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 Post subject: Re: Me
PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 12:08 pm 
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DAC wrote:
Jaw Breaker wrote:

To me, the future of education is Khan Academy (or similar). The costs would be dramatically lower, and kids could learn at their own pace. The union opposition would never let that happen.


Have you ever watched Khan Academy?


Of course...highly recommended. Obviously the method is not ideal for every subject, but what's not to like?

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 Post subject: Re: Me
PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 12:24 pm 
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Jaw Breaker wrote:
DAC wrote:
Jaw Breaker wrote:

To me, the future of education is Khan Academy (or similar). The costs would be dramatically lower, and kids could learn at their own pace. The union opposition would never let that happen.


Have you ever watched Khan Academy?


Of course...highly recommended. Obviously the method is not ideal for every subject, but what's not to like?


They are boring as hell. Sure, someone who is motivated will sit and watch them but for a kid who doesn't really care about his education.....

I watched a couple of those in order to tutor my nephew in chemistry a couple years back and they were brutal.

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 Post subject: Re: Me
PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 12:40 pm 
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KDdidit wrote:
Why should they work for free in those 2 months?
Most people have to do some things "off the clock".

FavreFan wrote:
I think I missed something. What is the OP referencing?
I've started to see a fair amount of lamenting about the life of a teacher as we approach the end of summer vacation and I finally decided to take a stand.

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 Post subject: Re: Me
PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 1:13 pm 
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Boilermaker Rick wrote:
Hatchetman wrote:
How do you evaluate teachers?
Number of glasses of wine needed at the end of the day.

:lol: Single Moms use the same scale.

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 Post subject: Re: Me
PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 1:15 pm 
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I do get a kick out of the Jewels posting a "Back to School" sign in the wine aisle. Is that for the parents or teachers? Probably both.

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 Post subject: Re: Me
PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 1:26 pm 
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Boilermaker Rick wrote:
KDdidit wrote:
Why should they work for free in those 2 months?
Most people have to do some things "off the clock".

FavreFan wrote:
I think I missed something. What is the OP referencing?
I've started to see a fair amount of lamenting about the life of a teacher as we approach the end of summer vacation and I finally decided to take a stand.


Criticizing people for not working for free seems like something Dan would do. "They should be lucky to work for free to make their benevolent administrators look better!"


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 Post subject: Re: Me
PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 1:32 pm 
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KDdidit wrote:
Criticizing people for not working for free seems like something Dan would do. "They should be lucky to work for free to make their benevolent administrators look better!"
The criticism was not about not working for free. It's about telling the world every chance they get that something about their job sucks.

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 Post subject: Re: Me
PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 1:58 pm 
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Boilermaker Rick wrote:
The criticism was not about not working for free. It's about telling the world every chance they get that something about their job sucks.


I don't know what circles you run in but I have quite a few teacher friends and family members. I haven't heard a single complaint about going back to work, spending their own money on school supplies, or having to plan a lesson instead of watching GoT. I would have thought if they complain every chance they get that I might see something on Facebook or on the group chats. Hell, I went to a game last week with a teacher buddy and he didn't mention his job all night.

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 Post subject: Re: Me
PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 2:00 pm 
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DAC wrote:
Boilermaker Rick wrote:
The criticism was not about not working for free. It's about telling the world every chance they get that something about their job sucks.


I don't know what circles you run in but I have quite a few teacher friends and family members. I haven't heard a single complaint about going back to work, spending their own money on school supplies, or having to plan a lesson instead of watching GoT. I would have thought if they complain every chance they get that I might see something on Facebook or on the group chats. Hell, I went to a game last week with a teacher buddy and he didn't mention his job all night.
You are right. It's never brought up anywhere. I just made it all up. How did you see through my evil teacher hating propaganda?

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 Post subject: Re: Me
PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 2:05 pm 
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KDdidit wrote:
Criticizing people for not working for free seems like something Dan would do. "They should be lucky to work for free to make their benevolent administrators look better!"


Speaking of Dan, he gets paid to put on a daily radio show. Technically speaking, he's "working for free" when he watches the Cubs, Bears, and Bulls and devises (more like derives) "content" for his show by reading Deadspin.

Dan's show is ostensibly a sports talk show, and the only--again ostensible--requirement is that he show up prepared to talk about relevant sporting topics when his show starts, how he arrives at that level of preparedness is not up to Mitch or anyone else, his compensation for that preparedness is wrapped up in the absurd amount of money he receives for the relative amount of "work" actually done.

Seems to me that it is reasonable to expect a salaried teacher to arrive to work with a lesson plan ready for their subject, regardless of how or when they arrived at it, and that their compensation for getting prepared is part of the salary they receive for working ~9 months out of the year.


