No JORR is right.

http://www.pewforum.org/2013/04/30/the- ... -morality/

Read it and (literally) weep. Only 31% of Egyptians, historically a less dogmatic sampling of Arab muslims, believe honor killings are immoral.

This irritates me almost beyond words.

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There are only two examples of infinity: The universe and human stupidity and I'm not sure about the universe.

An emphatic +1

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There are only two examples of infinity: The universe and human stupidity and I'm not sure about the universe.

In ONLY Iraq and Afghanistan do people say that they are justified.

_________________
Be well

GO BEARS!!!

Maybe for men, but in South Asia and MENA only in Tunisia (the only Arab Spring country with a secular government) and Morocco (delusions of EU) do a majority of Muslims say honor killings are never justifiable for women.

Only in Iraq and Afghanistan do the majority say honor killings are okay for women and only in Afghanistan do the majority say that it is okay for men. Did you read the link that you posted?

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Be well

GO BEARS!!!

Jorr, you just directly compared vegan fan to a KKK member. I have no interest in using the term bigot here because I don't believe you are one, but that should give you pause.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

There is only one acceptable answer to a question about honor killings, and that answer is never. Anything less shows tacit endorsement. How do you feel about child rape? Do you think its "never acceptable" or "rarely acceptable"? What would you think of someone who answered "rarely acceptable"? Wouldn't that answer seem a little suspicious?

The fact that the margins in countries like Malaysia and Turkey are so slim makes it even worse.

People choose to believe in a religion. It isnt like being gay or being black, either that garbage appeals to you or not. I'm not bigoted for my dislike of the American Nazi Party. I'm not bigoted for my dislike of Reagan Republicans. I'm not bigoted for my dislike of Islam.

I don't know veganfan outside of this board. He may not even be Muslim. He's admitted he's not vegan. Regardless, I don't know his beliefs and I'm not going to ask him. But how would you feel if he said he supported killing gays because his religion demanded it?

Look, let's step away and leave Islam out of it for a minute so it's not as emotional. I think part of it is that Islam gets a pass because it's venerable and one of the world's "great" religions. But imagine that Boilermaker Rick and I organized a new religion that had all the principles of Islam. I believe you would think we were bad people, if not batshit crazy.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

To some degree. Their own silly overpopulation is also fueling their problems.

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If that were really true wouldn't Christians in these countries blowing themselves up at similar rates?

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

Uganda.

That's an entirely different issue. You and JORR said MOST Muslims believe that honor killings are okay. You said JORR was right and posted a link that proved both of you all were wrong. Afghanistan and Iraq were the only places where the majority found them to be acceptable.

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Be well

GO BEARS!!!

Some people think all religions are crazy. No one is giving Islam a pass. Islam isn't guilty of committing any crimes. You and others just always appear to be eager to label billions of people as evil. Your views of Muslims just appear to be odd considering your views on damn near everything else.

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Be well

GO BEARS!!!

If someone finds honor killings rarely acceptable that implies that there are instances where they find honor killings accpetable. It's a binary answer, either you vote NO on honor killings (aka never) or you vote YES on honor killings (aka rarely and up). That is the reason the researches arranged the table to highlight the negative, they may provide provide 5 degrees of tolerance for honor killings but that is only to coax out the true feelings. Only one of the 5 answers is correct. If the question were posed "True or False: Honor killings are unacceptable under any circumstances" the only MENA countries that would answer 'true' according to that research are Tunisia and Morocco.

This isn't really an emotional issue to me personally. Pittmike was right earlier when he was criticizing a lot of us for oversimplifying it. I know I have. But I can't think of a more simplistic response than "All Muslims are bad and clearly cannot exist in a Western Democracy." The evidence overwhelmingly contradicts that.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

You cannot be this blind the situation in Europe right now.

Islam is the inspiration for these crimes though. You're always leaping to deny that. And you are giving Islam a pass. There's horrible things in that belief system. If it were a non-religious organization that held such views you'd call it a hate group. And if a Christian shot up that bar while holding a Bible, you best believe Sarah Silverman and a lot of other liberals would have no problem bashing Christianity.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

I wouldn't.

_________________
Be well

GO BEARS!!!

I guess it depends on who you want to call a Muslim. If they believe in the Koran and the Hadith, they can't fit into Western society, at least not a Western society that you and I want to live in. If they celebrate some benign customs handed down through their religion and call themselves Muslims, I have no issue with them and I'm sure nobody else would either. Except leash who hates anyone who believes in God.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

The bolded part is obviously a true statement. The millions of Muslims living peacefully here overwhelmingly outnumber whatever examples of violent Muslims living here you want to throw out there. If you try to argue the bolded part, it's a pretty clear sign you are delusional on this issue.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

I would suggest that you actually read the link you posted. If you did you may discover that with the exception of Afghanistan and Iraq for women and Afghanistan for men the majority of people voted NEVER in every other country.

_________________
Be well

GO BEARS!!!

Here in the United States, I mean until about 48 hours ago sure. That's because being Muslim is almost taboo in America after the towers fell and the FBI is constantly 10 feet up their ass 24/7. Also, Muslims make up about 1% of the American population. Not that we really know exactly what is going on in Dearborn, Highland Park or Hamtramck because of how insulated those communities are. They're like little baby Molenbeeks, and we saw not too long about what little baby Molenbeeks grow up to be.

Find the countries in South Asia and MENA where the number under the column for women exceeds 50.

More FEAR and HATE.

_________________
Be well

GO BEARS!!!

Hey, if you want to wake up one morning to the problems France and Germany are dealing with where the government has completely lost control of entire districts of cities and rape gangs prowl with impunity then fine. You want to be so exhausted of options like the UK, where in 10 they are going to vote whether they should break with the EU (the American equivalent of this is Texas seceding)? How about Italy, which has lost completely control of its martime borders.

Europe is the USA's future if we keep trying to be all polite and liberal about everyone and everything. There is definite reason to be afraid.

This is a prime example of you not even attempting to look at this objectively. Even including the Orlando shooting, the evidence overwhelmingly contradicts the narrative you are trying to create.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

This is the part that always gets buried, and is very true. The US has taken sides in foreign political battles for decades...that creates enemies and consequences. But it's much easier to just say "They hate America because of our Freedoms and values". Horeseshit.


Religion is and always has been different flavor of Governing. There's no shortage of corruption, scandal, greed, and lies tied to Religious organizations. Doesn't mean I don't believe in God or have faith. I'm just done with Religion.

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Who would be the 3rd wise man?

And would Rick's sermon be a non-stop argument?