Today was the vintage example of Mike North YELL LOUDER to win an argument.

The Linebrink is better than Marmol because he has a better ERA argument was precious. Linebrink is good, we know he is good.

For some reason the 36 IP with 54 K's, 15 hits was overlooked, v. Linebrink's 18K's in 24 IP, 5 runs, 17 hits.

2 Less hits in 12 more IP? 30 More K's in 12 more IP?

Linebrink is good. He better be good for $19M for 4 years, but as Stoney said "Marmol is often unhittable"

If the argument is "People don't know how good Linebrink is" fine, they don't, you are right.

But to compare Marmols 1.75 ERA to Linebrinks Pre Floyd Homerun ERA of 1.13 is just creating the arguement to make your point.

I must have missed the "Pre Floyd HR" stat on MLB

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I think both guys clearly make thier team's bullpens better. I'd be happy with either one in my pen.

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Marmol is still a rookie and will continue to blossom. Mike was also arguing that we know more about Marmol because of the chicago media bias. Thats not entirely true. On a more national level, he is considered one of the most feared relievers in baseball and on more than one occasion a GM has said that he is the one guy that they would most fear to see in late innings. Linebrink is having a nice bounce back year, but he really fell apart after leaving san diego, so that is what people remember most right now.

Mike needs to stop looking at stats as the be all end all.

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I had to change the station when I heard him talking about this.

North's brilliant use of stats shine once again (see his Beasley vs. Rose argument).

And his overarching thought in all this was "sox don't get the media attention that cubs do" and tries to make himself seem "fair and balanced." But really he's a sox fan at heart and comes up with arguments like these so he can yell and scream about the cubs.

Mike yelling loud into the microphone? I would have never imagined that

I was never a Mike hater, even sometimes a defender, but god damn Mike is annoying. I really can't wait until he is gone or his role is diminished.
He is rare form today, he is right because he is yelling over everyone. His arguments are all over the map and he will say anything to try to make his point. Mike is the king of non sequitur analogies.
I will switch to Silvy and Waddle for an hour, while waiting for Mully and Hanley to start.

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We all have private ails. The troublemakers are they who need public cures for their private ails.- Eric Hoffer

Both guys are having great years.

Marmoil is the better pitcher overall and is going to be really good for awhile.

Based on Linebrinks past numbers I do not see him finishing out the year this good, but maybe he will surprise me.

Are any of the Sox fans worried he will fold down the stretch?

Linebrink is a good pitcher pitching very well.

Marmol is a dominating pitcher who is one of the best in the league already.

Case closed.

friday afternoon, marmol came in and pitched the 8th, and struck out 3 guys, all looking, on 10 pitches. i have seen a lot of great relievers and closers in their prime, but that may have been some of the very nastiest shit i have ever seen.

No.

Did Mike bring up the fact Marmol can go more than one inning.

Based on Mike's ERA is all that matters comment ...I guess he would take Scott Schoenweis and his 1.13 ERA over both Linnebrink and Marmol.

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I'm not a stats junkie, nor do I care to research it..but isn't there some stat for INHERITED RUNNERS and how many a relief pitcher allows? A reliever could come in w/ the bases loaded, give up a triple (scoring three runs) and then close out the inning and his ERA could actually go down. The runs are charged to the previous pitcher.

Some caller tried to raise this point...Mike dismissed it quickly and called him a "typical cubs fan"...then Fred chimed in with the well...these guys typically start innings, so that stat doesn't matter.

All that said...I don't know who has the better stats against my argument, but that stat is a huge factor as it pertains to relievers. Not according to North though.

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Anyone know where to find current Inherited Runners Scored stats? I tried googling but only got previous years stats.

Also WHIP and Ks are other better ways of evaluating a relief pitcher than just ERA.

Forget stats. Linebrink is good but Marmol is the best set up guy in baseball.

His ERA should actually be lower cuz that dropped ball by Soriano wasn't ruled an error.

But yeah, Marmol doesn't let in inherited runners either. I'm know he's had way more inherited runners than Linebrink.

Marmol, unless he gets hurt, will be a dominate closer too.

But I think he'll get hurt. Usually people with that much break on the sliders or curves get hurt. They get hurt cuz of the amount of strain they put on the arm to get those balls to break in such a fantastic fashion.

Like B&B said earlier, Marmol is the best reliever in baseball.

you can get full stats by player at ESPN

2008 Marmol IRunners 8 IR scored 1
2008 Linebrink IRunners 10 scored 2

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i agree that marmol is a great reliever, but billy wagner is having a pretty fair year, too. i think wagner (and every other "closer") has it easier in that he starts almost every inning fresh, whereas marmol comes in quite often when there is shit going down, but billy wagner is still the real deal, and it is hard to say anyone is throwing better than he is.

and, of course, they are incorrect...the correct answer to that question this year and every year for the past decade or more is Mariano Rivera.

Ah yes Monday mornings topic. I heard this and when the caller tried to bring up innings pitched, K's, runners held and a few other things Mike just shit all over it and said, Im talking ERA here. Thats how you measure a reliever. Well Mike, this is why your the most uneducated lucky fuck in the business. Fred tried to agree, but I think I just heard a loud mumble as his mouth must have been wrapped around Mikes dick.

Mike proved that he's a moron with that one.

In any given situation; you'd want either of them to pitch as they both have been solid pitchers for their teams. If we're talking a post-season, I might give the edge to Linebrink being more of a veteran. If I'm talking long-term investment, I'd pick Marmol, as he's younger.

But North once again would shout down anyone who would disagree with him.