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 Post subject: Re: SCOTUS Confirmation
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2017 10:44 am 
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Terry's Peeps wrote:
Big Chicagoan wrote:
Marrick Garland is not a neutral judge. He is a left leaning judge. The same amount of lean to the left that Gorsuch is to the right. All of us bystanders are just watching political football. Democrats don't care whether Gorsuch becomes a judge because of his views on anything, they are just playing politics because of what the GOP did with Garland. That's it. They are creating a spectacle and you rubes are all falling for it.

Listening to anyone sit here and say that Gorsuch somehow is not qualified to be a SCOTUS is just ridiculous (Garland was also qualified to be SCOTUS). Who cares if you don't agree with his decisions that you had no idea about until it was explained to you by your favorite political analyst over the last couple months. The guy is replacing the most right-wing judge ever. No matter who filled the seat the court would become more moderate and progressive.

What everyone should be talking about is how the processes put in place to run Congress are being torpedoed by both parties just because no one can be reasonable about anything anymore. But all you idiots are doing is pointing fingers just like those assholes. Then you complain about how they operate when they operate just like you.


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I'll go you one further.

Congress is a direct reflection of the populace at large, and our community here as well.

People don't want solutions, they just want to point fingers and obfuscate any real accountability for anything.

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 Post subject: Re: SCOTUS Confirmation
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2017 10:52 am 
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Terry's Peeps wrote:
Big Chicagoan wrote:
Marrick Garland is not a neutral judge. He is a left leaning judge. The same amount of lean to the left that Gorsuch is to the right. All of us bystanders are just watching political football. Democrats don't care whether Gorsuch becomes a judge because of his views on anything, they are just playing politics because of what the GOP did with Garland. That's it. They are creating a spectacle and you rubes are all falling for it.

Listening to anyone sit here and say that Gorsuch somehow is not qualified to be a SCOTUS is just ridiculous (Garland was also qualified to be SCOTUS). Who cares if you don't agree with his decisions that you had no idea about until it was explained to you by your favorite political analyst over the last couple months. The guy is replacing the most right-wing judge ever. No matter who filled the seat the court would become more moderate and progressive.

What everyone should be talking about is how the processes put in place to run Congress are being torpedoed by both parties just because no one can be reasonable about anything anymore. But all you idiots are doing is pointing fingers just like those assholes. Then you complain about how they operate when they operate just like you.


Image



Except as to the discussion of being "qualified", he's not.

Merrick Garland helped prove that. Progressives didn't like him and his nomination was first publicly proposed by a republican senator who then wouldn't deign to meet him. I thought he was another instance of Obama bending over backwards in compromise, if only to be left looking like a neophyte.

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 Post subject: Re: SCOTUS Confirmation
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2017 10:56 am 
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Regular Reader wrote:
Darkside wrote:
So you're cool with 4 years or greater of an empty seat or two on this highest court?
Neat.



No, not at all. I'm just sickened by what some pseudo intellectual legal "elites" introduced into the courts in part starting here at Northwestern, U of Chicago and other places (i.e. the Federalist Society) to turn out their own version of activist judges to offset court that MANY believed were too friendly to the colored, or women, or queers or "them".

Gorsuch (as raised by his sociopathic political mother) embodies that.

Keep in mind that I really had no love for Garland's positions on the bench, but welcomed him wholeheartedly as a likely centrist with a probable open mind on Supreme Court. These Republican nominees far too often now don't. Kennedy may be the last of that breed that did, imo.


Not wishing to legislate from the bench is not "activism". :roll:


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 Post subject: Re: SCOTUS Confirmation
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2017 10:57 am 
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denisdman wrote:
3) As for your stuff about his political leanings and decisions, keep in mind around half the country agree with his right leaning verdicts. It's just a different philosophy. Whether you like it or not, many of us believe in restricting the power of the executive branch whether that be the EPA or DOL or SEC, etc. The Federal Government has extended its powers well beyond what is authorized in the U.S. Constitution. Frankly, the right leaning judges are on the wrong side of a lot of the due process and search and seizure stuff, so my comment applies to both left and right depending on the issue. Ginsburg is not some bitch to me just because she happens to believe that the Constitution protects a woman's right to choose. Try to understand where the other side is coming from and respect that difference. That is the entire problem with our politics-we just bad mouth real differences in political leanings and turn it into name calling.


You are muddying the waters. I do not think that half the country agrees with what Gorsuch did in that truck driver case, and that is emblematic of who Gorsuch is as a person, which matters; rather, I would think that 99% of Americans are or would be against how Gorsuch ruled.

This is not about political leanings, Democrat or Republican. It's about whether Gorsuch is even capable of being a fellow human being, who clearly should have applied the exception clause or exception case-law to the truck-driver's life-or-death situation. But he didn't.


Last edited by Dignified Rube on Thu Apr 06, 2017 10:59 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: SCOTUS Confirmation
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2017 10:58 am 
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Dignified Rube wrote:
denisdman wrote:
3) As for your stuff about his political leanings and decisions, keep in mind around half the country agree with his right leaning verdicts. It's just a different philosophy. Whether you like it or not, many of us believe in restricting the power of the executive branch whether that be the EPA or DOL or SEC, etc. The Federal Government has extended its powers well beyond what is authorized in the U.S. Constitution. Frankly, the right leaning judges are on the wrong side of a lot of the due process and search and seizure stuff, so my comment applies to both left and right depending on the issue. Ginsburg is not some bitch to me just because she happens to believe that the Constitution protects a woman's right to choose. Try to understand where the other side is coming from and respect that difference. That is the entire problem with our politics-we just bad mouth real differences in political leanings and turn it into name calling.


You are muddying the waters. I do not think that half the country agrees with what Gorsuch did in that truck driver case, and that is emblematic of who Gorsuch is as a person, which matters; rather, I would think that 99% of Americans are or would be against how Gorsuch ruled.

This is not about political leanings, Democrat or Republican. It's about whether Gorsuch is even capable of being a fellow human being, who clearly should have applied the exception clause or exception case-law to the truck-driver's life-or-death situation.
I would be shocked if there is any judge in this country that any of us would agree with on every case they have ever ruled on.

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 Post subject: Re: SCOTUS Confirmation
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2017 11:00 am 
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Boilermaker Rick wrote:
Dignified Rube wrote:
denisdman wrote:
3) As for your stuff about his political leanings and decisions, keep in mind around half the country agree with his right leaning verdicts. It's just a different philosophy. Whether you like it or not, many of us believe in restricting the power of the executive branch whether that be the EPA or DOL or SEC, etc. The Federal Government has extended its powers well beyond what is authorized in the U.S. Constitution. Frankly, the right leaning judges are on the wrong side of a lot of the due process and search and seizure stuff, so my comment applies to both left and right depending on the issue. Ginsburg is not some bitch to me just because she happens to believe that the Constitution protects a woman's right to choose. Try to understand where the other side is coming from and respect that difference. That is the entire problem with our politics-we just bad mouth real differences in political leanings and turn it into name calling.


You are muddying the waters. I do not think that half the country agrees with what Gorsuch did in that truck driver case, and that is emblematic of who Gorsuch is as a person, which matters; rather, I would think that 99% of Americans are or would be against how Gorsuch ruled.

This is not about political leanings, Democrat or Republican. It's about whether Gorsuch is even capable of being a fellow human being, who clearly should have applied the exception clause or exception case-law to the truck-driver's life-or-death situation.
I would be shocked if there is any judge in this country that any of us would agree with on every case they have ever ruled on.


Of course, but this case was egregious. That's why it has come to the forefront of the debate about Gorsuch's appointment, because everyone can relate to it.

And note that the six other appellate judges in the case did not agree with Gorsuch. Who do you think was right?


