Payroll taxes are a terrible system as you mentioned above.

Nothing about his whole process is reform!

Doubling the estate tax exemption is nice for the ultra wealthy (and 0.6% of farmers).

Cool, so you want to offer a tax cut to people in California and NY because their top rates on income exceeds 50%?

13.3% in Cali
State 8.8% City 3.9%

Damn I didn't know you were in favor of the rich....see how fucked up this all is?

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Hawaii (fuck) You

let's be honest those plans are turning into pyramid schemes, and like all other pyramid schemes, they run dry as soon as the number of people at the top nears the number of people paying in. I just wish I could take my god damn payroll tax (and being self employed I pay the full damn amount) and put that right into a Vanguard index fund. Heck, when the system was originally devised, the self employed were exempt.

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“When I walked in this morning, and saw the flag was at half mast, I thought 'alright another bureaucrat ate it.'" - Ron Swanson

Progressiveman

Yeah because they paid 40% on their income and that wasn't enough. For the ultra wealthy that extra does very little. The ultimate repeal will though.

If you double the exemption, someone with $100M now has to pay on $90M rather $95M. But yeah for a $10M estate, 100% cut.

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Hawaii (fuck) You

The payroll tax sucks, but as KW alluded to, it's not enough to fund the current commitments. And yes we all wish we could invest those dollars for ourselves. Check out the Aussie system (called supers). It is great.

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Hawaii (fuck) You

I guess I put the ultra rich level a little lower.

Maybe I need to update my thinking on the numbers but an 8 million dollar estate seems pretty good.

Jesus you sound like my father in law who gets all his news from FOX.

Fuck 'em. If you make over $1MM/year pay 99% tax for all I'm concerned. You going to work less hard because your taxes go up? Tax foreign income 100%. If you don't like it GTFO.

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Reality is your friend, not your enemy. -- Seacrest

I literally just turned 30. I know that I will never see a dime of what I put into it. My wife and I are planning for retirement with the assumption that we will pay into social security, but will not see anything from it.

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“When I walked in this morning, and saw the flag was at half mast, I thought 'alright another bureaucrat ate it.'" - Ron Swanson

Let's be honest here. The whole plan is really to "fix" the business side of the equation. And I could write five paragraphs on why it is a very good long term thing for America. We will finally have a competitive corporate tax regime from a tax percentage perspective. But more importantly, we move to the global standard, which is a territorial tax system. Every other country does that. If you want more on this, I am happy to outlined why that is so important.

The individual side would have been a much deeper reform but for the high state deduction issue. As it stands, they are dumping many of the silly little deductions that complicate the code. Plus they are dumping the absolutely stupid AMT system that only hits the upper middle class, not the intended wealthy. It is reform, but not done well.

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Hawaii (fuck) You

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Elections have consequences.

Now we're getting to the heart of it. You want the government to take ALL their income. It is amazing that you and many others think their income is better served in the government's hand. Then we can all work in government jobs when there is no incentive to own and run a business. See Cuba and Venezuela.

It's ok. Many people think like you.

I don't watch Fox News. I read the WSJ. I read the Tax Bill. I follow CNBC. I want America to succeed for everyone.

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Hawaii (fuck) You

I feel what you are saying. People said the same thing when I was 20. I am 50 now and it is still likely I will collect SS. Someway the system will be in place for you. What it looks like I do not know but the idea will not disappear completely. No one would propose that.

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Elections have consequences.

A temporary cut of less than $50 a pay period for the average American. Remember when Republicans complained about a temporary tax cut of $40 8 years ago?

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Be well

GO BEARS!!!

Dennis, what I think we see here these days is what I call the "Regular Reader Reagan Fear Syndrome". People still live in the past or were trained to still think about that awful term trickle down. I won't try to debate the past here but people don't see how different the climate is now. With global companies, different world markets and various other factors there are real reasons like the ones you outline that this is good. People do not want to trust that any of it trickles into a better overall US economy. They can only see the 1% and big companies getting more.

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Elections have consequences.

So you are saying, trickle down hasnt worked in the past, but it will now in this climate?

No I think it worked in the past and will now.

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Elections have consequences.

Lowering the corporate tax rate would undoubtedly be a good thing.

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Oh.

It worked in the past?

Rich got richer and the middle and lower class stayed the same.

Income gap grew exponentially.

But sure, it worked in the past.

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Yeah, wow.

Here is the thing, they would literally GTFO, and with them would come their capital and the jobs that capital creates.

This is why communism fails.

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“When I walked in this morning, and saw the flag was at half mast, I thought 'alright another bureaucrat ate it.'" - Ron Swanson

Trickle down is just a loaded political term. Here is how any real corporate finance person thinks about allocating capital:

Everything is done with an eye towards payback period (how long to recover your investment) and IRR/NPV. The IRR is the rate of return on the project and must clear an internal hurdle rate. For most businesses the hurdle rate is 10-12%, which is their cost of capital. The NPV is simply another way to look at IRR and shows how profitable a project is above your cost of capital in dollar terms.

Businesses discount the cash flow at their cost of capital. The cash flow is directly impacted by the corporate tax rate. If a project expects to generate $10M per year in pretax income, here is the impact:

at 35%, they will have $6.5M in profits/cash flow.
at 20%, they will have $8M in profits/cash flow.


As such, at 20%, more projects will clear the hurdle rate. It is a massive difference and creates a lot of extra business activity. The same logic applies to acquisition, investments, and plenty other areas where the tax calculation is part of the discounted cash flow analysis.

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Hawaii (fuck) You

How about 46% Hatchet...https://www.politico.com/agenda/story/2 ... ket-000570

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Differing opinions is one thing, but somewhere along the line, it came acceptable to work with different facts.

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Good people drink good beer - Hunter S. Thompson

<º)))><

Waiting for the time when I can finally say
That this has all been wonderful, but now I'm on my way

That's fine but only on the next $200K. Should go to infinity.

Real conservatives don't spend money they don't have. They don't run up trillions of dollars in debt to let some other future generation deal with the shit.

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Reality is your friend, not your enemy. -- Seacrest

Fixed

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So you do believe in what is known as trickle down economics, then?

To be fair, I'm not sure how someone would "believe" in trickle down economics. What does "believing" in trickle down economics mean? a 40% tax rate? A 70% tax rate? All of us must "believe" in trickle down economics to some extent or we'd be Communist.

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