I dont think that would have near the effect you seem to think it would.

I believe that would make fans more pissed at the players than ever.

Again, not about mere hypocrisy, it's about hypocrisy that runs completely counter, 90 degrees out of phase, with a person's overall message or brand. Like super-hypocrisy, or something.

Just like with Kaepernick: Lionizing Castro is low-level hypocrisy, but lionizing Castro when you are routinely touting yourself for universal equality and fair treatment from the government is....more than a bit of hypocrisy.

so all it is is a "discussion" to irritate certain people?

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Reality is your friend, not your enemy. -- Seacrest

why? the spin is the athletes are entitled. The spin is they're disrespecting the flag et al. This would fix both and really send a message to the true powers that be that business as usual will not work.

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Ба́бушка гада́ла, да на́двое сказа́ла—то ли до́ждик, то ли снег, то ли бу́дет, то ли нет.

Kneeling, praying, sitting, standing, marching or anything else won't be liked by the majority of white America and some blacks too. That's been fairly clear for centuries.

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Be well

GO BEARS!!!

See this is what happens though. Now we're debating Samantha Bee. The original subject "many forms of protest that are not approved" is completely washed away.

Is that the intent?

Because, again, the list is a valid point.

Is that's what you take away from this? People are protesting injustice and oppression just to irritate white America?

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Be well

GO BEARS!!!

You think refusing to play would make people think they are LESS entitled? Is that why players that holdout are so revered?

Cmon man.

Tell you what, go ask ANY fan who doesn't care for the kneeling what they would do if the players took a week off and get back to me. Sincerely, Id love to hear the responses.

You just said it would not make white people sympathetic to the cause. So then what is the point of it? I'm asking you.

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Reality is your friend, not your enemy. -- Seacrest

I don't think using terms like "white America" or "black America" is particularly helpful though. It assumes that all voices are the same based on skin color. And of course skin color plays a part in our experiences, but countless other things do too.

Maybe you misunderstood what I meant when I said I can understand a black American feeling different about the flag than a white person. I've had this conversation with a white guy who I consider a racist and one of his go-to lines is that "Michelle Obama doesn't love America like I do". My answer is always that her experiences are different than his. You have to be able to at least imagine what it's like to walk in the other guy's shoes.

That's my problem with the latest Coates article. I don't begrudge him his feelings. He just doesn't supply any answers. And beyond that, he's personally doing very well. Much better than most white people I know. I don't think it's right to say that Coates or Marc Lamont Hill are "blacker" than Thomas Sowell or Larry Elder. They all have different viewpoints and happen to be black.

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Freedom is our Strength.

Im just gonna keep answering for Nas like Im the king of the world.


The point is, no matter what white people wont back a movement that doesn't benefit them.


This is a separate point from the actual point of the protest.

the time for that as a method is gone. It's time to seize the power you possess to fight the power you do not have. You're not going to appease, do something that changes the game.

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Ба́бушка гада́ла, да на́двое сказа́ла—то ли до́ждик, то ли снег, то ли бу́дет, то ли нет.

I just can't conceive of this viewpoint. Is that how YOU feel? You are white. At least I think so.

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Reality is your friend, not your enemy. -- Seacrest

RPB isn't white.

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Rick Hahn is the best GM in baseball.

Is there a voting bloc that does?

Also, white people vote for shit that doesn't actually benefit them literally all the time.

Then you missed the point of my initial post.

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Be well

GO BEARS!!!

I am white.

I dont feel that way, but I think there are many who do.

I wouldnt limit it to white people. Empathy, true empathy is rare I think.

It's human nature to care more about yourself than the next guy.

It turns into something worse when you are actively trying to suppress or maintain the unjust status quo

I already posted its not just white people.

And people dont willingly vote against their interests. They vote against the poor because the rich tell them the poor are what's stopping THEM from being rich.

I agree with the the general point that the players are making but I also have to admit that I'm getting fatigued by it being a story every week of the season for the past two years. I blame the recent stuff on Trump and now Pence though. I'd feel the same way if every week we had to hear about global warming or Wall Street though.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Frankly I don't think that this protest has been effective, but ironically Kaepernick's continuing good deeds are getting virtually completely ignored. Especially from the whatabout sects.

I'm still waiting on that group to revert back to the calls to take politics out of sports. Including teams out for the anthem or the flag farce that the NFL has long since cashed the 12 million in checks from the DOD.

As to supplying answers, that's laughable. Step one toward an answer requires an honest self examination of the of this country's history and current status. And MANY have proven themselves to be generally unwilling and or incapable of such.

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There are only two examples of infinity: The universe and human stupidity and I'm not sure about the universe.

This whole thread has got my head spinning. I'm trying to better myself really, but I don't think this is helping.

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Reality is your friend, not your enemy. -- Seacrest

there are empathetic people. They're just a small class. Empathy knows no race. There's empathetic people of all colors.

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Ба́бушка гада́ла, да на́двое сказа́ла—то ли до́ждик, то ли снег, то ли бу́дет, то ли нет.

You bash Kaepernick for lionizing Castro but have you ever bashed Trump for lionizing Putin? What about his comments regarding Neo Nazis?

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The real shame in it all. The guy that starts it and backs it up with his time and money gets left out in the cold and now everyone does it because it's cool to hate on Trump and the message that he was trying to get across is totally lost. Missing the forest for the trees.

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I agree. That's why I said rare instead of non existent.

Yeah, Kaepernick is walking the walk.

Trump is responsible for blowing this thing up and he keeps hitting it because it plays well to many Americans, most of all his core voters.

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Freedom is our Strength.

It is quotes like this one where people wonder about some of the things you say. when someone is discussing something it is not always necessary to have another opinion at all on something else. In this case you get on JLN about Castro but not corresponding Trump criticism.

Why is that? If I am talking to you about Castro why do I have to weigh in on anything else at all?

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Elections have consequences.

Pretty true. Trump took the power away and gave it to the patriots he hopes still support him.

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Elections have consequences.

The message was being ignored long before the president jumped into it again.

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Be well

GO BEARS!!!

JLN don't forget about me.

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Be well

GO BEARS!!!