The protagonist is so fucking insufferable.

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so I guess there is going to be a season 2.

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Reality is your friend, not your enemy. -- Seacrest

i finished it tonight.

boy does this really get harder to appreciate as it goes on, and it culminates in a very frustrating "ending". it totally sets up another season, which is really pushing it beyond respectability. but whatever...that's how things go these days. just squeeze everything you can out of it.

the 4 characters i identified the most with were alex, justin, jessica, and clay. hannah is absolutely reprehensible in the final act for blaming everyone including the guidance counselor for her own inability to take any accountability for anything.

the counselor tries his best to get her to say something about what she went through. will she admit she was assaulted? no. will she confirm she didn't consent? no. will she say who did it? no. but she wanted the counselor to go after her after she left the room? like there aren't hundreds of other students to deal with. it's all about her. same thing with clay, when she tells him to "go the fuck away", and then expects him to come back to her to rescue her from her own hell.

it makes sense a completely tone deaf celebrity like selena gomez would endorse this and fund it. she probably identifies the most with hannah, which is this series' fatal flaw.

sure, its heart is in the right place. but some of the characters you're supposed to like, you despise. and the ones you're probably supposed to despise, you start to feel kinda sorry for.

it's a failure of a good premise and a promising product.

out of

best part about it is the soundtrack, really.

I wanna kill my self after just reading this thread. W_Z, your tape is first.

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-- source

Question, redskin. why didn't you stop me?

...why didn't anyone stop me? you could've helped.

everyone could've helped.

now it's too late.

Just started it a few days ago. At episode 6 now. The girl that kills herself isn't sympathetic at all so far, are we supposed to feel bad for her because halfway thru I don't .

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I am the liquor Randy

Glamorizing suicide not a good thing apparently...

http://www.slate.com/blogs/browbeat/201 ... asons.html

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Why are only 14 percent of black CPS 11th-graders proficient in English?

Everyone is pretty fucking terrible.

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the makers of this shit are geniuses. with all the bad pub parents will ban their kids from watching which will ensure 100% of teenagers will watch it.

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Reality is your friend, not your enemy. -- Seacrest

Finished it last night.

Not great, not bad either, definitely not for kids.
The actor who played clay was the best part of the show aside from the soundtrack. I didn't like how the focus all season is on Hannah and then the last episode tho they basically say forget Hannah because we're setting up a second season.

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I am the liquor Randy

I'm on episode 2 now. Should I finish it?

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Yes.

If only so I can hear your reaction to the series as a whole at the end.

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Episode 2 was better than episode 1. I'm intrigued by how Tony ties into this whole thing.

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season 2 officially dropped on friday i think. i really didn't want to give it a chance, but we were really bored on saturday night so decided to see how it could go.

it's actually better than the 1st season so far. we're 5 episodes in. there's still some grandstanding, and some really bad cliches (hannah is now basically a ghost in clay's mind...like...mr. robot).

but, it's surprisingly more watchable. it's based around the trial brought against the school. the defense attorney is really goddamn annoying. she's so purposefully antagonizing to the witnesses to basically make hannah look like she brought it all on herself. you'd think that this would mean she's the voice of us, since we were all complaining about her character and how self-righteous she was. but this character is very weakly written, and she just comes off as bitchy.

i didn't rewatch season 1 but there are some characters that now appear to know more about hannah than we had known. another device i don't like. so during the trial, we go back in time again to get a feel for why these witnesses are being brought to trial. like the gay guy in the cafe.

but for the most part, i like this season better. it's kind of like watching "90210" now or something. but it's funny that after all the flack the show took last year from angry parents and blogs, that now they have an advisory at the end of each episode encouraging kids to get help if they're suffering.

my favorite character so far this season is the guidance counselor, played by derek luke. clay is actually a little more pathetic this season.

finished this last night. a lot of conflicting thoughts and stuff. i did really like the first 5 episodes of this season. then it really started to sink low.

basically call this "13 Witnesses Why". we get all these testimonies from students and suddenly all these subplots emerge that were never present (nor hinted at) in the first season.

just like the idiot "Lost" writers, these guys/gals try to fill in plot holes to keep the season going.

case in point, the zach/hannah love story. where the fuck did this come from. it makes no sense, and it really sticks out like a sore thumb considering that even if hannah wanted to keep it a secret...why wouldn't zach have had a tape in season 1 when everyfuckingone else did. that makes no sense, and it's just literally the writers saying, "well, we made it up because we needed to keep the story going." yeah fuck you. it's weak.

however, it would have been a very sweet story had it been genuinely created. hannah and zach do have a chemistry, and they would have pulled it off convincingly had we bought into them even knowing each other in the first place. it's contrived, and it doesn't fit. on its own, however, it is sweet. i think my favorite substory has always been the movie theater. that was always my favorite bit in the first season: hannah and clay working there.

