I'm not really seeing it.

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O judgment! Thou art fled to brutish beasts,
And men have lost their reason.

Well Maddon isn't a good manager.

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Be well

GO BEARS!!!

Im on the "managers dont really matter" side. I think a good one makes a 3-4 game difference at most.


But in the post....holy shit do they matter.

I meant this as a league wide evaluation although it is appropriate here as Dusty might have cost his team the series and Joe is back to mainlining merlot during the playoffs

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O judgment! Thou art fled to brutish beasts,
And men have lost their reason.

Well, there is greater information on both sides, so it might offset.

But shifting doesn't seem to be making much of a dent either other than average strict pull hitters being fazed out.

Not all decisions have a true opponent on the other side, as we saw with Dusty removing Scherzer.

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O judgment! Thou art fled to brutish beasts,
And men have lost their reason.

Dusty is not a good case. He trusts his gut more than Kaplan.

Joe seems to like to go against the data, just to prove his geniusness (when it happens to work out for him).

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If Joe makes a dumb move to cost the Cubs this series,I wonder if Dusty's son will sit on his lap.

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favrefan said:"Chris Coghlan isn't gonna pay your rent, Jimmy."

It's probably a wash. They have data that helps make more informed decisions, but that same data can also cause people not to use common sense. When Maddon pulled Hendricks for Lester in game 7, I heard all these sabre nerds like Bernstein talk about how it was "the right move," given the numbers. I'm not even sure what numbers they were referring to, but the numbers were wrong if that was the case.

Dusty pulling Scherzer yesterday was criminally stupid, but who knows if that was even based on data or numbers.

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I think managers will often take the path that's open to less second-guessing. In my opinion, Scherzer should have been left in to face an emotionally-wrecked Schwarber, but Dusty may have been thinking that if Schwarber goes deep, Dusty looks horrible, whereas if Almora gets a single, the optics aren't as bad.

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This.

What if "the numbers" said it was the right move to pull Scherzer after 5 innings. Would it have been the 'wrong move' to leave him in even though he had a no-no going?

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Not really.

He is by the book for the most part. He just has poor timing usually.

That's possible. I agree on the less second guessing but I think it would be hard to criticize leaving Scherzer in no matter what. I dont think Dusty would look horrible.


Dusty is waaaayyy too married to bullpen roles. Should have been Dolittle to face Rizzo.

I'm thinking of pitchers batting 8th and Schwarber leading off, which were notable for having zero basis in reality and the stubbornness that he held on to them as long as he did. I just think he feels the need to prove his value by being visibly contrarian. But perhaps you are right that for the most part he's no different than anyone else.

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There was no way Schwarber was standing on the on deck circle feeling confident in having to face Scherzer but Dusty managed as if it were so.

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O judgment! Thou art fled to brutish beasts,
And men have lost their reason.

Pitchers batting eighth was a Brain Genius La Russa idea first and it was dumb then too.

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Schwarber (power guy with high obp-failed but that's the idea) leading off is not Maddon's idea. That's been sliding into play for years. The Indians led off Carlos Santana last year.

Pitchers batting 8th falls into that look how smart I am category though. I agree there.

Plus, I think he would have been swinging out of his shoes to make up for the blunder. Scherzer would have made him look foolish.

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Every criticism/praise is framed by the outcome. For instance, if CJ gives up a homer to Harper in Monday's game, these boards (and the media) would be ripping Maddon relentlessly for making the same mistake in two games and losing the series for the Cubs. Instead, Maddon looks like a great leader of men by going right back to his set-up guy and giving him another chance because Edwards had a clean inning.

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Hawaii (fuck) You

This is true, too. The reality is that the ends justify the means, and a lot of times it's a crapshoot (sorry Rick!)

Dusty's move yesterday was dumb before and after, though.

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Except that his starter was on a 100 pitch count limit. If Scherzer gets hurts after throwing 110, then Dusty is ripped again for overtaxing his starter when he knew the guy was coming off an injury. If the reliever comes in and does his job, we aren't talking about that move. All framed by outcomes.

Maddon looks good because Rizzo's pop up fell between three fielders. Dusty looks like a moron, when frankly, his pitcher got Rizzo to hit a ball that is caught 90+ percent of the time.

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Hawaii (fuck) You

Wait, are you saying there's luck involved in baseball?

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This series is funny... you got Maddon who will be a numbers slave and make the wrong call and you got dusty who ignores numbers and will make the wrong call.

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"Play until it hurts, then play until it hurts to not play."
http://soundcloud.com/darkside124 HOF 2013, MM Champion 2014

There's a ton of chaos theory in baseball- the bat breaks and the ball dribbles in front of the third basemen for a hit. If the bat doesn't break it is a regular ground out. Baseball is full of stuff that is random and tough to quantify.

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Hawaii (fuck) You

Good observation.

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Hawaii (fuck) You

Eh...Schwarber is pretty good about working at bats. Who knows what he would have done though yesterday after that.


But Dusty ignoring numbers as usual. Almora KILLS LHP. KILLS.

Almora vs LHP: .342
Schwarber vs RHP: .221

To say nothing of the fact the RHP is one of the best hitters of this generation and the other guy had a fucking 5.88 ERA this year.

Oh and Sean DoLittle retired Rizzo in their only meeting and holds LHP to .146 avg
Oliver Perez has given up 2 HR's to Rizzo and gives up .227 to LHP


Damn, Dusty

More information is certainly resulting in better RPB posts!

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Hawaii (fuck) You

Give me Maddon and his miscues all day.

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"He is a loathsome, offensive brute
--yet I can't look away."

Thank you....I think