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 Post subject: Re: SCOTUS Confirmation
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2017 11:07 am 
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Dignified Rube wrote:
denisdman wrote:
2) The nominee should not be described as a POS. Much like Obama's nominee, these are highly qualified and well regarded judges. Don't let the poisonous Washington politics skew your view of the nominee. It's not his fault that the Republicans played the ultimate game with Obama's nominee.


Sorry, have to disagree. Any judge that sides with a company over the firing of an employee that was trying to keep himself from freezing to death is a heartless douchebag that doesn't even deserve the consideration to be appointed to SCOTUS. There was an exception clause in the law that accounted for extreme events like this one, and still Gorsuch sided with the company over the firing. It just shows who his allegiance is to, and it's not to justice.


That case actually touches an area of our insurance product. We write significant amounts of employment liability coverage. The typical case is over wrongful termination. The way the law works on the Federal level and in most states is that you are an at will employee and can be fired for ANY reason except for a prohibited reason. Those prohibited reasons are mainly racial, religious, over 40 (age), and things like that. So while the facts of that specific case are heart breaking, his opinion was merely based on the fact that the company did not violate a prohibited reason. The company is clearly heartless, but that doesn't mean they violated the law. It's akin to laying people off before the holidays or firing someone after a parent just died. Dick move but not illegal.

As it happens, the vast majority of cases we see are dismissed by the EEOC which handles those cases before they go to court.

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 Post subject: Re: SCOTUS Confirmation
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2017 11:08 am 
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One more thing is that Gorsuch didn't even answer questions about his thinking in the case during his confirmation hearing. I watched it.

It's one thing to make a mistake, which he should have admitted to doing, but it's another to lyingly stonewall about why he ruled as he did, feigning many times, "I don't know" or "I can't answer that".


Last edited by Dignified Rube on Thu Apr 06, 2017 11:13 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: SCOTUS Confirmation
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2017 11:09 am 
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Dignified Rube wrote:
Of course, but this case was egregious. That's why it has come to the forefront of the debate about Gorsuch's appointment, because everyone can relate to it.

And note that the six other appellate judges in the case did not agree with Gorsuch. Who do you think was right?
He was wrong. I have no doubt he was wrong.

I'm sure if they nominated anyone else there would be a case that they were wrong on according to most people.

I just read about it too and you aren't really correct that he was defending corporations. He seems to be a guy who puts a lot of faith into how laws are actually written and that is why he did it. I'd say in this case he made the wrong interpretation but judges do that sometimes which is why we have multiple judges and appeals.

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 Post subject: Re: SCOTUS Confirmation
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2017 11:11 am 
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denisdman wrote:
Dignified Rube wrote:
denisdman wrote:
2) The nominee should not be described as a POS. Much like Obama's nominee, these are highly qualified and well regarded judges. Don't let the poisonous Washington politics skew your view of the nominee. It's not his fault that the Republicans played the ultimate game with Obama's nominee.


Sorry, have to disagree. Any judge that sides with a company over the firing of an employee that was trying to keep himself from freezing to death is a heartless douchebag that doesn't even deserve the consideration to be appointed to SCOTUS. There was an exception clause in the law that accounted for extreme events like this one, and still Gorsuch sided with the company over the firing. It just shows who his allegiance is to, and it's not to justice.


That case actually touches an area of our insurance product. We write significant amounts of employment liability coverage. The typical case is over wrongful termination. The way the law works on the Federal level and in most states is that you are an at will employee and can be fired for ANY reason except for a prohibited reason. Those prohibited reasons are mainly racial, religious, over 40 (age), and things like that. So while the facts of that specific case are heart breaking, his opinion was merely based on the fact that the company did not violate a prohibited reason. The company is clearly heartless, but that doesn't mean they violated the law. It's akin to laying people off before the holidays or firing someone after a parent just died. Dick move but not illegal.

As it happens, the vast majority of cases we see are dismissed by the EEOC which handles those cases before they go to court.


