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Is Donald Trump Racist
Poll ended at Sun Sep 18, 2016 11:07 am
Yes 45%  45%  [ 19 ]
No 31%  31%  [ 13 ]
Well Hillary sucks too 7%  7%  [ 3 ]
CUBBIES 17%  17%  [ 7 ]
Total votes : 42
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2016 12:21 pm 
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Terry's Peeps wrote:
pittmike wrote:
This thought is not to defend Trump but truly to get an answer. For as long as I can remember presidential elections have been pretty similar in the ways the two parties go at each other. So when was the last election you recall when the Republican candidate and the party in general were not made out to be racist? I am guessing HW Bush but not sure and I don't really remember the Reagan elections.


Maybe '92 or '96?


Bush in 1988 was accused of racism when he ran the "revolving door" ads against Dukakis, which referenced convicted murderer Willie Horton (who had later raped a woman and cut off her fiance's balls, while he was free under Dukakis's "weekend pass" program).

One of Bush's staffers stated that "by the time we're finished, they're going to wonder whether Willie Horton is Dukakis' running mate." :lol: But I believe the actual ads did not show Horton or a black person, so viewers didn't necessarily know the race.

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Last edited by Jaw Breaker on Fri Sep 16, 2016 12:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2016 12:23 pm 
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TM's first paragraph sums it up perfectly. We could never know what a person really thinks, but whether he's racist or he's simply acting racist for political purposes, the effect is the same. There's really no reason to try to determine if his thoughts are genuine. Racist may not be the perfect word, but it's close enough.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2016 12:24 pm 
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Jaw Breaker wrote:
Terry's Peeps wrote:
pittmike wrote:
This thought is not to defend Trump but truly to get an answer. For as long as I can remember presidential elections have been pretty similar in the ways the two parties go at each other. So when was the last election you recall when the Republican candidate and the party in general were not made out to be racist? I am guessing HW Bush but not sure and I don't really remember the Reagan elections.


Maybe '92 or '96?


Bush in 1988 was accused of racism when he ran the "revolving door" ads against Dukakis, which referenced Willie Horton (who had raped a woman and cut off her fiance's balls, while he was free under Dukakis's "weekend pass" program).

One of Bush's staffers stated that "by the time we're finished, they're going to wonder whether Willie Horton is Dukakis' running mate." :lol: But I believe the actual ads did not show Horton or a black person, so viewers didn't necessarily know the race.


No, the ad showed a picture of Horton: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Io9KMSSEZ0Y

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2016 12:31 pm 
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Tall Midget wrote:
cluv8484 wrote:
Tall Midget wrote:
He is a racist and neofascist.

That said, it is a catastrophically stupid campaign strategy for Clinton, her surrogates, and her media supporters to attribute Trump's popularity to racism. Clinton cannot win the election simply by attacking Trump. The Clintons adopted a variation of this strategy in the 1990s and it enabled the Republicans to take control of the House. If she is going to win the presidency, she needs to persuasively present a coherent vision for the future of the country under her leadership. This will be a difficult task for her since she doesn't seem to have one that lasts longer than a week or two.


Sources and evidence? Don't just make claims, please provide evidence and proof of this, totally open to changing my view if you have this


There's been plenty written about his housing discrimination policies, the covert and overt racism of his birtherism, his obvious and subtle flirtations with white supremacists, and his installation of a leading "alt right" figure as campaign CEO. If Trump isn't a racist as those who describe him as a pragmatic businessman claim, we must remember that he still behaves as if he were a racist. In other words, the above defense makes a distinction between Trump as an earnest racist and Trump as a Machiavellian political operator without identifying a tangible difference between those two descriptions.

His neofascism is slightly more complicated, but we can certainly recognize the emergence of such a discourse in his disdain for a free press and his willingness to lower the standard for libel judgments, his veneration of autocratic rulers such as Putin (and, apparently, Mussolini himself), his incitement of violence at his political rallies, his understanding of "political correctness" as a cause of national decline, his scapegoating of/attacks on Muslim and Mexican immigrants, and his development of a campaign platform designed to amplify cultural polarization and consolidate white people of varying social classes and ethnic lineages into a single voting bloc.


