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 Post subject: Re: Bigotry
PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2016 12:25 am 
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 Post subject: Re: Bigotry
PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2016 12:29 am 
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pittmike wrote:
FavreFan wrote:
conns7901 wrote:
FavreFan wrote:
I've never gone to a private school and don't know many people who have, so this might be one of my usual uninformed comments, but isn't the expectation that a private school teacher should be better if you are paying X thousands of dollars more a year? I don't really see the fault in the Denis post you quoted.


Private school teachers make considerably less money than public school teachers. A ten year veteran in the Chicagoland area will make anywhere from 30k to 60k less in the private school system.

So then the problem isn't charter schools at all. It's inadequate funding for public schools. Why are people demonizing Denis for sending his kids to private/charter schools?


Be honest? Dennis' kids are white. Guess what? The majority of the parents of this board want their kids to be the best they can be like sports. Is anyone suggesting you make too much money send your kids to Englewood for a life experience? No! Blow your liberalism out your ass until you send your kids into the shit.

In no way do I understand your response here but you're still my guy.

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 Post subject: Re: Bigotry
PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2016 12:30 am 
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Spaulding wrote:
FavreFan wrote:
Are you of the opinion your kids are better off not interacting with such students?


I wouldn't say better off not interacting, it's mostly good. I think my kids will do fine as zippy said the smarter kids are usually okay and I'm involved. There are assholes and good people you need to be understanding of all thru life. When kids are left completely disciplined or it has a negative effect on your child's education it becomes more difficult to navigate. When something is wrong - it's wrong. People gloss over it, think it's okay, don't want to create a problem, don't treat things with common sense, etc. My parents sent me to private schools and I see the difference in kids, parents, and the way things go.

Not trying to be rude but this entire paragraph didn't answer my question in any way.

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 Post subject: Re: Bigotry
PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2016 12:35 am 
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pittmike wrote:
conns7901 wrote:
FavreFan wrote:
I've never gone to a private school and don't know many people who have, so this might be one of my usual uninformed comments, but isn't the expectation that a private school teacher should be better if you are paying X thousands of dollars more a year? I don't really see the fault in the Denis post you quoted.


Private school teachers make considerably less money than public school teachers. A ten year veteran in the Chicagoland area will make anywhere from 30k to 60k less in the private school system.


It might be possible that they start wide eyed in parochial school and actually care about kids more than protecting shit in a union?





Private school teaching is just a much easier job, smaller classes, students behave better or they get kicked out..it pays less but its an easier gig and there is way more job security.

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 Post subject: Re: Bigotry
PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2016 12:36 am 
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long time guy wrote:
Spaulding wrote:
I understand what charter schools are in theory but what are the problems with them? I don't think we have any out here or don't know if something like Avery coonley by us is one.


Problems with Charters

1. Quality of instruction. Charter school teachers are more often than not uncertified. They are untrained to teach in most cases.

2. High turnover rate amongst the staff and the administration. Tremendous amount of instability in charter schools.

3. Stigmatized for being the educational system for poor and impoverished neighborhoods.

4. There is a reason that affluent neighborhoods fight like hell to keep them out. If Charters provide better schooling, then why are they relegated to poorer neighborhoods.

5. Typically are outperformed by corresponding neighborhood schools. That shouldn't happen given the fact that Charters have an opportunity to select which students that want to admit. They also have the opportunity to remove undesirable students. Neighborhood schools have neither.





I can't argue any of that, but don't you think in 5 years that charter schools will be all over the city?

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 Post subject: Re: Bigotry
PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2016 12:43 am 
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FavreFan wrote:
Not trying to be rude but this entire paragraph didn't answer my question in any way.


I don't understand what you are looking for or what you are asking then. When needs or issues interfere with your child's education it's really frustrating.


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 Post subject: Re: Bigotry
PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2016 12:47 am 
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Spaulding wrote:
FavreFan wrote:
Are you of the opinion your kids are better off not interacting with such students?


I wouldn't say better off not interacting, it's mostly good. I think my kids will do fine as zippy said the smarter kids are usually okay and I'm involved. There are assholes and good people you need to be understanding of all thru life. When kids are left completely disciplined or it has a negative effect on your child's education it becomes more difficult to navigate. When something is wrong - it's wrong. People gloss over it, think it's okay, don't want to create a problem, don't treat things with common sense, etc. My parents sent me to private schools and I see the difference in kids, parents, and the way things go.


Girl! So many great points I don't know what to agree with! LOL. You just said everything I would say!

You on for that private wine tasting? No taxpayer dollars! LOL.

