But I'm pretty sure you believe there are things a man is supposed to do.

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Freedom is our Strength.

Of course

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Be well

GO BEARS!!!

You guys are mentally ill.

Yup.

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Make more money?

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

The whole thing is just dressed up penis-shaming.

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Men had a good 2,000 year run. It's over.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Not really. MANY of us were pretty much taught to behave like an animal. React before thinking. Empathy is for girls and a bunch of other nonsense. I see MANY refusing to let go of MANY foolish ideas because they believe it makes them less of a man. I'm secure enough with my manhood where I can ignore noise. That wasn't true 20 years ago.

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Be well

GO BEARS!!!

This is why a course like this is needed. People like leash don't even know how they are oppressing women.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

But men and women really are different. The whole concept of "toxic masculinity" is nothing more than a war against boys and their inherent nature. It's not an effort to help men with their emotions. i.e. letting us know it's okay to cry once in awhile. It's an attack. A demand that we act like women.

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Freedom is our Strength.

Do you agree with the idea that women who work full time are "abandoning their families"?

Obviously like anything else it goes too far but there are a lot of arbitrary and pointless gender expectations and you can't just say "It's just how we were built!" when so many of them from the 1950s have been proven to be wrong.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

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We are different in many ways. I believe there are some roles in general that a man is supposed to play. I imagine that I will always believe that. Those don't have to be the only roles though. As a guy with daughters I don't teach them that they're supposed to play a certain role though. I get what you're saying but I just don't see it that way. I think it's more about understanding that you don't have to be an animal 24/7 in order to be a man. I woman questioning or challenging your beliefs don't strip away your manhood.

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Be well

GO BEARS!!!

The bolded portion is in direct contradiction with the ideology of the people creating these things. They do not believe that there are roles a man is supposed to play.

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STFU, Rick.

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I'm an atheist, so no. But what you have to reckon with is that the VAST majority of Americans consider themselves members of one of an Abrahamic religions. It's pretty hard to separate the concept of male dominance from those religions.

But leaving out fantasy guys in the sky, you will have a hard time getting around the fact that women bear children and men do not. And you can kid yourself that a woman can do everything a man can do, but that's because you live in a civilized society created by educated men. If we abandon such a society and we're all competing for resources, the advanced degrees of our wives don't mean shit. They'll need to find protection under the wing of a strong Alpha male like Nas or Seacrest.

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Freedom is our Strength.

Do you think a course like this would have been useful for a man living in the 1950s? Think about all the things that we now consider outdated from then. There is still a good chance some things still remain that could use further improvement.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

It would be ironic if they were all run down by a fast car.

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Let me ask you this- do you think your wife is happier or more satisfied than her grandmother?

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Freedom is our Strength.

Well even I caught that one.....

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Hawaii (fuck) You

That's the point though. We need to try and figure out if those are fair or productive or not.

I think you are going too far. A large majority of this isn't looking to make everything 100% equal. Obviously there are some things that men will be better at and some things women will be better at. The sports discussion before was an example. The ability to have children is another. Both of those are logical things to believe. The problem comes in with the idea that women aren't hard workers because they have a kid and then don't care about their jobs, or that a man can work as long as he wants but a woman who works a full time job is "abandoning her family" or that a man cannot drink a latte and still feel good about himself.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Without question she is.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

I'd like a different option.

Why do you fixate on one aspect of the argument that you disagree with and apply it to everyone?

One person mentioned a woman “abandoning her family,” but now you’re using it to defend a much broader argument against people who didn’t even say it.

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I think the issue is that MANY men are taught that they're only supposed to do certain things. Changing a diaper, allowing your daughter to paint your nails or to embarrass you in some way doesn't make you less of a man. Not clubbing your lady because she talked or cooking and cleaning doesn't make you less of man. There are MANY examples of foolishness that have been passed along to MANY of us. If you need to talk to someone to understand that it's foolishness, I'm okay with that. Now if they insist that you dress like Jaden Smith you should club them over the head and leave.

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Be well

GO BEARS!!!

It's that penis mental illness.

I think you're missing what's really happening. Let's take the "battle of the sexes" angle off the table for a minute. My wife has a big job. She also made a conscious decision not to have children and to dedicate herself to her career. Would it be right for a person- it could be a man or a woman, but it would obviously most likely be a woman- to rise through the organization at the same rate as my wife even though she tended to her career in fits and starts based upon taking care of her family? I can tell you my wife certainly doesn't think so.

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Freedom is our Strength.

You always assume that modern = better.

Women being allowed to vote is better than before (in theory anyway).

Women representing a large portion of the workforce isn’t necessarily better simply because we’ve gone in that direction. There are many people, including women, who would argue that it’s actually detrimental to our society. I’m not arguing that; I’m just pointing out that modern does not always equal better.

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I'm not applying it to everyone. It is an example of the kind of thinking that makes this kind of stuff still needed.

And, it's a more extreme version of the idea that many on here put forward that when a woman has a child that while she is at work that her job is secondary to her child and therefore she is not as good of a worker as a man who seemingly forgets about his kids as soon as he gets to the office.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!