It is currently Thu Nov 21, 2024 2:03 pm

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 196 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 3, 4, 5, 6, 7
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: Collusion
PostPosted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 8:42 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon May 02, 2011 4:29 pm
Posts: 40641
Location: Everywhere
pizza_Place: giordanos
This makes me think of another discussion we should have after the season starts and all this FA period is done. The economics of baseball is an incredible story encompassing so many things. Almost of of which have no connection to reality.

_________________
Elections have consequences.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Collusion
PostPosted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 8:49 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jun 06, 2012 7:43 pm
Posts: 20537
pizza_Place: Joes Pizza
pittmike wrote:
This makes me think of another discussion we should have after the season starts and all this FA period is done. The economics of baseball is an incredible story encompassing so many things. Almost of of which have no connection to reality.

White Sox are a good example of today's messed up MLB structure.

Essentially free stadium, concessions and parking goes to White Sox, TV deal locks in XYZ revenue.

Pirates are another good example. Had a great team and open window but owner was too cheap to pay for finishing touches during their window.

Brewers ownership has really defined themselves as the model small-medium market ownership group.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Collusion
PostPosted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 8:49 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jun 22, 2006 3:55 pm
Posts: 33067
Location: Wrigley
pizza_Place: Warren Buffet of Cock
It’s really quite simple. The current deal effectively caps big spenders with a luxury tax on the idea of leveling the playing field. Instead, they need to share a percentage of league revenues with the players and have a payroll floor. The players don’t want a salary cap, but if total payroll is set as a percentage of revenue, then I think it would be fair to all.

_________________
Hawaii (fuck) You


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Collusion
PostPosted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 9:13 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon May 02, 2011 4:29 pm
Posts: 40641
Location: Everywhere
pizza_Place: giordanos
Kirkwood wrote:
pittmike wrote:
This makes me think of another discussion we should have after the season starts and all this FA period is done. The economics of baseball is an incredible story encompassing so many things. Almost of of which have no connection to reality.

White Sox are a good example of today's messed up MLB structure.

Essentially free stadium, concessions and parking goes to White Sox, TV deal locks in XYZ revenue.

Pirates are another good example. Had a great team and open window but owner was too cheap to pay for finishing touches during their window.

Brewers ownership has really defined themselves as the model small-medium market ownership group.



Yeah. In the past the Brewers weren't quite doing it right eg Prince. Pirates nor anyone else has a lease/stadium deal as great as the Sox. They did not break the bank at the time they were very competitive for three years though. Correct.

_________________
Elections have consequences.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Collusion
PostPosted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 9:18 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon May 02, 2011 4:29 pm
Posts: 40641
Location: Everywhere
pizza_Place: giordanos
denisdman wrote:
It’s really quite simple. The current deal effectively caps big spenders with a luxury tax on the idea of leveling the playing field. Instead, they need to share a percentage of league revenues with the players and have a payroll floor. The players don’t want a salary cap, but if total payroll is set as a percentage of revenue, then I think it would be fair to all.


Yeah the floor is very important. Although if not careful it can cause a couple issues eg NHL.

Anyway, my interest in the topic also includes the unnatural inflation. Keep in mind I know why this has happened and not really blaming either side at all. Actually the fan gets screwed the most.

Between TV revenues, player salaries and a host of other smaller factors like agents and arbitration etc there is a cycle of ever expanding funny money made/earned/consumed that shows no correlation to any other economic system since say 1980 or so. Think how recent (in historic terms) it was that Rickey Henderson, I think, became the first $3M dollar player.

_________________
Elections have consequences.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Collusion
PostPosted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 12:29 pm 
Online
User avatar

Joined: Mon Aug 07, 2006 8:35 pm
Posts: 10788
Location: Parrish, FL
pizza_Place: 1. Peaquods 2. Aurelios
In 2018 Team payrolls ranged from 68,810,167 to 227,398,860.

man...that's an awfully large gap. interesting to see how badly the Padres have been eating money the last 2 seasons...wow.

_________________
This Ends in Antioch wrote:
brick (/brik/) verb
1. block or enclose with a wall of bricks
2. Proper response would be to ask an endless series of follow ups until the person regrets having spoken to you in the first place.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Collusion
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2019 11:24 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 24, 2008 12:16 pm
Posts: 81625
rogers park bryan wrote:
Curious Hair wrote:
mrgoodkat wrote:
We know that the huge majority (I think more than 70% if I remember correctly) of the ultra wealthy are purely self made and worked their ass off to get there.

We do?

Not quite.

We know that 70% of the money of those 400 was not inherited.

The thing left out is, a guy like Trump gets a "small loan" from his father for 1 million (looking further into it he gave him way more in assets worth about 60 million)

But just take that 1 million. Now credit to Trump for making all the money he has made since then, but would he have done it without his father's million? Odds are against it.

A better study, if possible, would be how much of wealth is built with a base of inheritance.

But, some people will always have more advantages than others.



Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Collusion
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2019 11:36 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jan 30, 2011 10:15 am
Posts: 27591
pizza_Place: nick n vito's
wdelaney72 wrote:
In 2018 Team payrolls ranged from 68,810,167 to 227,398,860.

man...that's an awfully large gap. interesting to see how badly the Padres have been eating money the last 2 seasons...wow.



The Giants suck, they had 208 million payroll. Milwaukee was about half that.

_________________
The Original Kid Cairo wrote:
Laurence Holmes is a fucking weirdo, a nerd in denial, and a wannabe. Not a very good radio host either.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Collusion
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2019 11:43 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jun 22, 2006 3:55 pm
Posts: 33067
Location: Wrigley
pizza_Place: Warren Buffet of Cock
wdelaney72 wrote:
In 2018 Team payrolls ranged from 68,810,167 to 227,398,860.

man...that's an awfully large gap. interesting to see how badly the Padres have been eating money the last 2 seasons...wow.


The competitive balance tax was supposed to address that by penalizing the Yankees for spending and sending money to the Reds and Pirates. But the small market teams generally pocketed the money. If you want it to be fair, the NFL has the best structure for sharing the revenues and setting a cap and floor.

_________________
Hawaii (fuck) You


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Collusion
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2019 11:47 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jan 30, 2011 10:15 am
Posts: 27591
pizza_Place: nick n vito's
denisdman wrote:
wdelaney72 wrote:
In 2018 Team payrolls ranged from 68,810,167 to 227,398,860.

man...that's an awfully large gap. interesting to see how badly the Padres have been eating money the last 2 seasons...wow.


The competitive balance tax was supposed to address that by penalizing the Yankees for spending and sending money to the Reds and Pirates. But the small market teams generally pocketed the money. If you want it to be fair, the NFL has the best structure for sharing the revenues and setting a cap and floor.



Isn't it too late to share TV revenue at this point? Many teams already have their own networks and deals. I never liked the idea of revenue sharing in baseball, it's easy for NFL with 26 regular season games but 162 is too difficult. I don't like rewarding ineptitude or miserly ownership.

_________________
The Original Kid Cairo wrote:
Laurence Holmes is a fucking weirdo, a nerd in denial, and a wannabe. Not a very good radio host either.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Collusion
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2019 11:49 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jun 22, 2006 3:55 pm
Posts: 33067
Location: Wrigley
pizza_Place: Warren Buffet of Cock
You’re spot on, the revenue model is completely different due to regional deals.

_________________
Hawaii (fuck) You


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Collusion
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2019 2:52 pm 
Online
User avatar

Joined: Mon Aug 07, 2006 8:35 pm
Posts: 10788
Location: Parrish, FL
pizza_Place: 1. Peaquods 2. Aurelios
They cannot address it until the next CBA. They fucked themselves when they did the luxury tax but didn't add in any kind of salary floor. Then again.....teams like the White Sox prioritize
1. Financial Balance sheet / Shareholder payout
2. Stadium favorability
3. Winning

Not unique to the White Sox.....plenty of company with other small market teams.

_________________
This Ends in Antioch wrote:
brick (/brik/) verb
1. block or enclose with a wall of bricks
2. Proper response would be to ask an endless series of follow ups until the person regrets having spoken to you in the first place.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Collusion
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2019 2:58 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Mar 24, 2018 9:19 pm
Posts: 31608
pizza_Place: What??
Mid market team. TV, Radio and advertising revenue. They are damn lucky the product they put out isn't in Cleveland.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Collusion
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2019 3:17 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jan 30, 2011 10:15 am
Posts: 27591
pizza_Place: nick n vito's
wdelaney72 wrote:
They cannot address it until the next CBA. They fucked themselves when they did the luxury tax but didn't add in any kind of salary floor. Then again.....teams like the White Sox prioritize
1. Financial Balance sheet / Shareholder payout
2. Stadium favorability
3. Winning

Not unique to the White Sox.....plenty of company with other small market teams.



Why should there be a floor? Look at the Brewers.. I remember one year when Girardi had the Marlins at 81 wins with a payroll of 30 million and Arod was making like 28 million.

_________________
The Original Kid Cairo wrote:
Laurence Holmes is a fucking weirdo, a nerd in denial, and a wannabe. Not a very good radio host either.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Collusion
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2019 4:20 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon May 02, 2011 4:29 pm
Posts: 40641
Location: Everywhere
pizza_Place: giordanos
The floor idea is so players and rich owners don’t lose out to the pocketing cheap owners receiving welfare.

_________________
Elections have consequences.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Collusion
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2019 9:47 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Mar 24, 2015 9:46 pm
Posts: 10102
pizza_Place: Q's Hillside
Forget the floor. Teams should be able to offer bonuses based on the team making the playoffs, making the World Series, and winning the World Series.

Also, the minimum AAA salary for anybody with a year of MLB service time should be $150k/year, and there should be an additional $50k minimum for being an NRI in that situation.

_________________
"When people want their version of the truth, they go find it, no matter how baseless their beliefs." -- Ken Rosenthal


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 196 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 3, 4, 5, 6, 7

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 11 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group