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 Post subject: Re: Alex Jones
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2017 1:51 pm 
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Bagels wrote:
Boilermaker Rick wrote:
Bagels wrote:
I'm aware, i paid it myself for i think 2 years or so. We put 5% down if i recall. After 2 years there was at least a decent amount of principal paid down so i had an appraisal done and between the two was able to get rid of it.
We did it similarly though our big issue was that we were required to have a certain amount of money in the bank after we paid the down payment so getting to 20% was difficult. We saved enough over the first two years to then pay down the rest to get rid of it.

Rent in NY was really high though so even with PMI we were paying roughly the same so it wasn't really much of a choice.


Yea, honestly I think one of the best decisions we made (getting married certainly wasn't one) was not getting the max we were approved for. The house we ended up getting was probably 50K less than what we could have purchased. But with the PMI and like you mention, various repair (this wasn't a fixer upper but of course any place has things you need to do immediately) I couldn't have imagined paying too much more on the mortgage. I think that's another issue aside from putting no money down, just because you're approved for a 300K mortgage doesn't mean you necessarily should buy the most expensive house you can afford

On top of that, if you are looking at the top of your budget, you'll get a lot of rejected offers. If you're approved for $200k and make an offer on a $200k house, you'll lose in any case where there are multiple offers on the table. That's becoming more common in the current market as there is a housing inventory shortage.

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 Post subject: Re: Alex Jones
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2017 1:52 pm 
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Ogie Oglethorpe wrote:
pittmike wrote:
I have been told some people also borrow against their own 401k to put 20% down. Then you pay interest to yourself rather than the higher PMI to the man.

That's such an awful idea. The tax penalties for that are higher than the interest today (plus whatever you take out isn't going to be earning anything)

Just today if you take out for 401k to pay down a mortgage, you are sacrificing 8% growth to pay down 3-4% interest. Maybe in the 70s when you had inflation going crazy and high interest rates that *might* have made sense.

There were no tax penalties. It was borrowing from the account, and part of the features of the 401k my company has. As long as I could prove that I put it towards down payment and closing costs should I be audited, no tax or penalty owed.

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 Post subject: Re: Alex Jones
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2017 1:53 pm 
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Ogie Oglethorpe wrote:
pittmike wrote:
I have been told some people also borrow against their own 401k to put 20% down. Then you pay interest to yourself rather than the higher PMI to the man.

That's such an awful idea. The tax penalties for that are higher than the interest today (plus whatever you take out isn't going to be earning anything)

Just today if you take out for 401k to pay down a mortgage, you are sacrificing 8% growth to pay down 3-4% interest. Maybe in the 70s when you had inflation going crazy and high interest rates that *might* have made sense.


I wasn't mentioning this to pay down interest. Back when this was popular it was to avoid the PMI only and get your down payment up to the 20% threshold. As for tax penalties there are none as long as you do not default on paying yourself back. Then it becomes a withdrawal with penalty and income tax ramifications.

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 Post subject: Re: Alex Jones
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2017 1:59 pm 
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Chet Coppock's Fur Coat wrote:
Ogie Oglethorpe wrote:
pittmike wrote:
I have been told some people also borrow against their own 401k to put 20% down. Then you pay interest to yourself rather than the higher PMI to the man.

That's such an awful idea. The tax penalties for that are higher than the interest today (plus whatever you take out isn't going to be earning anything)

Just today if you take out for 401k to pay down a mortgage, you are sacrificing 8% growth to pay down 3-4% interest. Maybe in the 70s when you had inflation going crazy and high interest rates that *might* have made sense.

There were no tax penalties. It was borrowing from the account, and part of the features of the 401k my company has. As long as I could prove that I put it towards down payment and closing costs should I be audited, no tax or penalty owed.

Perhaps the law changed, but today if you borrow against your 401k you pay your tax rate plus a 10% penalty.

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 Post subject: Re: Alex Jones
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2017 2:02 pm 
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Ogie Oglethorpe wrote:
Chet Coppock's Fur Coat wrote:
Ogie Oglethorpe wrote:
pittmike wrote:
I have been told some people also borrow against their own 401k to put 20% down. Then you pay interest to yourself rather than the higher PMI to the man.

That's such an awful idea. The tax penalties for that are higher than the interest today (plus whatever you take out isn't going to be earning anything)

Just today if you take out for 401k to pay down a mortgage, you are sacrificing 8% growth to pay down 3-4% interest. Maybe in the 70s when you had inflation going crazy and high interest rates that *might* have made sense.

There were no tax penalties. It was borrowing from the account, and part of the features of the 401k my company has. As long as I could prove that I put it towards down payment and closing costs should I be audited, no tax or penalty owed.

Perhaps the law changed, but today if you borrow against your 401k you pay your tax rate plus a 10% penalty.

Thanks Trump.

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 Post subject: Re: Alex Jones
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2017 2:03 pm 
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Ogie Oglethorpe wrote:
Chet Coppock's Fur Coat wrote:
Ogie Oglethorpe wrote:
pittmike wrote:
I have been told some people also borrow against their own 401k to put 20% down. Then you pay interest to yourself rather than the higher PMI to the man.

That's such an awful idea. The tax penalties for that are higher than the interest today (plus whatever you take out isn't going to be earning anything)

Just today if you take out for 401k to pay down a mortgage, you are sacrificing 8% growth to pay down 3-4% interest. Maybe in the 70s when you had inflation going crazy and high interest rates that *might* have made sense.

There were no tax penalties. It was borrowing from the account, and part of the features of the 401k my company has. As long as I could prove that I put it towards down payment and closing costs should I be audited, no tax or penalty owed.

Perhaps the law changed, but today if you borrow against your 401k you pay your tax rate plus a 10% penalty.


That's if you withdraw, not if you borrow.

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 Post subject: Re: Alex Jones
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2017 2:54 pm 
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leashyourkids wrote:
Ogie Oglethorpe wrote:
Chet Coppock's Fur Coat wrote:
Ogie Oglethorpe wrote:
pittmike wrote:
I have been told some people also borrow against their own 401k to put 20% down. Then you pay interest to yourself rather than the higher PMI to the man.

That's such an awful idea. The tax penalties for that are higher than the interest today (plus whatever you take out isn't going to be earning anything)

Just today if you take out for 401k to pay down a mortgage, you are sacrificing 8% growth to pay down 3-4% interest. Maybe in the 70s when you had inflation going crazy and high interest rates that *might* have made sense.

There were no tax penalties. It was borrowing from the account, and part of the features of the 401k my company has. As long as I could prove that I put it towards down payment and closing costs should I be audited, no tax or penalty owed.

Perhaps the law changed, but today if you borrow against your 401k you pay your tax rate plus a 10% penalty.


That's if you withdraw, not if you borrow.

You are correct, however I do see if you lose your job or change jobs, the entire sum becomes due in 90 days or else it is subject to your tax rate plus a 10% penalty.

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 Post subject: Re: Alex Jones
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2017 4:17 pm 
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pittmike wrote:
Bagels wrote:
Boilermaker Rick wrote:
Those loans default at much higher levels.


so let's add an additional fee to them, that should help !


I don't think you fully understand this. People are less likely to just walk away from a home if they have 20% of their own cash already in it. People putting 1-3% on a home just leave when things take a shit in their lives. You get that right?



That depends and I am not sure how you regulate this. If someone does not live above their means. If you bought a $150k house and mortgage ended up being roughly $1000 a month vs paying $1500 in rent somewhere else. Make people take a finance class of some sort? as part of the process.


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