They didn't get Marlo though. You guys are saying they didn't even get him to stop being a kingpin.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

The biggest crime is this terrible quote tag usage.

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Rick Hahn is the best GM in baseball.

I guess that's right. I just think faking murders sounds like they were picking off homeless people and pinning it on someone else.

The more accurate description would be to say they used unsolvable murders and random deaths to advance their agenda.


If the time jump was a couple of months, that doesnt matter.

Marlo's ending was perfect for his character. Its completely obvious what his ending will be.


I mean, that's like complaining they didnt time jump to Duquan overdosing or Mike eventually getting killed.

So defensive? I think it's just a few folks disagreeing with you. Your last sentence here is irrelevant. If you only watched Season 5 half of it wouldn't make any sense. You could say the same about most serialized shows.

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Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

Marlo's ending was SOLID. He got everything Stringer ever wanted and he couldn't be more miserable.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

Marlo was arrested just like Avon was in season 1. Because of the set up of these gangs and well paid lawyers, the kingpin doesn't do a lot of time the first time he's caught.

The obvious assumption is back to the life will lead to jail or murder.

Exactly. That showed the pointlessness of everything. They did so much work for 5 seasons and at the end of the day, nothing mattered. Valchak ended up Commish!

The only people that were rewarded were the ones that shut up and went along with the status quo.

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Yep. Too much of Avon in him.

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It's more than disagreement. rpb has literally told me every issue I had with Season 5 is wrong.

Come on. I didn't say that you couldn't have a summary of what got them to that point. Season 5, on it's own, is not very strong.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Faking murder, kidnapping, and massive fraud(I know, massive fraud by the police is no big deal) was worth it because nothing mattered and it didn't solve anything. That alternate take doesn't make me like the season either.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

The case is being made that Marlo didn't ever leave the streets and just went back to his old life though.

Seems like there are a lot of contradictions about this.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Most solo seasons of serialized shows don't work on their own. If you read the last 20% of a novel, even with a summary of the first 80%, it would be significantly worse than if you read the entire thing.
I think Season 5 is the weakest of the seasons, but it's still a great season of TV. If the first four are a 98-100 on a 100 point scale season 5 is like a 92.

But RPB isn't getting defensive in this thread. He's just disagreeing with you(sometimes that includes telling the other person they are wrong).


Also, the fake serial killer plot gave us one of the best one liners of the show, paraphrasing: "Just tell me you're not actually the one killing them McNulty."

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

That isn't a critique on season 5, its the entire show. As a natural pessimist, the hopelessness of their cause really appealed to me. I'm sure that says something about who I am as a person.

I think everyone would agree season 5 was the weakest. Do you want RPB to admit that? I cant imagine he would argue that.

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I don't think a "case" needs to be made for that, they literally showed you that happening.

I don't see the contradiction.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

Yeah, they literally outlined his fall from respectability. He couldn't be in a room with a bunch of old white dudes in suits. He fought two armed kids just for the rush of his old life.

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Aren't you the same guy that said this season of Game Of Thrones was bad? It seems like you are making a case that you shouldn't judge serialized shows on a per season basis now.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

The contradiction is that that what McNulty and Lester did was for the greater good as it got Marlo off the streets, but you guys are all seemingly in agreement that Marlo never left the streets.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

This season of GoT was bad. It was fan service, teleportation bullshit.

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It did. They can't help it that he got out. They did what they needed to do to get the current boss off the streets.

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You must be misreading what I wrote. You can judge a season by itself, especially against other seasons of the same TV show. It doesn't make sense to tell someone to isolate that season and pretend they didn't watch the others though.

It's good you brought up the GOT comparison. It'll help clarify this discussion. I didn't like the last season of GOT, especially compared to earlier seasons. I thought it was significantly worse. Sounds like you feel similarly about The Wire season 5. No big deal. Nobody is getting defensive. It's just differing opinions.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

The whole series was pretty great though!

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

A 92 for the final season? That's always been my issue with The Wire. It was a great show, but it's diehard fans are among the most blind when it comes to the shows' issues. Justified is my favorite show ever, but I admit the 5th season was pretty bad. Fans of The Wire always post their complaints with a caveat.

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He got out because of what they did. They could have helped it by not doing multiple stupid massively illegal acts to try and get him.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

GoT has sucked since season 5. They stopped caring about writing and characterization and more about tits and CGI.

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Agreed.

I would feel weird telling someone just getting into it "It's great but season 7 sucks so lower your expectations significantly when you get to that season." even though it's true.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

I think the problem with The Wire is that it's a major negative if a show fails to deliver in it's final season so the criticism of it is taken harsher than simply a poor season in the middle. The last season of a show should be the best given they can tie up storylines without any regard to the future and the whole series should have been building up to the final.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

As much as people shit on GRRM (I'm certainly one of them), the show was at its best when it was following tightly to the book storyline/character development. When D&D started playing to the Buzzfeed crowd, it started going downhill fast.

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I don't have any complaints with The Wire. I think it's far better than the second best TV show I've ever seen(BB). I know a lot of Wire fans who don't fit your description and feel similarly to Rick though, so I don't think that generalization works.

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Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

Without spoilers, I'd rather know to have lower expectations. If you started Season 5 saying that Season 4 was awesome and I can't wait to see what they do next season I don't see how you wouldn't be disappointed. Even you guys who are saying every point I have a problem with in Season 5 is wrong still think the show took a pretty substantial step down for what should be near the best season of any show.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

I've never said it took a substantial step down and don't believe it did. I love Season 5.

I also think your premise of "The best season of a show is usually the last" is flawed. It was true for Breaking Bad, but I'm not sure about others. The Sopranos, Justified, Mad Men, Oz, Boardwalk Empire, Sons of Anarchy, and probably MANY I'm not thinking of all had their best season in the first couple seasons.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul