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PostPosted: Tue Sep 11, 2018 10:55 am 
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Ogie Oglethorpe wrote:
I'm still trying to get through season 2. I read that they fired the showrunner midway through and yeah I can tell they did as the season just sucks. I like the concept, but the execution is just poor.

I enjoyed Season 2 much more than Season 1.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 11, 2018 10:58 am 
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Douchebag wrote:
Ogie Oglethorpe wrote:
I'm still trying to get through season 2. I read that they fired the showrunner midway through and yeah I can tell they did as the season just sucks. I like the concept, but the execution is just poor.

I enjoyed Season 2 much more than Season 1.


Agreed. Once they got rid of the showrunner things kind of picked up and made much more sense.

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 15, 2018 9:39 am 
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I have to watch this. That book was really good, but really disturbing.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 15, 2018 11:46 am 
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I love the show.

I liked both seasons. But first one was really superb.

The acting is good too. The head nazi actor is just great.

One thing I didnt like or get - skip spoilers


SPOILERS - DO NOT READ IF YOU HAVE NOT WATCHED














The Japanese guy gets transported to our reality and is ok with it. I say bullshit. If one of our guys say was transferred into a world where the japs won the war, we would go apeshit. Why would he be ok with being on the side that did not win the war and is basically under a 'nicer' occupation by us.
















SPOILERS END


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 9:31 am 
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Terry's Peeps wrote:
Douchebag wrote:
Ogie Oglethorpe wrote:
I'm still trying to get through season 2. I read that they fired the showrunner midway through and yeah I can tell they did as the season just sucks. I like the concept, but the execution is just poor.

I enjoyed Season 2 much more than Season 1.


Agreed. Once they got rid of the showrunner things kind of picked up and made much more sense.

How long will the show last? Would like to see how they end it, since the ending of the novel is horseshit (which is typical for Phillip K. Dick).


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 9:39 am 
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tommy wrote:
Terry's Peeps wrote:
Douchebag wrote:
Ogie Oglethorpe wrote:
I'm still trying to get through season 2. I read that they fired the showrunner midway through and yeah I can tell they did as the season just sucks. I like the concept, but the execution is just poor.

I enjoyed Season 2 much more than Season 1.


Agreed. Once they got rid of the showrunner things kind of picked up and made much more sense.

How long will the show last? Would like to see how they end it, since the ending of the novel is horseshit (which is typical for Phillip K. Dick).


I read that Dick had actually written most of a sequel to the book before his death and that is what a lot of this series going forward will be based on.
I believe it has already been greenlit for a 4th season.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 9:43 am 
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Finished Season 2 last night. Decent enough series. As is typical, I am slightly confused. The characters became more likeable as the show went on.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 10:00 am 
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T-Bone wrote:
tommy wrote:
Terry's Peeps wrote:
Douchebag wrote:
Ogie Oglethorpe wrote:
I'm still trying to get through season 2. I read that they fired the showrunner midway through and yeah I can tell they did as the season just sucks. I like the concept, but the execution is just poor.

I enjoyed Season 2 much more than Season 1.


Agreed. Once they got rid of the showrunner things kind of picked up and made much more sense.

How long will the show last? Would like to see how they end it, since the ending of the novel is horseshit (which is typical for Phillip K. Dick).


I read that Dick had actually written most of a sequel to the book before his death and that is what a lot of this series going forward will be based on.
I believe it has already been greenlit for a 4th season.

Interesting! I thought I heard that one of Dick's daughters is involved, so it makes sense that they'd have access.

Also, and I hate to say it because I am usually kidding when I say someone is hot, but whoever plays Juliana must be hot in a Zina Bash way. (The novel's narrator describes her as being quite zinabashinian.)


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 10:25 am 
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tommy wrote:
T-Bone wrote:
tommy wrote:
Terry's Peeps wrote:
Douchebag wrote:
Ogie Oglethorpe wrote:
I'm still trying to get through season 2. I read that they fired the showrunner midway through and yeah I can tell they did as the season just sucks. I like the concept, but the execution is just poor.

I enjoyed Season 2 much more than Season 1.


Agreed. Once they got rid of the showrunner things kind of picked up and made much more sense.

How long will the show last? Would like to see how they end it, since the ending of the novel is horseshit (which is typical for Phillip K. Dick).


I read that Dick had actually written most of a sequel to the book before his death and that is what a lot of this series going forward will be based on.
I believe it has already been greenlit for a 4th season.

Interesting! I thought I heard that one of Dick's daughters is involved, so it makes sense that they'd have access.

Also, and I hate to say it because I am usually kidding when I say someone is hot, but whoever plays Juliana must be hot in a Zina Bash way. (The novel's narrator describes her as being quite zinabashinian.)