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 Post subject: Re: Bigotry
PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2016 12:48 am 
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Spaulding wrote:
FavreFan wrote:
Not trying to be rude but this entire paragraph didn't answer my question in any way.


I don't understand what you are looking for or what you are asking then. When needs or issues interfere with your child's education it's really frustrating.

I'm sure it is and I don't have kids so I can't relate to that unfortunately.

My question isn't hard. I'm asking you, taking into consideration everything you just wrote, if you would prefer your kid not to be in school with kids with "psychological, emotional, learning, and behavior problems"

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 Post subject: Re: Bigotry
PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2016 12:50 am 
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FavreFan wrote:
Spaulding wrote:
FavreFan wrote:
Not trying to be rude but this entire paragraph didn't answer my question in any way.


I don't understand what you are looking for or what you are asking then. When needs or issues interfere with your child's education it's really frustrating.

I'm sure it is and I don't have kids so I can't relate to that unfortunately.

My question isn't hard. I'm asking you, taking into consideration everything you just wrote, if you would prefer your kid not to be in school with kids with "psychological, emotional, learning, and behavior problems"


You don't have kids so stop lecturing us normal people.

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 Post subject: Re: Bigotry
PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2016 12:53 am 
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leashyourkids wrote:
FavreFan wrote:
Spaulding wrote:
FavreFan wrote:
Not trying to be rude but this entire paragraph didn't answer my question in any way.


I don't understand what you are looking for or what you are asking then. When needs or issues interfere with your child's education it's really frustrating.

I'm sure it is and I don't have kids so I can't relate to that unfortunately.

My question isn't hard. I'm asking you, taking into consideration everything you just wrote, if you would prefer your kid not to be in school with kids with "psychological, emotional, learning, and behavior problems"


You don't have kids so stop lecturing us normal people.

It is pretty mean to say, but if you do not have kids, you absolutely cannot talk about kids.

I remember doing it as a yunggin' - had no idea whatsoever. Its basically like your whole behavioral and internal system completely morphs when you go into "Family Mode".

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 Post subject: Re: Bigotry
PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2016 12:55 am 
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Panther pislA wrote:
leashyourkids wrote:
FavreFan wrote:
Spaulding wrote:
FavreFan wrote:
Not trying to be rude but this entire paragraph didn't answer my question in any way.


I don't understand what you are looking for or what you are asking then. When needs or issues interfere with your child's education it's really frustrating.

I'm sure it is and I don't have kids so I can't relate to that unfortunately.

My question isn't hard. I'm asking you, taking into consideration everything you just wrote, if you would prefer your kid not to be in school with kids with "psychological, emotional, learning, and behavior problems"


You don't have kids so stop lecturing us normal people.

It is pretty mean to say, but if you do not have kids, you absolutely cannot talk about kids.

This is stupid. Stop being stupid, please.

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 Post subject: Re: Bigotry
PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2016 12:56 am 
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FavreFan wrote:
Panther pislA wrote:
leashyourkids wrote:
FavreFan wrote:
Spaulding wrote:
I don't understand what you are looking for or what you are asking then. When needs or issues interfere with your child's education it's really frustrating.

I'm sure it is and I don't have kids so I can't relate to that unfortunately.

My question isn't hard. I'm asking you, taking into consideration everything you just wrote, if you would prefer your kid not to be in school with kids with "psychological, emotional, learning, and behavior problems"


You don't have kids so stop lecturing us normal people.

It is pretty mean to say, but if you do not have kids, you absolutely cannot talk about kids.

This is stupid. Stop being stupid, please.

lol get yourself a new M.O. :lol: :lol: :lol:

. .. and some kids. . .

. . . And then we'll talk!

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 Post subject: Re: Bigotry
PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2016 12:59 am 
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Panther is right on the money with this one.

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 Post subject: Re: Bigotry
PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2016 1:02 am 
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Panther pislA wrote:
FavreFan wrote:
Panther pislA wrote:
leashyourkids wrote:
FavreFan wrote:
Spaulding wrote:
I don't understand what you are looking for or what you are asking then. When needs or issues interfere with your child's education it's really frustrating.

I'm sure it is and I don't have kids so I can't relate to that unfortunately.

My question isn't hard. I'm asking you, taking into consideration everything you just wrote, if you would prefer your kid not to be in school with kids with "psychological, emotional, learning, and behavior problems"


You don't have kids so stop lecturing us normal people.

It is pretty mean to say, but if you do not have kids, you absolutely cannot talk about kids.

This is stupid. Stop being stupid, please.

lol get yourself a new M.O. :lol: :lol: :lol:

. .. and some kids. . .

. . . And then we'll talk!