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 Post subject: Re: Me
PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 2:08 pm 
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And they only get paid for working 9 months of the year too, go figure.


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 Post subject: Re: Me
PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 2:12 pm 
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KDdidit wrote:
And they only get paid for working 9 months of the year too, go figure.


Yeah, their negotiated salaries are paid out over 9 months instead of 12. So?


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 Post subject: Re: Me
PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 2:14 pm 
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Juice's Lecture Notes wrote:
KDdidit wrote:
And they only get paid for working 9 months of the year too, go figure.


Yeah, their negotiated salaries are paid out over 9 months instead of 12. So?


And most teachers I know have the option to spread out the checks so they get regular bi-monthly checks year round.

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 Post subject: Re: Me
PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 2:16 pm 
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So at no point am I ever going to slag people for not working when they don't get paid, that's just bullshit crab mentality. Besides, Terry did fine never watching sports and still having a radio show.


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 Post subject: Re: Me
PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 2:17 pm 
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Hank Scorpio wrote:
Juice's Lecture Notes wrote:
KDdidit wrote:
And they only get paid for working 9 months of the year too, go figure.


Yeah, their negotiated salaries are paid out over 9 months instead of 12. So?


And most teachers I know have the option to spread out the checks so they get regular bi-monthly checks year round.


They're still getting paid for 9 months of work, so?


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 Post subject: Re: Me
PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 2:21 pm 
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Boilermaker Rick wrote:
DAC wrote:
Boilermaker Rick wrote:
The criticism was not about not working for free. It's about telling the world every chance they get that something about their job sucks.


I don't know what circles you run in but I have quite a few teacher friends and family members. I haven't heard a single complaint about going back to work, spending their own money on school supplies, or having to plan a lesson instead of watching GoT. I would have thought if they complain every chance they get that I might see something on Facebook or on the group chats. Hell, I went to a game last week with a teacher buddy and he didn't mention his job all night.
You are right. It's never brought up anywhere. I just made it all up. How did you see through my evil teacher hating propaganda?


You're the one who started this thread. But I guess you are calling yourself a douchebag.

If anything I hear wayyyyy more teacher criticism than teachers complaining about their job. Sure, I hear teachers telling stories but no differently from a friend who is a firemen and another who's a nurse.

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 Post subject: Re: Me
PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 2:23 pm 
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They're not truck drivers or anything. Now there's a group that should complain.


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 Post subject: Re: Me
PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 2:24 pm 
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Juice's Lecture Notes wrote:
KDdidit wrote:
And they only get paid for working 9 months of the year too, go figure.


Yeah, their negotiated salaries are paid out over 9 months instead of 12. So?



Not true of all districts. Mine pays twice a month over twelve, while another district I've worked for gave staff the option of either ten or twelve. Plans can get tweaked from year to year based on the children in that given year. I get paid to teach and part of that includes grading which lets me know whether or not a skill has been mastered. In our district as part of our evaluation tool I need to show progress (in my case by giving a pre, midway, and post exam) as well as examples of other professional competencies. I chose my profession, I understand what is expected, I do my best to be done within contractual hours. If it takes longer, that's what's expected of me...

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 Post subject: Re: Me
PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 2:26 pm 
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Harvard Dan wrote:
Juice's Lecture Notes wrote:
KDdidit wrote:
And they only get paid for working 9 months of the year too, go figure.


Yeah, their negotiated salaries are paid out over 9 months instead of 12. So?



Not true of all districts. Mine pays twice a month over twelve, while another district I've worked for gave staff the option of either ten or twelve. Plans can get tweaked from year to year based on the children in that given year. I get paid to teach and part of that includes grading which lets me know whether or not a skill has been mastered. In our district as part of our evaluation tool I need to show progress (in my case by giving a pre, midway, and post exam) as well as examples of other professional competencies. I chose my profession, I understand what is expected, I do my best to be done within contractual hours. If it takes longer, that's what's expected of me...


:salut: :salut:

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 Post subject: Re: Me
PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 2:27 pm 
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Grading papers = watching a Bears game on TV. Prep is prep. You just don't want to mix the two up and start annotating a book report with stuff about the all-22.

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 Post subject: Re: Me
PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 2:34 pm 
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DAC wrote:
Boilermaker Rick wrote:
DAC wrote:
Boilermaker Rick wrote:
The criticism was not about not working for free. It's about telling the world every chance they get that something about their job sucks.


I don't know what circles you run in but I have quite a few teacher friends and family members. I haven't heard a single complaint about going back to work, spending their own money on school supplies, or having to plan a lesson instead of watching GoT. I would have thought if they complain every chance they get that I might see something on Facebook or on the group chats. Hell, I went to a game last week with a teacher buddy and he didn't mention his job all night.
You are right. It's never brought up anywhere. I just made it all up. How did you see through my evil teacher hating propaganda?