Tall Midget I want ask you a very specific question. This is independent of this election and simply politics in the US as a whole. We are bombarded with news stories about voting blocks from all sides of the spectrum as well as the politicians. Always talk about a Black Bloc that supposedly votes in lock step and even worse the Hispanic Bloc which not only has a incredibly diverse background but also crossover with other blocs. So we seemingly are comfortable with blocs. The question is then is it automatically racist to try to treat white voters as some sort of bloc? If so, treating others in blocs must also be racist or at the least demeaning and patronizing.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2016 12:31 pm 
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Tall Midget wrote:
Jaw Breaker wrote:
Terry's Peeps wrote:
pittmike wrote:
This thought is not to defend Trump but truly to get an answer. For as long as I can remember presidential elections have been pretty similar in the ways the two parties go at each other. So when was the last election you recall when the Republican candidate and the party in general were not made out to be racist? I am guessing HW Bush but not sure and I don't really remember the Reagan elections.


Maybe '92 or '96?


Bush in 1988 was accused of racism when he ran the "revolving door" ads against Dukakis, which referenced Willie Horton (who had raped a woman and cut off her fiance's balls, while he was free under Dukakis's "weekend pass" program).

One of Bush's staffers stated that "by the time we're finished, they're going to wonder whether Willie Horton is Dukakis' running mate." :lol: But I believe the actual ads did not show Horton or a black person, so viewers didn't necessarily know the race.


No, the ad showed a picture of Horton: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Io9KMSSEZ0Y


I guess I was remembering this one:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wTdUQ9SYhUw

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2016 12:35 pm 
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Jaw Breaker wrote:
Tall Midget wrote:
Jaw Breaker wrote:
Terry's Peeps wrote:
pittmike wrote:
This thought is not to defend Trump but truly to get an answer. For as long as I can remember presidential elections have been pretty similar in the ways the two parties go at each other. So when was the last election you recall when the Republican candidate and the party in general were not made out to be racist? I am guessing HW Bush but not sure and I don't really remember the Reagan elections.


Maybe '92 or '96?


Bush in 1988 was accused of racism when he ran the "revolving door" ads against Dukakis, which referenced Willie Horton (who had raped a woman and cut off her fiance's balls, while he was free under Dukakis's "weekend pass" program).

One of Bush's staffers stated that "by the time we're finished, they're going to wonder whether Willie Horton is Dukakis' running mate." :lol: But I believe the actual ads did not show Horton or a black person, so viewers didn't necessarily know the race.


No, the ad showed a picture of Horton: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Io9KMSSEZ0Y



I guess I was remembering this one:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wTdUQ9SYhUw


OK, but the only prisoner who exits through the revolving door AND looks at the camera is the black guy! :lol: The racism there really isn't what one typically thinks of as subtle.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2016 12:36 pm 
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Jaw Breaker wrote:
Terry's Peeps wrote:
pittmike wrote:
This thought is not to defend Trump but truly to get an answer. For as long as I can remember presidential elections have been pretty similar in the ways the two parties go at each other. So when was the last election you recall when the Republican candidate and the party in general were not made out to be racist? I am guessing HW Bush but not sure and I don't really remember the Reagan elections.


Maybe '92 or '96?


Bush in 1988 was accused of racism when he ran the "revolving door" ads against Dukakis, which referenced convicted murderer Willie Horton (who had later raped a woman and cut off her fiance's balls, while he was free under Dukakis's "weekend pass" program).

One of Bush's staffers stated that "by the time we're finished, they're going to wonder whether Willie Horton is Dukakis' running mate." :lol: But I believe the actual ads did not show Horton or a black person, so viewers didn't necessarily know the race.


I knew that. It wasn't my question. I am trying to figure out bigger generic things. Also, why I asked TM that last question. I am interested in voting blocs and how these will be going forward as demographics change in the future.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2016 12:36 pm 
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leashyourkids wrote:
TM's first paragraph sums it up perfectly. We could never know what a person really thinks, but whether he's racist or he's simply acting racist for political purposes, the effect is the same. There's really no reason to try to determine if his thoughts are genuine. Racist may not be the perfect word, but it's close enough.