I know you are dumber than the average person, but even a stupid person can see the logical conclusion to this line of thinking and I don't think you would like it.

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 Post subject: Re: Bigotry
PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2016 1:05 am 
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Panther spitting so much truth, he must have dry mouth.

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 Post subject: Re: Bigotry
PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2016 1:06 am 
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FavreFan wrote:
I'm sure it is and I don't have kids so I can't relate to that unfortunately.

My question isn't hard. I'm asking you, taking into consideration everything you just wrote, if you would prefer your kid not to be in school with kids with "psychological, emotional, learning, and behavior problems"


Humph. I guess I wished the schools handled it better. If there was an absolute world I had the choice, no I don't want my kids with them. It's rough. Some of them present challenges and issues beyond what I and my kids are capable of handling. I'd like to send my kids to a catholic/private high school. I say that as catholic educated and mr spaulding as not.


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 Post subject: Re: Bigotry
PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2016 1:07 am 
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Spaulding wrote:
FavreFan wrote:
I'm sure it is and I don't have kids so I can't relate to that unfortunately.

My question isn't hard. I'm asking you, taking into consideration everything you just wrote, if you would prefer your kid not to be in school with kids with "psychological, emotional, learning, and behavior problems"


Humph. I guess I wished the schools handled it better. If there was an absolute world I had the choice, no I don't want my kids with them. It's rough. Some of them present challenges and issues beyond what I and my kids are capable of handling. I'd like to send my kids to a catholic/private high school. I say that as catholic educated and mr spaulding as not.


He doesn't have kids. No need to even consider his thoughts.

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 Post subject: Re: Bigotry
PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2016 1:10 am 
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Spaulding wrote:
FavreFan wrote:
I'm sure it is and I don't have kids so I can't relate to that unfortunately.

My question isn't hard. I'm asking you, taking into consideration everything you just wrote, if you would prefer your kid not to be in school with kids with "psychological, emotional, learning, and behavior problems"


Humph. I guess I wished the schools handled it better. If there was an absolute world I had the choice, no I don't want my kids with them. It's rough. Some of them present challenges and issues beyond what I and my kids are capable of handling. I'd like to send my kids to a catholic/private high school. I say that as catholic educated and mr spaulding as not.

I don't mean this to be an asshole although it will surely sound like that, but how do you know the challenges that your kids can handle and cannot? When I was in jr high and high school my parents certainly had no idea even though they were very involved. I think you are putting your kids at a disadvantage by now exposing them to every different type of person you can. That's the problem with our country right now in a nutshell. Everybody wants to live in an echo chamber where them and their loved ones will never be challenged to think differently than they otherwise would have.

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 Post subject: Re: Bigotry
PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2016 1:11 am 
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FavreFan wrote:
Panther pislA wrote:
FavreFan wrote:
Panther pislA wrote:
leashyourkids wrote:
FavreFan wrote:
I'm sure it is and I don't have kids so I can't relate to that unfortunately.

My question isn't hard. I'm asking you, taking into consideration everything you just wrote, if you would prefer your kid not to be in school with kids with "psychological, emotional, learning, and behavior problems"


You don't have kids so stop lecturing us normal people.

It is pretty mean to say, but if you do not have kids, you absolutely cannot talk about kids.

This is stupid. Stop being stupid, please.

lol get yourself a new M.O. :lol: :lol: :lol:

. .. and some kids. . .

. . . And then we'll talk!

I know you are dumber than the average person, but even a stupid person can see the logical conclusion to this line of thinking and I don't think you would like it.

If you keep driving that same old car, everyone else who has new cars is going to speed right by you, Faffy. :wink:

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 Post subject: Re: Bigotry
PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2016 1:14 am 
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He ain't even worth your time, Panther.


12:17 AM

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Last edited by leashyourkids on Sat Dec 03, 2016 1:17 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Bigotry
PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2016 1:15 am 
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THIS THREAD, MAN :lol: :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: Bigotry
PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2016 1:16 am 
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I knew spanky was still a lurker! :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: Bigotry
PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2016 1:17 am 
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:lol: :lol: :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: Bigotry
PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2016 4:37 am 
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conns7901 wrote:
We once had a kid who moved into town and try to enroll in our school who was BD and had a personal aide at his previous school. The family was rich and was even willing to pay for the aide. Our principal past on the kid, so did the two other local Catholic schools. Kid ended up at the public school in our district. Now if there was a voucher system we would of had to take him, which would of pissed off the other 20 plus families in the class.

You're a teacher, right?

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 Post subject: Re: Bigotry
PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2016 5:20 am 
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Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
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Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
denisdman wrote:
KDdidit wrote:
Also Dennis prefers teachers paid less than Union equivalents.