You're the one who started this thread. But I guess you are calling yourself a douchebag.

If anything I hear wayyyyy more teacher criticism than teachers complaining about their job. Sure, I hear teachers telling stories but no differently from a friend who is a firemen and another who's a nurse.
"I haven't heard a single complaint" has certainly changed quickly to "everyone does it".

You convinced me. How hard teachers have it isn't a huge thing that gets mentioned all the time around now.

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 Post subject: Re: Me
PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 2:35 pm 
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Curious Hair wrote:
Grading papers = watching a Bears game on TV. Prep is prep. You just don't want to mix the two up and start annotating a book report with stuff about the all-22.


Agreed, work outside of contractual hours may occur. I choose not to make an issue of it, because the work still needs to get done. If people want to say that I only work nine months out of the year...go ahead...I don't care. I chose the job, I enjoy the job. "Gee, all those firefighters do between runs is sit outside in their comfy chairs, in fact they get paid to sleep." See how easy it is?

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 Post subject: Re: Me
PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 2:36 pm 
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Curious Hair wrote:
Grading papers = watching a Bears game on TV.


Both can be poorly thought out and executed, on top of going on for way too long.


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 Post subject: Re: Me
PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 2:39 pm 
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Harvard Dan wrote:
Agreed, work outside of contractual hours may occur. I choose not to make an issue of it, because the work still needs to get done.


Agreed. It's just absurd to say teachers are only really working during their scheduled class periods.

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 Post subject: Re: Me
PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 2:46 pm 
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Harvard Dan wrote:
Curious Hair wrote:
Grading papers = watching a Bears game on TV. Prep is prep. You just don't want to mix the two up and start annotating a book report with stuff about the all-22.


Agreed, work outside of contractual hours may occur. I choose not to make an issue of it, because the work still needs to get done. If people want to say that I only work nine months out of the year...go ahead...I don't care. I chose the job, I enjoy the job. "Gee, all those firefighters do between runs is sit outside in their comfy chairs, in fact they get paid to sleep." See how easy it is?

HD: Nothing worse than a lazy teacher who does not spend time prepping and revising. I've met many, many lazy teachers. Some of them were also unintelligent and uncreative. They're not even aware of how unskilled they are. They make it easy for people to criticize the teaching profession as a whole.


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 Post subject: Re: Me
PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 2:53 pm 
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The math department seems to be the one most forgiving of bad teachers. If you can't reach your kids as a science or English or history teacher, it's gonna show.

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 Post subject: Re: Me
PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 2:54 pm 
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tommy wrote:
Harvard Dan wrote:
Curious Hair wrote:
Grading papers = watching a Bears game on TV. Prep is prep. You just don't want to mix the two up and start annotating a book report with stuff about the all-22.


Agreed, work outside of contractual hours may occur. I choose not to make an issue of it, because the work still needs to get done. If people want to say that I only work nine months out of the year...go ahead...I don't care. I chose the job, I enjoy the job. "Gee, all those firefighters do between runs is sit outside in their comfy chairs, in fact they get paid to sleep." See how easy it is?

HD: Nothing worse than a lazy teacher who does not spend time prepping and revising. I've met many, many lazy teachers. Some of them were also unintelligent and uncreative. They're not even aware of how unskilled they are. They make it easy for people to criticize the teaching profession as a whole.


I hear what you are saying. I wish members of some education organizations (unions) would hold the membership accountable. Unions are there to protect labor against abusive management types (which I've seen), but they should also as a body demand excellence from the body as well (and offer to mentor those struggling). I know exactly what you are saying, and it is true...it is those that cause criticisms of the whole, especially the ones who are just collecting a paycheck.

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 Post subject: Re: Me
PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 2:58 pm 
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Curious Hair wrote:
The math department seems to be the one most forgiving of bad teachers. If you can't reach your kids as a science or English or history teacher, it's gonna show.


I would agree with this. Each year I feel like I had at least one great teacher for every subject BUT math. I was never any good at it and I don't know if it was because of poor teaching or I thought it was poor teaching because I'm not good at it.

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 Post subject: Re: Me
PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 2:59 pm 
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Like any profession there are good teachers and bad teachers. Assessment of teachers is often subjective and doesn't relate to job performance per se. Assessing teachers based upon the performance of students is fallacious because of the discrepancies in abilities of the students.

I don't believe that the biggest thing plaguing education is the incompetence of teachers. Far from it.

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 Post subject: Re: Me
PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 4:05 pm 
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