I think similarly.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2016 12:40 pm 
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Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
TurdFerguson wrote:
Yes, but in his heart he holds equal disdain for blacks, asians, indians, mexicans, jews, poor people, middle class people, upper class people and so on..



Basically, anyone besides Ivanka and himself.


I do think she is the only person in this world he genuinely loves. Even Trump can't escape the affect a daughter has on her father.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2016 12:46 pm 
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pittmike wrote:
Jaw Breaker wrote:
Terry's Peeps wrote:
pittmike wrote:
This thought is not to defend Trump but truly to get an answer. For as long as I can remember presidential elections have been pretty similar in the ways the two parties go at each other. So when was the last election you recall when the Republican candidate and the party in general were not made out to be racist? I am guessing HW Bush but not sure and I don't really remember the Reagan elections.


Maybe '92 or '96?


Bush in 1988 was accused of racism when he ran the "revolving door" ads against Dukakis, which referenced convicted murderer Willie Horton (who had later raped a woman and cut off her fiance's balls, while he was free under Dukakis's "weekend pass" program).

One of Bush's staffers stated that "by the time we're finished, they're going to wonder whether Willie Horton is Dukakis' running mate." :lol: But I believe the actual ads did not show Horton or a black person, so viewers didn't necessarily know the race.


I knew that. It wasn't my question. I am trying to figure out bigger generic things. Also, why I asked TM that last question. I am interested in voting blocs and how these will be going forward as demographics change in the future.


In terms of the black vote it's pretty simple to ascertain why we've voted the way that we have. Blacks voted Republican post slavery. From 1865 -1932 the black vote was solidly Republican. The shift occurred with FDR but blacks were not solidly Democratic until LBJ. We have voted Democratic ever since.

Republicans post 68 haven't sought the black vote. They have mostly played identity politics and the history bears that out. They have attempted to rollback legislation which is beneficial to blacks. It would be idiotic for blacks to vote Republican. Republicans also have aligned themselves with white supremacists groups and bigots. Hell GW even spoke at Bob Jones university during his run for the Presidency and Reagan kicked his candidacy off in Philadelphia, Mississippi.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2016 12:53 pm 
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pittmike wrote:
leashyourkids wrote:
TM's first paragraph sums it up perfectly. We could never know what a person really thinks, but whether he's racist or he's simply acting racist for political purposes, the effect is the same. There's really no reason to try to determine if his thoughts are genuine. Racist may not be the perfect word, but it's close enough.


I think similarly.


Would it be considered racist if Trump were to state that he believes most of this country's problems could be fixed by reducing births to unwed mothers? On the surface it would be a race-neutral statement, as most data would indicate worse outcomes for single-parent children of any race). But because the highest percentage is from black mothers, it could probably be perceived as racist.

In other words, on several issues the intent of someone can come across as racist even if it's not. As another example, someone could state that there wouldn't be as many police shootings if suspects complied with officers' commands. One person might view that as common-sense advice, whereas others might be offended and take it as racist support for police.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2016 12:59 pm 
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Jaw Breaker wrote:

In other words, on several issues the intent of someone can come across as racist even if it's not. As another example, someone could state that there wouldn't be as many police shootings if suspects complied with officers' commands. One person might view that as common-sense advice, whereas others might be offended and take it as racist support for police.


And this is called the difference between being intelligent and being unintelligent...

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2016 1:00 pm 
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long time guy wrote:
pittmike wrote:
Jaw Breaker wrote:
Terry's Peeps wrote:
pittmike wrote:
This thought is not to defend Trump but truly to get an answer. For as long as I can remember presidential elections have been pretty similar in the ways the two parties go at each other. So when was the last election you recall when the Republican candidate and the party in general were not made out to be racist? I am guessing HW Bush but not sure and I don't really remember the Reagan elections.


Maybe '92 or '96?


Bush in 1988 was accused of racism when he ran the "revolving door" ads against Dukakis, which referenced convicted murderer Willie Horton (who had later raped a woman and cut off her fiance's balls, while he was free under Dukakis's "weekend pass" program).