He strictly applied the law, without considering the exception clauses or exception case law. That's just being a bastard.


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 Post subject: Re: SCOTUS Confirmation
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2017 11:15 am 
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Dignified Rube wrote:
He strictly applied the law, without considering the exception clauses or exception case law. That's just being a bastard.


What are these "exception clauses" or relevant case law?


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 Post subject: Re: SCOTUS Confirmation
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2017 11:27 am 
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Boilermaker Rick wrote:
Dignified Rube wrote:
Of course, but this case was egregious. That's why it has come to the forefront of the debate about Gorsuch's appointment, because everyone can relate to it.

And note that the six other appellate judges in the case did not agree with Gorsuch. Who do you think was right?
He was wrong. I have no doubt he was wrong.

I'm sure if they nominated anyone else there would be a case that they were wrong on according to most people.

I just read about it too and you aren't really correct that he was defending corporations. He seems to be a guy who puts a lot of faith into how laws are actually written and that is why he did it. I'd say in this case he made the wrong interpretation but judges do that sometimes which is why we have multiple judges and appeals.


FYI: The site has been responding slow for me.

BR is spot on here. I agree with all that. Generally conservative judges will strictly interpret the law as written without making leaps or seeing things that aren't in plain language. And in cases like this, it makes those decisions look poor. Their response, as Scalia so often said, then change the law.

Now of course, many want the courts to over interpret and do the job of the legislature, which has become a large problem in our society. The real problem lays at the feet of crappy legislative bodies and have forced the courts to essentially become lawmakers. Look no further than Illinois where they haven't passed budget, and so the courts have mandated about 90% of the spending.

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 Post subject: Re: SCOTUS Confirmation
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2017 11:48 am 
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Juice's Lecture Notes wrote:
Regular Reader wrote:
Darkside wrote:
So you're cool with 4 years or greater of an empty seat or two on this highest court?
Neat.



No, not at all. I'm just sickened by what some pseudo intellectual legal "elites" introduced into the courts in part starting here at Northwestern, U of Chicago and other places (i.e. the Federalist Society) to turn out their own version of activist judges to offset court that MANY believed were too friendly to the colored, or women, or queers or "them".

Gorsuch (as raised by his sociopathic political mother) embodies that.

Keep in mind that I really had no love for Garland's positions on the bench, but welcomed him wholeheartedly as a likely centrist with a probable open mind on Supreme Court. These Republican nominees far too often now don't. Kennedy may be the last of that breed that did, imo.


Not wishing to legislate from the bench is not "activism". :roll:


Thinking that ANY rulings from the bench on new/changing issues isn't legislating is not "realism". And fwiw, most people have no idea what they're talking about when a discussion of activism arises, or they aren't being truly honest. Going backwards in time to change accepted ruling and law is most certainly the "judicial activism" MANY claim to abhor. Scalia at least knew he was something of a hypocrite in that respect (at least at cocktail functions and ostensibly behind closed doors)

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 Post subject: Re: SCOTUS Confirmation
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2017 12:15 pm 
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denisdman wrote:
Boilermaker Rick wrote:
Dignified Rube wrote:
Of course, but this case was egregious. That's why it has come to the forefront of the debate about Gorsuch's appointment, because everyone can relate to it.

And note that the six other appellate judges in the case did not agree with Gorsuch. Who do you think was right?
He was wrong. I have no doubt he was wrong.

I'm sure if they nominated anyone else there would be a case that they were wrong on according to most people.

I just read about it too and you aren't really correct that he was defending corporations. He seems to be a guy who puts a lot of faith into how laws are actually written and that is why he did it. I'd say in this case he made the wrong interpretation but judges do that sometimes which is why we have multiple judges and appeals.


FYI: The site has been responding slow for me.

BR is spot on here. I agree with all that. Generally conservative judges will strictly interpret the law as written without making leaps or seeing things that aren't in plain language. And in cases like this, it makes those decisions look poor. Their response, as Scalia so often said, then change the law.