Yes the daughter is like an executive producer or something and had access to the unfinished work in some form or fashion.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 11:53 am 
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I just thought of a HILARIOUS line involving Phillip Dick and Zina Bash, but it feels too bro-brow to say it. Trust me, though; it is HILARIOUS.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2018 10:57 pm 
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A few episodes into Season 2. Great show. Not like any other show before it.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 12:47 am 
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new season starts tomorrow.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 14, 2018 2:52 am 
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finished season 3.

started out a bit slow, then picked up well.

then they have a shocker in the middle but then the story really slows down for 2 episodes. got really bored and it started to suck.

But the last 2 episodes and the finale OMFG , i can't wait for season 4 now.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2018 6:45 am 
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Started new season over the weekend. Only got through the opener. It was a bit slow like you mentioned, which is fine because I kind of
had to remember what was going on.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2018 9:04 am 
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good dolphin wrote:
I finished watching this and boy was I spot on with the David Lynch analogy. They spend nine episodes telling you a story and use the last one pointing to a sub rosa storyline that was their principal story from the beginning. I would really like to discuss this if any of you ss it because this is now one of those shows with which I could become obsessed

SPOILERS

The movie moves from a broken history to a science fiction in the final episode. I couldn't even tell you what really happened in the end. The first nine episodes might be nothing more than the fanciful thoughts of a Japanese American. They may also be the experiences of a person who can travel into different historical timelines like a quantum plain traveler. Maybe he is a person who scrub history like a blackboard when it doesn't play out as he wishes. It's also possible that 99% of the show should be taken at face value and the final scene is simply his dream as he is dying after consuming poison as part of a ritual suicide.

I think you could largely accept any of these explanations...and many others


I'm in season 2 now and option 2 appears to be the path they have chosen.

Is this how it is written in the book?

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2018 7:35 pm 
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good dolphin wrote:
good dolphin wrote:
I finished watching this and boy was I spot on with the David Lynch analogy. They spend nine episodes telling you a story and use the last one pointing to a sub rosa storyline that was their principal story from the beginning. I would really like to discuss this if any of you ss it because this is now one of those shows with which I could become obsessed

SPOILERS

The movie moves from a broken history to a science fiction in the final episode. I couldn't even tell you what really happened in the end. The first nine episodes might be nothing more than the fanciful thoughts of a Japanese American. They may also be the experiences of a person who can travel into different historical timelines like a quantum plain traveler. Maybe he is a person who scrub history like a blackboard when it doesn't play out as he wishes. It's also possible that 99% of the show should be taken at face value and the final scene is simply his dream as he is dying after consuming poison as part of a ritual suicide.

I think you could largely accept any of these explanations...and many others


I'm in season 2 now and option 2 appears to be the path they have chosen.

Is this how it is written in the book?

From your description of the show, no. However, the thing about Phillip K. Dick is that his novels are so bare bones that film or series versions are kind of on their own. That is, they have a lot of gaps to fill in..... His stories are fascinating, but I hate reading them. Very weird.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 8:11 am 
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I still don't understand how the films are created. I thought the man in the high castle was telepathically imposing them onto the film like the girl in The Ring. That doesn't seem to be the case, although he did say that he keeps them all in his head.

The story also seems to be displaying multiple forms of paranormal psychic abilities:

-there is the man in the high castle who somehow sees several streams of reality while only existing in one
-there are people who can teleport from one stream of reality to another and exist in both at their choosing
-there are people who appear to have precognition that is limited to the stream in which they are currently living

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 8:21 am 
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good dolphin wrote:
I still don't understand how the films are created. I thought the man in the high castle was telepathically imposing them onto the film like the girl in The Ring. That doesn't seem to be the case, although he did say that he keeps them all in his head.

The story also seems to be displaying multiple forms of paranormal psychic abilities:

-there is the man in the high castle who somehow sees several streams of reality while only existing in one
-there are people who can teleport from one stream of reality to another and exist in both at their choosing
-there are people who appear to have precognition that is limited to the stream in which they are currently living

Wow, that's far afield of the book.....sounds interesting, though. Sounds like a combination of PK Dick's books.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 17, 2018 6:48 am 
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I'm about half way through the new season and it is just ok so far. The death count is starting to mount including a character that I really
didn't expect to be written out. I hope the 2nd half really takes the series somewhere new and exciting.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 17, 2018 10:11 am 
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I think the overarching theme of the story is personal character remaining constant irrespective of conditions and the inevitability of history.

The man in the high castle supports this when he said that in his viewing of the films, the good people remain good and the bad remain bad, with a few exceptions. I think we see Tagomi as the exception.

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Last edited by good dolphin on Wed Oct 17, 2018 1:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 17, 2018 10:26 am 
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Correct me if I am wrong, but did they say John Smith was a US Marine in the battle in the pacific before he eventually became Obergrubenfuhrer in the Reich?

