I am with LTG on this one. I think it's a HUUUGE leap to say Hillary is equally as racist as Trump even if you believe she is racist. I don't believe Trump believes the shit he says but he knows it sales.

_________________
Be well

GO BEARS!!!

Does it make Obama racist or a supporter of Wrights comments because he failed to denounce him also? Even lied about the dude by saying he had never heard him talk like that. Sat in his church for 20 never knew he thought like that.

I still have yet to hear you address Trump's racism either. Curious Hair I will answer your question later. Got to roll.

_________________

Why do you sympathize with Trump? You're going out of your way to excuse his behavior and language but bashing Hillary for things she doesn't do.

_________________
Be well

GO BEARS!!!

Are you guys really arguing over who is MORE racist? As if there is some acceptable amount of racism? Maybe a particular group of people that it is okay to be prejudice against?

Because Trump is a clown. Anyone with a brain knows that. But to champion Hillary Clinton when the only real reason to vote for her is to avoid Trump is bad. She's a bad person and a bad candidate. The fact she is running against a scum doesn't elevate her.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

This.

Well, subsitute sells for sales.

Like MANY politicians I think Hillary will generally do what is needed to get elected. I believe there is a limit for her. That clearly isn't true for Trump. He's proven that from minute to minute he was drastically change his positions. Hillary's shifts have been like a typical politician.

_________________
Be well

GO BEARS!!!

_________________
Be well

GO BEARS!!!

She did. That's politics.

_________________
Be well

GO BEARS!!!

I'm not sure I would consider what Wright said to be racist. Obama should have denounced him though.

I addressed his racism on the same page.

_________________
You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

I'm not going to call you a racist because I don't believe a black person can be a racist within the structures and institutions of the U.S. as they exist, but you made it pretty clear in an earlier post in this thread that you have very little interest in finding common ground with poor/working class whites.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

We can judge accordingly for "politics" too.

A Trump supporter saying "That's politics" should be treated the same way.

_________________
You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

See, I disagree. I think she'd do just about anything to be president and I don't believe Trump is really interested in the job.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

Even if you believe that to be true that does not make her his equal when it comes to bigoted and racist statements.

_________________
Be well

GO BEARS!!!

What's the end game for Trump then? He either wants to win or wants to burn the country down.

_________________
Be well

GO BEARS!!!

It all may be but it isn't equal.

_________________
Be well

GO BEARS!!!

There isn't one. He never thought he'd get this far, and now he's stuck.

I believe Hillary is a monster, but I would vote for her 100 times out of 100 over Trump. I disagree with MANY who believe Trump is just a carnival barker. I don't think he believes a lot of what he says, but I do believe that his lack of restraint and thin skin are genuine. Read any number of articles written by people who know him personally.

I think people are playing with fire to assume that if he got elected, he'd be some sort of moderate. I think there's a chance the guy would start WWIII. Sure, the odds are slim, but do we really want to find out? This isn't a game with this lunatic. He's already talked numerous times about using nuclear weapons.

_________________

See, that's the thing though. We get caught up in stupid statements and ignore the real actions. The Clintons have been a disaster for black Americans. The fact that they usually say all the right shit doesn't change that.

I don't want Trump to be president. But I'm not angry at Trump. I'd never vote for him. I'm angry that the only real alternative is Clinton.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

Actually I do but when it is the white working class which supports things like birtherism and Obama's a Muslim then I have to take a step back. I think that class issues should Trump, no pun intended race issues. The history hasn't shown that and the present doesn't suggest it. I could easily cite the tensions that have arisen throughout history which suggest a reluctance to merge.

I understand and accept that they have economic frustrations but I also understand that there are racial and ethnic frustrations also. There should be a coalition given the economic similarities between both groups but the history has shown that the white working class isn't really interested. Maybe blacks aren't either but in the beginning they didn't really have a say.

Trump knew exactly what he was doing once he began to play the race card. He knew that he'd be able to garner a certain amount of voters by doing it. Recent elections had demonstrated that there was a market for racism. Not enough to win an election but enough to make it interesting.

I just found it disingenuous that the author would neglect to mention the role that race is playing in a lot of it. I could easily go and find about 20 articles which would support what I am saying. The fact that the Trump campaign is attempting to reach out to black voters is confirmation. No one thinks that they really want the black vote either. They are merely attempting to bring moderates into the tent.

_________________

MANY blacks would disagree when it comes to Bill. If you've read my posts I am not one of them. Hillary hasn't been in position to make a difference. I would say SCHIP has been HUUUGE and health care reform will make a difference.

_________________
Be well

GO BEARS!!!

No. I began to side with the Democrats because of Reagan. I was nowhere near old enough to vote but I followed politics and the racial stuff associated with his administration bothered me a lot. His distaste for Affirmative Action was off putting.

_________________

I think that's a fair statement. It's fucked up though. And I realize Trump is exploiting it. But I also think Trump's question of black voters, "What do you have to lose?" is legitimate.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

I honestly think the main differance between Trump and Clinton is Trump is not really trying to hide his warts and does not care about them when they are dragged up/ Clintons are very defensive when things don't go thier way and do more than just make no8ise about it, ie Whitewater,Vince Foster,etc etc.

I think Trump isn't going after her as hard as he could because she has the ultimate card to play on him when he does, the He is picking on me because I am a woman shit. You know she is just dying to use it. I love the new slogan, What have you got to lose. I mean it is perfect.

_________________
When I am stuck and need to figure something out I always remember the Immortal words of Socrates when he said:"I just drank what?"

What have you got to lose....JOR you make me laugh

_________________
I'm going to bounce from the spot for awhile but I will be back at some point to argue with you about this hoops stuff again. Playoffs have been great this season. See ya up the road.

I'm out.

I doubt there's a Trump supporter in that photo, Walt. Those real conservatives know a Trump win is a disaster for their movement

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

Somewhat. The only thing that I will say in the Democrat's defense is that historically (post Civil Rights Act) they have made an attempt. Republicans haven't and have instead chosen to demonize blacks. From the passage of Civil Rights Act to the implementation of the Southern Strategy, welfare queens to the repeal of affirmative action, drug laws to reduction in pell grant expenditures. Republicans have not openly sought the black vote and their only response is to always question why blacks vote Democratic. It is always done in a condescending fashion, as Trump has done.

I can provide a myriad of reasons why I vote democratic. THis is not to suggest that you will find a political utopia within the Democratic party either. I have had my issues with a number of things that they have done over the years.

I just don't think that Republicans will ever champion the issues which effect African Americans. It makes it difficult for me to vote Republican. Once you couple this with the denigration which accompanies it, then it becomes nearly impossible.

There are some Conservative principles that I agree with. That is what makes it tough. I'm not an ideologue.

_________________

I call bullshit. Illinois has one of the largest prison populations and the last time I looked that fucked up state has been run for the past 20+ years by the Democrats.

_________________
When I am stuck and need to figure something out I always remember the Immortal words of Socrates when he said:"I just drank what?"

In the words of Kris Kristofferson....Freedom's just another word for nothin' left to lose,

_________________
I'm going to bounce from the spot for awhile but I will be back at some point to argue with you about this hoops stuff again. Playoffs have been great this season. See ya up the road.

I'm out.

This, plus the fact I'm not defending Trump.

I'm calling out LTG for being unwilling to call out the racist behavior of his preferred candidate while using as a pretext for others not to vote for Trump.

_________________

WOW! I could not possibly disagree more.

_________________
Be well

GO BEARS!!!