Now of course, many want the courts to over interpret and do the job of the legislature, which has become a large problem in our society. The real problem lays at the feet of crappy legislative bodies and have forced the courts to essentially become lawmakers. Look no further than Illinois where they haven't passed budget, and so the courts have mandated about 90% of the spending.


As seen here with Rube some have very strong feelings about this. That said Brick is right about finding a decision to hate or disagree with in any judge is easy. This guy has said repeatedly he is someone that is strict about the laws that are on the books and not so much about them "living and breathing".

Dennis, your point that I highlighted is one of the main reasons that outside of everything else I prefer right leaning judges like this guy and Scalia.

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 Post subject: Re: SCOTUS Confirmation
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2017 12:40 pm 
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I'm just going to leave this here for everyone bitching about who started it.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/22/opini ... -bork.html

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 Post subject: Re: SCOTUS Confirmation
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2017 12:48 pm 
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What's the consequence of Gorsuch being appointed now, after McConnell goes nuclear?

Trump's whole agenda will be DOA as far as the Democrats are concerned. You can forget about any health care reform, unless Ryan can get all Republicans on board, which is unlikely.

Beyond that, the prospect of the government being shut down looks all the more probable when the current short-term funding bill expires this month. When that happens, Republicans will take the blame, and they will not get any sympathy of voters after the health-care bill fiasco, which voters rightly saw was a veiled tax-cut scheme for the rich.

Personally, I think that Trump was politically stupid on Gorsuch. He should have extended the Dems an olive branch with a more moderate pick, especially after Obama didn't have his choice, which would have given Trump enough goodwill to get at least some things in his agenda through Congress. No way, now. Trump is basically a lame duck President at this point. I don't think Republican lawmakers are going to stick their necks out for Trump, when that boat is sinking.

Not winning.


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 Post subject: Re: SCOTUS Confirmation
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2017 12:53 pm 
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Ogie Oglethorpe wrote:
I'm just going to leave this here for everyone bitching about who started it.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/22/opini ... -bork.html


Interesting. I found this quote more interesting as we were discussing how a single opinion can or should torpedo a nominee.

Ruth Bader Ginsburg, among many others, has questioned the rationale offered by the court to justify Roe v. Wade.

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 Post subject: Re: SCOTUS Confirmation
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2017 12:55 pm 
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Dignified Rube wrote:
What's the consequence of Gorsuch being appointed now, after McConnell goes nuclear?

Trump's whole agenda will be DOA as far as the Democrats are concerned. You can forget about any health care reform, unless Ryan can get all Republicans on board, which is unlikely.

Beyond that, the prospect of the government being shut down looks all the more probable when the current short-term funding bill expires this month. When that happens, Republicans will take the blame, and they will not get any sympathy of voters after the health-care bill fiasco, which voters rightly saw was a veiled tax-cut scheme for the rich.

Personally, I think that Trump was politically stupid on Gorsuch. He should have extended the Dems an olive branch with a more moderate pick, especially after Obama didn't have his choice, which would have given Trump enough goodwill to get at least some things in his agenda through Congress. No way, now. Trump is basically a lame duck President at this point. I don't think Republican lawmakers are going to stick their necks out for Trump, when that boat is sinking.

Not winning.


I don't agree with your take. I think the congress will still work with him to get what they want done. As far as your olive branch no way. One of the main reasons Trump won was that court seat. Whatever supporters he has would lynch him.

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 Post subject: Re: SCOTUS Confirmation
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2017 12:57 pm 
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Ogie Oglethorpe wrote:
I'm just going to leave this here for everyone bitching about who started it.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/22/opini ... -bork.html

Voting someone down does not equal not even holding a hearing.

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 Post subject: Re: SCOTUS Confirmation
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Dignified Rube wrote:
What's the consequence of Gorsuch being appointed now, after McConnell goes nuclear?