My preference is for teachers who teach better than their union equivalents. And on that point, I am happy to report that my preference has been universally fulfilled.

Wow. just wow. I didn't see this coming. JORR was right.

Please elaborate on this thought if you are able to. Thank you.

There's not much to elaborate on. Unless I am reading him wrong it seems that Den is essentially saying private school teachers are better than "union equivalents". I thought JORRs initial post was absurd but now I'm not so sure.


I don't make any false assumptions. If you read all my thoughts and avoid the thoughts that people falsely attribute to me, you'll see my overall opinion. Several pages back I gave an entire list of reasons why private schools are better.

Public school teachers are in a no win situation. They are hemmed between apathetic parents and an adminstration that is not pulling in the same direction. Now richer school districts can throw unlimited money at the problem and overcome the inherent problems with the way public school districts function.

Private schools would die for a true voucher system. Enrollment has been dropping and christian schools continue to close. Most private schools have lots of low income kids. 25% of the kids at our school do not pay tuition because of need. Their costs are covered by donations. We are not attached to a church that covers the cost. It is made up by other parents. The school is very diversified owing to its Elgin location. Both of my kids' first boy/girlfriend were from another race. I am glad we raised our kids to view all people as equal.

I made the comment about teachers because a few had decided that my opinions were an attempt at union busting. That's what it always boils down to for people wedded to the current system. Do you think CPS goes into negotiations with the kids best interest in mind? When Rahm wanted to increase the country's shortest school day by 30 minutes, what was CPS' response? It wasn't, that sounds great for better educating poor kids. Now I don't think Rahm or Rauner have kids' best interest in mind either.

See, I am an equal opportunity hater. With private schools, I have a choice and a voice. With public schools, the taxpayers have almost no control. Don't read this as hating on union back teachers. They've been fucked over and shit on too. The whole system is broken and under funded. And don't even get me started how the teacher pension problem was created by fiscally irresponsible politicians, and now the teachers get screwed there too.

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 Post subject: Re: Bigotry
PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2016 8:58 am 
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Why is it ok to bash public schools as much as you want but people say a few bad things about private schools and people go nuts? Private schools are clearly exclusionary. I mean it is literally a school that picks and chooses their students.

I'm guessing the fact that people or people's parents paid thousands of dollars for an education that is pretty much the same as what most would get in public school brings out the emotion. That's why Hatchetman called me a bigot while I basically don't care if someone thinks kids are better in Catholic school.

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 Post subject: Re: Bigotry
PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2016 9:19 am 
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Mike was hammered last night and FF bent leash over the tractor.

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 Post subject: Re: Bigotry
PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2016 9:27 am 
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FavreFan wrote:
So then the problem isn't charter schools at all. It's inadequate funding for public schools.


The money is certainly an advantage, but there's more to it than that. A friend of mine is a teacher at a regular neighborhood CPS high school (not a magnet or a charter). He says that if you took all the kids from his school and put them in New Trier and took all the kids from New Trier and put them in his school, the money and teachers at New Trier wouldn't automatically make a radical improvement in the students from his school. The parents and their engagement are a huge factor. Obviously denis is an engaged parent and would be regardless of where his kids went to school.

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 Post subject: Re: Bigotry
PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2016 9:33 am 
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FavreFan wrote:
Spaulding wrote:
FavreFan wrote:
But let's be real for a second. What did "the other kids" refer to? Race was clearly a factor in that post.


Not necessarily. There are kids with psychological, emotional, learning, and behavioral problems that have nothing to do with race or economic status.

Are you of the opinion your kids are better off not interacting with such students?


This is a very interesting conversation and I just discussed this issue last week with a friend who has a special needs daughter and his son who is a special education teacher. The son is a big proponent of mainstreaming the special needs kids. It devolved into an argument between the father and son which made me laugh. Eventually I said to my hard head friend, "Your kid just got out of college, he actually has a job in the field, and he's the guy in this conversation with the actual expertise, but you're giving him your know-it-all bullshit. You sound like a dope." The thing that started the conversation was that the kid found out that Hersey has a separate prom for the special needs kids and that infuriated him.

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 Post subject: Re: Bigotry
PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2016 9:37 am 
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Don Tiny wrote:
Chus wrote:
pittmike wrote:
Hatchetman wrote:
denisdman wrote:
Give me your solution.


higher teacher salaries, duh!


Yeah throw money in bunches. Eliminate defense because apparently Russia has only one carrier.


Who said to eliminate defense? :lol:

Marc Trestman


:lol: :lol: In the heated discussion wherein CFMB was going to fix the nation's education problems this little gem got lost.

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