What a fantastic article.

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Interesting read. Dunno if it means much re: 2016 election. If the hillbillies of Southern Ohio can put down the smack long enough to register and show up to vote, Trump might win Ohio (and by winning Ohio...etc). Dubious proposition. But I guess they managed it for the primary, as Repubs had something like 10 million more primary voters this time than during 2012/2008

Comments are usually a scary read for these articles. That article's comments are better than most.

People will eventually have to stop pointing fingers and start to work together.

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I disagree with some parts of this article. If the white working class were truly as concerned about economic issues they wouldn't support Trump. Trump has made a career out of screwing over the little guy and has demonstrated that he really has a disdain for poor people. His everyman approach rings rather hollow when you look at his history.

Secondly and more important to me is the fact that there has always been tensions between working class whites, immigrants, and African Americans. Competition for jobs has been at the forefront but so has xenophobia and racism. This didn't just start. The system of slavery was maintained as much by poor whites as it was by slaveowners. Same for segregation.

If it were anot economic as opposed to race issue then you would see a consolidation of the poor white and poor black vote. There never has been. Poor working class whites began voting Republican in droves once the Civil Rights Act was passed. That too was no accident either.

I don't say this to suggest that it doesn't play any role but if it was as prevalent as the author suggested they would not be aligning with Trump. He is hardly the champion of the little guy.

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Very true. But as the Yalie from Appalachia points out in JORR's linked article--the resentment between the East coast elites and his people back home is reciprocal. Anyone who manages to pull themselves up out of the morass of welfare and opiates back home in southern Ohio is given grief for their success, "too big for their britches".

Kasich turned down the VP offer and I think that's killing Trump big time.

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favrefan said:"Chris Coghlan isn't gonna pay your rent, Jimmy."

VP slot + Trump's kids told Kasich he'd be de facto El Presidente--while Donald engaged in twitter wars with low-rated cable news show hosts.

Kasich as nominee (not necessarily as VP) would be thumping Hillary in Ohio, fwiw:

http://www.weeklystandard.com/poll-trum ... le/2003924

Good stuff. I can relate in a lot of ways to the author. Having grown up in a single mother household and certainly in a working class family after she remarried, lots of that stuff hits home.

I like that agency idea for drug addiction. If we allow people to believe they are helpless to fight the "disease", then they cannot ever be healed.

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Hawaii (fuck) You

When we went to the Trump rally early this year I really expected to be in a crowd of racists and bigots just based off of most of the online comments I was reading. I was completely wrong. You can question the intelligence of MANY of his supporters but based on what I observed most were not racist at all. Donald Trump speaks to them in a way no one has. He provides them with hope that they haven't had in a while. They believe he can make their lives better and that is the ONLY thing they care about.

When we finally got inside we were having problems finding seats. I spotted some next to 2 white guys in their mid 30's to early 40's. These men were probably the type that someone would call a redneck or a hillbilly. These men were people that MANY would suspect of being racist Trump supporters. I walked down and asked if someone was sitting in the seats next to them. They said no so I sat down and called JORR and RR down to join me. I asked them if they had any extra campaign signs and they gave me a couple and I started having a conversation with them.

These men left home before midnight to get to the rally. They drove 5 hours from Wisconsin and waited outside for 8 more hours to see Trump. I was shocked that anyone would do that.

It didn't take long for me to understand why they went to those extremes to get there and why they were supporting Trump. These men have been forgotten by our government and by our politicians. They are very prideful men who want to work hard and provide for the families like MANY of us. They don't want handouts or any government assistance they just want a decent job. Due to all the factories closing and automation taking MANY jobs away these jobs don't exist like they did for their fathers and grandfathers.

They see a guy like Trump (who they consider to be very successful) talk in ways that most politicians don't. Saying things that their friends and family say all the time. It's like he is providing a voice for the voiceless. When he tells them he's going to bring their jobs back they believe him. Like most desperate people they don't ask how. They didn't care about his dog whistling or bigoted comments. They just believe he is the answer to their problems.

Those 2 men were like MANY people we saw that day. They were desperate for positive change but definitely not racist.

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Be well

GO BEARS!!!