One of Bush's staffers stated that "by the time we're finished, they're going to wonder whether Willie Horton is Dukakis' running mate." :lol: But I believe the actual ads did not show Horton or a black person, so viewers didn't necessarily know the race.


I knew that. It wasn't my question. I am trying to figure out bigger generic things. Also, why I asked TM that last question. I am interested in voting blocs and how these will be going forward as demographics change in the future.


In terms of the black vote it's pretty simple to ascertain why we've voted the way that we have. Blacks voted Republican post slavery. From 1865 -1932 the black vote was solidly Republican. The shift occurred with FDR but blacks were not solidly Democratic until LBJ. We have voted Democratic ever since.

Republicans post 68 haven't sought the black vote. They have mostly played identity politics and the history bears that out. They have attempted to rollback legislation which is beneficial to blacks. It would be idiotic for blacks to vote Republican. Republicans also have aligned themselves with white supremacists groups and bigots. Hell GW even spoke at Bob Jones university during his run for the Presidency and Reagan kicked his candidacy off in Philadelphia, Mississippi.


That really wasn't my question but thanks for the interesting information.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2016 1:00 pm 
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Terry's Peeps wrote:
For longtime guy.


When it comes to Hillary, he should log in as...short term memory

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2016 1:01 pm 
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Jaw Breaker wrote:
pittmike wrote:
leashyourkids wrote:
TM's first paragraph sums it up perfectly. We could never know what a person really thinks, but whether he's racist or he's simply acting racist for political purposes, the effect is the same. There's really no reason to try to determine if his thoughts are genuine. Racist may not be the perfect word, but it's close enough.


I think similarly.


Would it be considered racist if Trump were to state that he believes most of this country's problems could be fixed by reducing births to unwed mothers? On the surface it would be a race-neutral statement, as most data would indicate worse outcomes for single-parent children of any race). But because the highest percentage is from black mothers, it could probably be perceived as racist.

In other words, on several issues the intent of someone can come across as racist even if it's not. As another example, someone could state that there wouldn't be as many police shootings if suspects complied with officers' commands. One person might view that as common-sense advice, whereas others might be offended and take it as racist support for police.


Right, and that is true of some of his statements, but others are more blatantly racist. Calling Mexican immigrants murderers and rapists, for example.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2016 1:04 pm 
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leashyourkids wrote:

Right, and that is true of some of his statements, but others are more blatantly racist. Calling Mexican immigrants murderers and rapists, for example.


Agreed...some of them have no defense (he later toned that down by saying "they're not sending their best." :lol: :lol: )

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2016 1:07 pm 
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Jaw Breaker wrote:
leashyourkids wrote:

Right, and that is true of some of his statements, but others are more blatantly racist. Calling Mexican immigrants murderers and rapists, for example.


Agreed...some of them have no defense (he later toned that down by saying "they're not sending their best." :lol: :lol: )


I guess he admitted Obama was born in America today after his campaign basically forced him to. :lol:

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2016 1:09 pm 
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leashyourkids wrote:
Jaw Breaker wrote:
leashyourkids wrote:

Right, and that is true of some of his statements, but others are more blatantly racist. Calling Mexican immigrants murderers and rapists, for example.


Agreed...some of them have no defense (he later toned that down by saying "they're not sending their best." :lol: :lol: )


I guess he admitted Obama was born in America today after his campaign basically forced him to. :lol:


Oh yeah, he had to...otherwise you knew that question was coming right down the pipe to start the debates....

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2016 1:10 pm 
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leashyourkids wrote:
Jaw Breaker wrote:
leashyourkids wrote:

Right, and that is true of some of his statements, but others are more blatantly racist. Calling Mexican immigrants murderers and rapists, for example.


Agreed...some of them have no defense (he later toned that down by saying "they're not sending their best." :lol: :lol: )


I guess he admitted Obama was born in America today after his campaign basically forced him to. :lol:


CBS reported he admitted it and then reminded everyone that Hillary was the one who originally floated that thought.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2016 1:18 pm 
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pittmike wrote:
long time guy wrote:
pittmike wrote:
Jaw Breaker wrote:
Terry's Peeps wrote:
pittmike wrote:
This thought is not to defend Trump but truly to get an answer. For as long as I can remember presidential elections have been pretty similar in the ways the two parties go at each other. So when was the last election you recall when the Republican candidate and the party in general were not made out to be racist? I am guessing HW Bush but not sure and I don't really remember the Reagan elections.