I just don't see that being a possibility either from his or Nazi leadership's perspective.

In fact, I find the assimilation into Naziism of that generation (and older) implausible. Sure, there are some who would be sympathizers with their occupiers and the generation that grew up under Nazi rule would have not known differently. However, the generation that just fought a bitter war would not so easily be turned. Eliminating religion at that time would have been a major issue in the US. Practicing would be a symbol of defiance, much like we saw in some Eastern European countries under communism. Additionally, a place like NY would have undergone significant purging of both ethnicities, orientations and academia. Twenty years is not enough to have washed that from memory.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 17, 2018 1:20 pm 
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good dolphin wrote:
Correct me if I am wrong, but did they say John Smith was a US Marine in the battle in the pacific before he eventually became Obergrubenfuhrer in the Reich?

I just don't see that being a possibility either from his or Nazi leadership's perspective.

In fact, I find the assimilation into Naziism of that generation (and older) implausible. Sure, there are some who would be sympathizers with their occupiers and the generation that grew up under Nazi rule would have not known differently. However, the generation that just fought a bitter war would not so easily be turned. Eliminating religion at that time would have been a major issue in the US. Practicing would be a symbol of defiance, much like we saw in some Eastern European countries under communism. Additionally, a place like NY would have undergone significant purging of both ethnicities, orientations and academia. Twenty years is not enough to have washed that from memory.


I'm not sure how far you got in the series but

SPOILERS BELOW

Smith was a traitor in the war. He gave the Nazi's the information so they could nuke DC. Which they did. Since he switched sides and his info won the war for the Nazi's, he was accepted.

As for assimilating, the nazi's forced it. The Americans are a conquered people. So for the Nazi's, it was join us or die. People will assimilate pretty quickly.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2018 10:14 am 
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when are we informed he was a traitor. I just finished season 2 and the only indication I remember was when he was safely out of DC on the day it was bombed, even though he was due to meet at the Pentagon

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2018 12:04 pm 
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Who is the hero of this story for you?

I'm not interested in a future with the relativism of the Resistance. Nazis are Nazis. The Japanese are racist and have a brutally rigid social hierarchy. Smith is a traitor. Julianna has a proper moral compass but no ability to consider macro level results.

I think the hero is Quito or Tagomi.

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2018 10:05 pm 
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good dolphin wrote:
Who is the hero of this story for you?

I'm not interested in a future with the relativism of the Resistance. Nazis are Nazis. The Japanese are racist and have a brutally rigid social hierarchy. Smith is a traitor. Julianna has a proper moral compass but no ability to consider macro level results.

I think the hero is Quito or Tagomi.



Keep watching.

Juliana I hate. She does nothing in the whole show. She just strolls in , shakes her head to get her hair out of her face, , says 2-3 lines, the leaves. Every scene.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2018 2:30 pm 
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Finished the new season this morning. There were some surprising deaths but a little disappointed that the story wasn't moved along a bit further. I will say that they did a good job ending the season with a lot of open questions moving forward. I really have no idea where the story will go from here.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 11:38 am 
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I'm in the middle of season 3.

The song the Nazi boy sang at the Thomas Smith memorial is, I believe, the same song sung in Cabaret just before intermission when the Nazis really start to get heavy handed or maybe it is at the end. I assume it was an homage.

I like that J. Edna is identical to the historical J. This show is about the inevitability of history and this is another good example.

The show is now essentially sci fi. I don't think I have ever experienced a show changing its character after one season. I don't complain. I like the concept but the changed history concept could have been an equally satisfying story.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 1:19 pm 
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lv0jav4lNsk

no way they couldn't have had Cabaret in mind. The movie version is very similar to man in the high castle

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 1:38 pm 
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I think Season 3 has some of that Hollywood bubble writing where every hero is either gay or jewish and everyone else is looking to eliminate them from existence.

I hate the Frank character. He is boring. He is unbelievable. He is not particularly well acted. I was happy to have him dead and there he goes appearing again as the same boring, unbelievable character.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 1:53 pm 
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I wonder if the writer named the obengruppenfuhrer John Smith because it is an everyman English name or to draw some kind of parallel to John Smith from the Jamestown colony.

It is entirely appropriate that Himmler is the leader as the story grows more sci fi as Himmler was the principal leader to connect the Nazis to a paranormal existence in real life. He would have definitely funded a program like the Lakawana experiments.

I just wonder why he is grooming Smith for leadership to the point of actually eliminating all potential opponents. Has he seen something in the movies the would draw him to Smith?

One thing I do not buy is that the writers are putting a lot of stock in the movies encouraging rebellion. Even if allied victory happened in another multiverse, the Nazis won in several other multiverses (or are they saying for this show that there are only two multiverses).

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