Well said.

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I think our system and all of the bullshit propaganda has created this environment of division. Poor whites and minorities see each other as enemies by design. Reality is they have more in common than any other class of people.

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Be well

GO BEARS!!!

AMEN

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cool write-up, thanks for translating/tl;dr'ing JORR's link to the reality of the Trump campaign.

i think these supporters are going to find that Trump not only doesn't have any answers or solutions to these problems but he's about the worst choice to deal with the coming economic tsunami of mass automation; soon the Wal-Mart and McDonald's and truck driving jobs will be gone. There's no protectionist trade policy to stave off the impact of automation.

Listening to and reading economists looking at the expected changes and impact on the US economy over the next generation: whether they lean left, right or moderate, they all concur that some sort of enhanced social welfare system will need to be implemented in the US to deal with the economic dislocation caused by automation--guaranteed income? who knows. But the jobs are going away for good this time; and won't be replaced by lower wage big box retail or service industry or housing bubble construction jobs.

That is the primary reason that I'm voting for Hillary to be honest. I don't want another ideologue type in the White House. I don't want another person that thinks that they somehow have a mandate even when they don't. I don't want another person that is completely intolerant and incapable of seeing that there may be another point of view. I don't want a person that thinks that they are selling out the party if they work with the other side to get legislation passed.

That is the biggest problem with politics today. It's an even bigger problem than "Wall Street". Politics has become akin to trench warfare. Each side digs in and adheres to whatever dogmatic principle that falls under their political philosophy. It's killing politics and dissenting opinions are viewed as treasonous.

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You have missed the point of the article, and of Nas' reply.

Equivocate however you want, but the fact will still remain.

You are voting for Hillary for the exact same reasons poor white people will vote for Trump. Tread lightly when painting with the broad brush of racism.

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What a fantastic article.[/quote]


I disagree with some parts of this article. If the white working class were truly as concerned about economic issues they wouldn't support Trump. Trump has made a career out of screwing over the little guy and has demonstrated that he really has a disdain for poor people. His everyman approach rings rather hollow when you look at his history.

Secondly and more important to me is the fact that there has always been tensions between working class whites, immigrants, and African Americans. Competition for jobs has been at the forefront but so has xenophobia and racism. This didn't just start. The system of slavery was maintained as much by poor whites as it was by slaveowners. Same for segregation.

If it were anot economic as opposed to race issue then you would see a consolidation of the poor white and poor black vote. There never has been. Poor working class whites began voting Republican in droves once the Civil Rights Act was passed. That too was no accident either.

I don't say this to suggest that it doesn't play any role but if it was as prevalent as the author suggested they would not be aligning with Trump. He is hardly the champion of the little guy.[/quote]


I think our system and all of the bullshit propaganda has created this environment of division. Poor whites and minorities see each other as enemies by design. Reality is they have more in common than any other class of people.[/quote]

That is the primary reason that I'm voting for Hillary to be honest. I don't want another ideologue type in the White House. I don't want another person that thinks that they somehow have a mandate even when they don't. I don't want another person that is completely intolerant and incapable of seeing that there may be another point of view. I don't want a person that thinks that they are selling out the party if they work with the other side to get legislation passed.

That is the biggest problem with politics today. It's an even bigger problem than "Wall Street". Politics has become akin to trench warfare. Each side digs in and adheres to whatever dogmatic principle that falls under their political philosophy. It's killing politics and dissenting opinions are viewed as treasonous.[/quote]


You have missed the point of the article, and of Nas' reply.

Equivocate however you want, but the fact will still remain.

You are voting for Hillary for the exact same reasons poor white people will vote for Trump. Tread lightly when painting with the broad brush of racism.[/quote]

No disrespect to Nas but he referenced two guys that he met at a Trump rally. I actually understood his point perfectly.

Donald Trump dropped the gauntlet about his politics once he spearheaded the birther movement.

As far as the article goes I disagree with it because it attempts to make the argument that working class whites are supporting Trump because of economic angst and frustration with govt business whatever. It makes no mention of racism and it doesn't surprise me either. Whenever I listen to Fox News they never mention racism as a cause either.