Trump's whole agenda will be DOA as far as the Democrats are concerned. You can forget about any health care reform, unless Ryan can get all Republicans on board, which is unlikely.

Beyond that, the prospect of the government being shut down looks all the more probable when the current short-term funding bill expires this month. When that happens, Republicans will take the blame, and they will not get any sympathy of voters after the health-care bill fiasco, which voters rightly saw was a veiled tax-cut scheme for the rich.

Personally, I think that Trump was politically stupid on Gorsuch. He should have extended the Dems an olive branch with a more moderate pick, especially after Obama didn't have his choice, which would have given Trump enough goodwill to get at least some things in his agenda through Congress. No way, now. Trump is basically a lame duck President at this point. I don't think Republican lawmakers are going to stick their necks out for Trump, when that boat is sinking.

Not winning.


It already was.

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 Post subject: Re: SCOTUS Confirmation
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2017 12:58 pm 
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Dignified Rube wrote:
Trump is basically a lame duck President at this point. I don't think Republican lawmakers are going to stick their necks out for Trump, when that boat is sinking.

Not winning.


Yup, Trump has been the nightmare "Never Trumpers" foresaw. Hillary winning would've been a far better outcome for Republicans.


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 Post subject: Re: SCOTUS Confirmation
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Ogie Oglethorpe wrote:
I'm just going to leave this here for everyone bitching about who started it.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/22/opini ... -bork.html


Thanks for posting that Ogie.

But liberals couldn’t just come out and say that. “If this were carried out as an internal Senate debate,” Ann Lewis, the Democratic activist, would later acknowledge, “we would have deep and thoughtful discussions about the Constitution, and then we would lose.” So, instead, the Democrats sought to portray Bork as “a right-wing loony,” to use a phrase in a memo written by the Advocacy Institute, a liberal lobby group.

That's a great line.

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 Post subject: Re: SCOTUS Confirmation
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pittmike wrote:
I don't agree with your take. I think the congress will still work with him to get what they want done. As far as your olive branch no way. One of the main reasons Trump won was that court seat. Whatever supporters he has would lynch him.


Do you think Trump supporters didn't notice how he tried to screw them over with the health-care vote? He represents what they detest---an elite-catering hypocrite.

At their root Trump supporters are patriots. When it looks more and more that you're acting in your own self-interest with the health care vote and the wall proposal, when you bring in your son-in-law and daughter against federal nepotism laws for positions they have no business being in, such patriots will see through Trump's phony baloney and not hesitate to take out their knives on him.


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 Post subject: Re: SCOTUS Confirmation
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2017 1:12 pm 
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Seacrest wrote:
Ogie Oglethorpe wrote:
I'm just going to leave this here for everyone bitching about who started it.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/22/opini ... -bork.html


Thanks for posting that Ogie.

But liberals couldn’t just come out and say that. “If this were carried out as an internal Senate debate,” Ann Lewis, the Democratic activist, would later acknowledge, “we would have deep and thoughtful discussions about the Constitution, and then we would lose.” So, instead, the Democrats sought to portray Bork as “a right-wing loony,” to use a phrase in a memo written by the Advocacy Institute, a liberal lobby group.

That's a great line.


And to this day it remains true. That is why during the latest hearings you heard all of the same herring bone questions to him. Abortion this and guns that. All the while it mattered not that he said it was settled law or that all judges have to put their personal feelings aside.

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 Post subject: Re: SCOTUS Confirmation
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2017 1:17 pm 
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I do find it interesting that the Democrats, who were mad that the Republicans wouldn't confirm Obama's guy in his last year have basically went and done the exact same thing(besides the last year thing probably).

The Democrats just do a terrible job as coming off as anything more than Republicans with a different marketing strategy.

I wonder if they would have done better if they had simply said "We didn't like what they did with Obama's nominee but we will attempt to work with Republicans going forward and will not fight this one". Instead, it's basically just setting up another "Party of No" situation.

