you're going to change the culture, it offends everyone who used to be there," Christopher admits. "Step one is change what you carry and raise your prices, because a lot of times a failed bar or restaurant caters to a clientele that doesn't necessarily drive a profitable enterprise." A new crowd of regulars, which is made up of many former customers, frequents the bar that feels like it's been there for decades.

So what is the appeal in drinking in a bar that feels like a spit-shined rusty nickel? Christopher believes, "It's a craving to authenticity, which is a hallmark of this generation, because the things that are new in our time are, for the most part, pretty inhuman. Technological and scientific advancements are where it's at, but holding an iPhone is not the same as holding an Old Fashioned."

Oh brother


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 07, 2016 1:16 pm 
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Kirkwood wrote:
http://chicago.eater.com/2016/6/1/11797882/chicago-dive-bar-rescue-feature
Quote:
"The dirty secret of operating a new business where an old business used to be is, if you're going to change the culture, it offends everyone who used to be there," Christopher admits. "Step one is change what you carry and raise your prices, because a lot of times a failed bar or restaurant caters to a clientele that doesn't necessarily drive a profitable enterprise." A new crowd of regulars, which is made up of many former customers, frequents the bar that feels like it's been there for decades.

So what is the appeal in drinking in a bar that feels like a spit-shined rusty nickel? Christopher believes, "It's a craving to authenticity, which is a hallmark of this generation, because the things that are new in our time are, for the most part, pretty inhuman. Technological and scientific advancements are where it's at, but holding an iPhone is not the same as holding an Old Fashioned."

Oh brother


Damn, first the guy who got offended by some wanting to stick to taproom/package store vs. a "slashie", now this. This generation of "look at me's" may be worse than the group that first got the yuppie label in the 80's.

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 07, 2016 1:22 pm 
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I have no idea what the guy is trying to say.

An iPhone is a telephone and an Old Fashioned is a cocktail.

They are indeed not the same. So, I guess I agree?


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 07, 2016 2:09 pm 
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Kirkwood wrote:
I have no idea what the guy is trying to say.

An iPhone is a telephone and an Old Fashioned is a cocktail.

They are indeed not the same. So, I guess I agree?



Dive bars aren’t dives at all. They really should be called “local bars.” What happens is dive bars get categorized as dirty bars, old bars, uncared-for bars. That’s not what a dive bar is. A dive bar is an old historic bar.

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 07, 2016 2:12 pm 
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Jon Taffer wrote:
Kirkwood wrote:
I have no idea what the guy is trying to say.

An iPhone is a telephone and an Old Fashioned is a cocktail.

They are indeed not the same. So, I guess I agree?



Dive bars aren’t dives at all. They really should be called “local bars.” What happens is dive bars get categorized as dirty bars, old bars, uncared-for bars. That’s not what a dive bar is. A dive bar is an old historic bar.


there's a lot of pressure here, this better be a good mult


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 07, 2016 2:13 pm 
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Jon Taffer wrote:
Kirkwood wrote:
I have no idea what the guy is trying to say.

An iPhone is a telephone and an Old Fashioned is a cocktail.

They are indeed not the same. So, I guess I agree?



Dive bars aren’t dives at all. They really should be called “local bars.” What happens is dive bars get categorized as dirty bars, old bars, uncared-for bars. That’s not what a dive bar is. A dive bar is an old historic bar.


Hey Taffer,
The Lake Marie Lodge tried to call you for some follow-up, but THEY'RE OUT OF BUSINESS.
Rule #1:
If you're going to name a bar after it's attached body of water, try getting the lake name correct. It was on CHANNEL LAKE you dumb fuck. Embrace THAT solution.

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 07, 2016 2:15 pm 
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wdelaney72 wrote:
Jon Taffer wrote:
Kirkwood wrote:
I have no idea what the guy is trying to say.

An iPhone is a telephone and an Old Fashioned is a cocktail.

They are indeed not the same. So, I guess I agree?



Dive bars aren’t dives at all. They really should be called “local bars.” What happens is dive bars get categorized as dirty bars, old bars, uncared-for bars. That’s not what a dive bar is. A dive bar is an old historic bar.


Hey Taffer,
The Lake Marie Lodge tried to call you for some follow-up, but THEY'RE OUT OF BUSINESS.
Rule #1:
If you're going to name a bar after it's attached body of water, try getting the lake name correct. It was on CHANNEL LAKE you dumb fuck. Embrace THAT solution.


I knew I should have added another butt funnel!

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 07, 2016 2:20 pm 
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wdelaney72 wrote:
Jon Taffer wrote:
Kirkwood wrote:
I have no idea what the guy is trying to say.

An iPhone is a telephone and an Old Fashioned is a cocktail.

They are indeed not the same. So, I guess I agree?



Dive bars aren’t dives at all. They really should be called “local bars.” What happens is dive bars get categorized as dirty bars, old bars, uncared-for bars. That’s not what a dive bar is. A dive bar is an old historic bar.


Hey Taffer,
The Lake Marie Lodge tried to call you for some follow-up, but THEY'RE OUT OF BUSINESS.
Rule #1:
If you're going to name a bar after it's attached body of water, try getting the lake name correct. It was on CHANNEL LAKE you dumb fuck. Embrace THAT solution.


:lol:

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