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Tell us again why you are voting for Hillary...

“The reason a lot of Klan members like Donald Trump is because a lot of what he believes, we believe in,” a robed man identified as the Imperial Wizard of the Rebel Brigade Knights of the Ku Klux Klan says at the top of the video, followed by images of a Confederate flag fluttering in the wind, Trump waving after a speech, and a man performing a Hitler salute at what appears to be a Trump rally.

Read more: http://www.politico.com/story/2016/08/c ... z4IMqvlZ00
Follow us: @politico on Twitter | Politico on Facebook

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I actually did already. I really don't know what is supposed to be funny either unless you think racism is something to be laughed at.

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Who are they going to support? The sneering elitist Hillary Clinton? I don't have an issue with you supporting Clinton. She's probably a marginally better choice than Trump. But your position actually seems to be that she is a great choice for president. This is a stick a gun in your mouth vote.

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Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

Pulling the race card again. Absolutely pathetic.

Hillary speaks to your fear of racism. She is definitely not an idealogue. Just the Dems version of Trump. You have far more in common with white racist hillbillies then you feel comfortable admitting. You are not fooling anyone in this thread though.

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You don't strike me as the trolling type so I won't call you on it. What is meant by the "race card" exactly? Trump has made xenophobia and racism a central part of his campaign platform. His own strategists have recognized that this is now a problem and thus are attempting to reroute somewhat.

His racism has been blatant and the fact that you deny suggests quite a bit. His xenophobia and racism should have been an automatic disqualifier but it isn't. Once again it suggests a whole lot.

People are uncomfortable admitting that racism exists even when it is right in front of them.

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Do you read what others post here? I'm saying that Hillary is being supported by you while doing the exact same thing you accuse Trump of.

Hillary's playing to the racial fears of her core constituency.

The Clinton campaign video closes with a warning that “If Trump wins, they could be running the country.”

Reminiscent of "Vote for Epton, before it's too late."

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There were 16 candidates in the field and they chose the most xenophobic and racist one of all. There were a few economic populist in the bunch.

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No she isn't. She is providing a counter argument for the B.S. that Trump has spewed since day 1. Do you forget or simply ignore the fact that he was a ringleader of the birther movement? How is she playing to anyone's fears when the guy has been sending all types of dog whistles for at least the past 4-5 years politically? You really aren't making sense?

She should make this an issue. This is the sort of crap that you get with Fox News. This dude has been spewing this garbage since the beginning of his campaign yet she is playing to someone's fears.

I'm not supporting Hillary Clinton because of racial either. You are truly out to lunch on that.

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Clinton supporters started the birther movement.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

He did not start the birther movement.

She IS playing to the racial fears of others, the same way trump appears to be.

No one has been spewing more lies and garbage than Hillary.

And I'm glad you can claim that you aren't backing Hillary for racial reasons while being damn sure that others like your self are following Trump for that reason.

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Really. Revisionism is truly grand. Next she will have been responsible for the Kennedy assassination Pearl Harbor Tet Offensive and the murder of Jimmy Hoffa.

Some people really have a hard on for her and it is really creepy and scary.

I'm going to tap out here. It's insulting to suggest that Trump's campaign is not being fueled by racism. If this is some sort of game I'd rather not play it. I take racism seriously. That's not something to joke about.

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http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2015/sep/23/donald-trump/hillary-clinton-obama-birther-fact-check/

Now go ahead and tell me that your "eye test" means politifact is wrong.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

I have to respond to this stupidity. The "appears" is an automatic disqualifier. Secondly where is your eyetest? Reading comprehension or comprehension of any sort suit you? When people think of "birthed movement" they immediately think "Clinton supporter"

Or do they think of the guy that demanded that a birth certificate be produced?

Do they think of the guy that said he had proof?


Do they think guy who said he had over a 100 private investigators looking into it?

Yeah you're they think Clinton supporter. Even if there were some that believed it he was the obvious "ringleader" along with some of the fools at Fox News.

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So politifact is wrong and ltg is right? You should start a website.

Others may have picked it up but Clinton supporters started it as Clinton basically stood by saying virtually nothing besides "I didn't tell anyone to say that!".

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!