Maybe '92 or '96?


Bush in 1988 was accused of racism when he ran the "revolving door" ads against Dukakis, which referenced convicted murderer Willie Horton (who had later raped a woman and cut off her fiance's balls, while he was free under Dukakis's "weekend pass" program).

One of Bush's staffers stated that "by the time we're finished, they're going to wonder whether Willie Horton is Dukakis' running mate." :lol: But I believe the actual ads did not show Horton or a black person, so viewers didn't necessarily know the race.


I knew that. It wasn't my question. I am trying to figure out bigger generic things. Also, why I asked TM that last question. I am interested in voting blocs and how these will be going forward as demographics change in the future.


In terms of the black vote it's pretty simple to ascertain why we've voted the way that we have. Blacks voted Republican post slavery. From 1865 -1932 the black vote was solidly Republican. The shift occurred with FDR but blacks were not solidly Democratic until LBJ. We have voted Democratic ever since.

Republicans post 68 haven't sought the black vote. They have mostly played identity politics and the history bears that out. They have attempted to rollback legislation which is beneficial to blacks. It would be idiotic for blacks to vote Republican. Republicans also have aligned themselves with white supremacists groups and bigots. Hell GW even spoke at Bob Jones university during his run for the Presidency and Reagan kicked his candidacy off in Philadelphia, Mississippi.


That really wasn't my question but thanks for the interesting information.


People vote their self interests. I see absolutely nothing that Republicans are currently doing to change it. I think blacks will continue to vote Democratic. I do think that Hispanics will swing periodically between R and D. Independents will continue to play the role of spoiler at the national level from time to time.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2016 1:19 pm 
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Seacrest wrote:
Terry's Peeps wrote:
For longtime guy.


When it comes to Hillary, he should log in as...short term memory


You should probably change yours to Nollo Contendre

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2016 1:21 pm 
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long time guy wrote:
Seacrest wrote:
Terry's Peeps wrote:
For longtime guy.


When it comes to Hillary, he should log in as...short term memory


You should probably change yours to Nollo Contendre



Well, you are at least consistent when calling others names. :lol:

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2016 1:27 pm 
It was really nice for you guys to give the racists their own safe space. Julie would approve.


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pittmike wrote:
This thought is not to defend Trump but truly to get an answer. For as long as I can remember presidential elections have been pretty similar in the ways the two parties go at each other. So when was the last election you recall when the Republican candidate and the party in general were not made out to be racist? I am guessing HW Bush but not sure and I don't really remember the Reagan elections.

HW - Willie Horton

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formerlyknownas wrote:
pittmike wrote:
This thought is not to defend Trump but truly to get an answer. For as long as I can remember presidential elections have been pretty similar in the ways the two parties go at each other. So when was the last election you recall when the Republican candidate and the party in general were not made out to be racist? I am guessing HW Bush but not sure and I don't really remember the Reagan elections.

HW - Willie Horton


It was Atwater.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2016 3:53 pm 
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[

It was Atwater.


was he a 3rd party candidate?

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Nas wrote:
It was Atwater.

Image

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2016 4:11 pm 
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sjboyd0137 wrote:
Nas wrote:
It was Atwater.

Image



He was a bad man.

Definitely on the All Time NFL Big Hitter Team.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=90HMXA5I2Tk

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2016 4:14 pm 
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Hatchetman wrote:
Nas wrote:
[

It was Atwater.


was he a 3rd party candidate?


No he pushed all that crap. He told Bush that was the only way he could win. Dukakis didn't fight back and lost. If he didn't die Bush probably wins in 1992.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2016 4:14 pm 
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long time guy wrote:
Seacrest wrote:
Terry's Peeps wrote:
For longtime guy.


When it comes to Hillary, he should log in as...short term memory


You should probably change yours to Nollo Contendre

There's only supposed to be one "L" there, Dr. Latin.

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Power is always in the hands of the masses of men. What oppresses the masses is their own ignorance, their own short-sighted selfishness.
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