It seems more and more obvious that both sides think they can solidify their jobs by playing the "Us vs. Them" game.

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 Post subject: Re: SCOTUS Confirmation
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2017 1:20 pm 
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Boilermaker Rick wrote:
I do find it interesting that the Democrats, who were mad that the Republicans wouldn't confirm Obama's guy in his last year have basically went and done the exact same thing(besides the last year thing probably).

The Democrats just do a terrible job as coming off as anything more than Republicans with a different marketing strategy.

I wonder if they would have done better if they had simply said "We didn't like what they did with Obama's nominee but we will attempt to work with Republicans going forward and will not fight this one". Instead, it's basically just setting up another "Party of No" situation.

It seems more and more obvious that both sides think they can solidify their jobs by playing the "Us vs. Them" game.


They will continue to play Us vs Them as long as we allow it.

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 Post subject: Re: SCOTUS Confirmation
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2017 1:26 pm 
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Boilermaker Rick wrote:
I do find it interesting that the Democrats, who were mad that the Republicans wouldn't confirm Obama's guy in his last year have basically went and done the exact same thing(besides the last year thing probably).

The Democrats just do a terrible job as coming off as anything more than Republicans with a different marketing strategy.

I wonder if they would have done better if they had simply said "We didn't like what they did with Obama's nominee but we will attempt to work with Republicans going forward and will not fight this one". Instead, it's basically just setting up another "Party of No" situation.

It seems more and more obvious that both sides think they can solidify their jobs by playing the "Us vs. Them" game.

It's the correct strategy, unfortunately.


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 Post subject: Re: SCOTUS Confirmation
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2017 1:29 pm 
Boilermaker Rick wrote:
I do find it interesting that the Democrats, who were mad that the Republicans wouldn't confirm Obama's guy in his last year have basically went and done the exact same thing(besides the last year thing probably).

The Democrats just do a terrible job as coming off as anything more than Republicans with a different marketing strategy.

I wonder if they would have done better if they had simply said "We didn't like what they did with Obama's nominee but we will attempt to work with Republicans going forward and will not fight this one". Instead, it's basically just setting up another "Party of No" situation.

It seems more and more obvious that both sides think they can solidify their jobs by playing the "Us vs. Them" game.

I think they know that if they caved on this one the GOP would just do it when Kennedy or RBG or whomever else is close to retirement or death opened up the next spot. May as well just do it now and get it over with.


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 Post subject: Re: SCOTUS Confirmation
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2017 1:33 pm 
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Baby McNown wrote:
Boilermaker Rick wrote:
I do find it interesting that the Democrats, who were mad that the Republicans wouldn't confirm Obama's guy in his last year have basically went and done the exact same thing(besides the last year thing probably).

The Democrats just do a terrible job as coming off as anything more than Republicans with a different marketing strategy.

I wonder if they would have done better if they had simply said "We didn't like what they did with Obama's nominee but we will attempt to work with Republicans going forward and will not fight this one". Instead, it's basically just setting up another "Party of No" situation.

It seems more and more obvious that both sides think they can solidify their jobs by playing the "Us vs. Them" game.

I think they know that if they caved on this one the GOP would just do it when Kennedy or RBG or whomever else is close to retirement or death opened up the next spot. May as well just do it now and get it over with.
The problem is that this guy was qualified and justifiable even if he wouldn't be the ideal choice for the Democrats. Now, the Republicans can nominate anyone and say "It doesn't matter because the Democrats are saying no regardless".

I'm sure they can now use the #resist hash tag and feel good for a day or two about it but the Democrats can't expect things to change if they just steal the Republican playbook for the last 8 years.

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 Post subject: Re: SCOTUS Confirmation
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2017 1:38 pm 
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I do not know why the righteous Democrats in our beloved country and government are worried about. All they have to do is take the high ground that they perch upon and change the rule back once they again gain the senate majority. :D

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