the trial is an absolute joke. the defense attorney gets her way each time she has an objection, the prosecution is completely cucked, and yet hannah's mom seems to take no issue with the line of questioning or cross examinations. it's such an obvious plot device, and it really brings down the quality of the season.

but, it does redeem itself in the final 2 episodes. we do get one more contrived subplot involving Tyler (the photographer creeper), but we also get some very tender moments in the final episode that provide some closure for hannah's story.

hannah the ghost is also very weak. and, doesn't help clay's character development. he's basically a whiny crybaby through most of the season, besides getting his ass kicked *again*...and...*again*.

if you didn't get through season 1, don't bother with this. it'll still annoy the shit out of you. but if you found a way to salvage some feelings for these characters, give this a chance.

i think overall it has its heart in the right place. there is a lot of grandstanding (or, nowadays "virtue signaling"); but, there is some truth in it and some genuine emotion.

there's some graphic stuff that wasn't at all necessary, but it moves the meters and will get people talking. if you have teenage kids, i think this season has far more breadth to it and can start more meaningful conversations than the 1st season did.

after this, hannah's gone from the show. that actually makes me optimistic about a 3rd season. the rest of the characters are well drawn out, and i'd still like to see where they go.

Not disagreeing with your assesment of the show at all, i pretty much think you nailed it, but i thought zach did have a tape in season one? I agree that some of the holes they filled this year were totally out of nowhere, but i think what they were trying to do was flip things around whereas in season one they focused on hannah being the sympathetic character, season two they tried to dirty her up a lot more to show that she wasnt simply an innocent victim, she caused a lot of her own shit. There was something about this show that kept pulling me in, i couldnt stop watching it. That high school was so fucking unrealistic it was laughable and seriously, there must be twice as many gay kids in that school as there are straight! Its like shit, we get it already, there are gay kids in high school, thanks for the subtle reminder.

Mofo, you’re right. He did have a tape, I double checked after I posted that. But, it had to do with a class project and still didn’t mention anything related to a bond that they had. So still, it’s contrived.

I didn’t have a problem believing the gay angle but I love that they cast a kid to play Alex that is clearly gay to portray a straight kid.

As David Cross said: Not every gay man had that voice. But only gay men have that voice.

WZ can watch this shit, but can't find the time for Breaking Bad.


If it was possible, I'd have even less respect for you right now.

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i am watching "breaking bad". it's just very slow going because my wife doesn't like it and i have to find time to watch it among doing other things. so far i'm still in the 1st season and i like it but i've heard it gets a lot better as it goes on. so i'm looking forward to that.

i'll post about it when i'm done with it...which might be a while.

I am 4 episodes into season two, so far it is just alright. Not sure exactly where it is all going. I originally thought that this series would have
been fine doing a one and done.

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Flew too close to the sun on wings of pastrami

Their ability to just add witnesses and evidence on the fly was hilarious.

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-- source

Half way through this season. It's honestly bad and should never have been made. The 1st season worked as they had a story to adapt onto the screen. With this season, they really have no source material and in many ways are rewriting things into the 1st season timeline that didn't happen.

This should've been a one-and-done miniseries

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“When I walked in this morning, and saw the flag was at half mast, I thought 'alright another bureaucrat ate it.'" - Ron Swanson

I finished the episode with the big Asian jock and kind of feel the same way. So the main character was conveniently not home for the entire summer?
I'm watching to see how it comes out now but I think as I mentioned after the first season, they could have left this alone and it would have been just
fine with me.

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Flew too close to the sun on wings of pastrami

Agreed.
I have teenage children and each year we hear of a kid in school committing suicide. I think the entire story / show / book is in horrible taste and I refuse to have anything to do with it.

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Watched a few more of these yesterday and somehow that school counselor managed to become a somewhat likeable character after he
stepped up in court.

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Flew too close to the sun on wings of pastrami

Finally finished this up. I am sure there has to be a 3rd season now thanks to that last episode, although I have no idea where that will
actually take us. I was kind of rooting for the kid to get into the dance, but I am sure that would have been way too controversial.

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Flew too close to the sun on wings of pastrami

You know damn well that the show's message is being well received when you find yourself rooting for the kid to shoot the dance up

I had this same feeling...this can go away now.

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I am glad I wasn’t the only one. I felt kind of guilty about it but after watching this show I kind of think that whole school needs to go.

somehow this keeps getting approved. a very astute YouTube comment pointed out that at this point it's "Pretty Little Liars". it's also like "Riverdale".

3rd season trailer:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pws-LN_-riM

i'm assuming it'll be 13 episodes again. now it's 13 reasons why someone was murdered.

I’m a glutton for punishment as i am three episodes into this. Yes a main character goes away and everyone is a suspect. Ugh...

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Flew too close to the sun on wings of pastrami