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 Post subject: Re: The NBA
PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2019 9:53 am 
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Ogie Oglethorpe wrote:
Funny, these guys want to pretend they are Muhammad Ali and pretend they are taking big stances when they repeat an opinion that is held by the majority of the country, especially when it costs them nothing but earns them heaps of praise. They are suddenly silent when asked to make the most basic of stands in support of free speech because it might cost them some dough. You're smart enough to see what is going on. They want the accolades for being activists by taking easy positions yet suddenly play dumb when there is actually a price to pay for taking a position.

I think some want the accolades, but I think most of them speaking out against Trump and police brutality and gun violence aren't doing it for the accolades.

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 Post subject: Re: The NBA
PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2019 9:56 am 
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FavreFan wrote:
Ogie Oglethorpe wrote:
Funny, these guys want to pretend they are Muhammad Ali and pretend they are taking big stances when they repeat an opinion that is held by the majority of the country, especially when it costs them nothing but earns them heaps of praise. They are suddenly silent when asked to make the most basic of stands in support of free speech because it might cost them some dough. You're smart enough to see what is going on. They want the accolades for being activists by taking easy positions yet suddenly play dumb when there is actually a price to pay for taking a position.

I think some want the accolades, but I think most of them speaking out against Trump and police brutality and gun violence aren't doing it for the accolades.

They're doing it as a mix of what they believe and also for the accolades. Given their cowardice when faced with losing Chinese money, it's clear they wouldn't speak out against Trump if it would cost them endorsement dollars. They do it because it's safe. They're willing to take any position so long as it comes at no cost.

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 Post subject: Re: The NBA
PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2019 9:59 am 
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The NBA basked in the media glow of being the woke league. That’s why they are hypocrites for taking money from a brutal dictatorship. If they had kept their mouths shut about “justice” no one would give a shit about this or ask for their opinions on Hong Kong.

No one denies their right to be political, but there are consequences. Their political convictions are clearly shallow beliefs they discuss to earn social media praise.

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 Post subject: Re: The NBA
PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2019 10:00 am 
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This question was asked in Japan, not China so this is the NBA censoring it, not Chinese authorities. Of course they are doing it to suck Xi's micro-dick


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 Post subject: Re: The NBA
PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2019 10:02 am 
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FavreFan wrote:
Ogie Oglethorpe wrote:
Funny, these guys want to pretend they are Muhammad Ali and pretend they are taking big stances when they repeat an opinion that is held by the majority of the country, especially when it costs them nothing but earns them heaps of praise. They are suddenly silent when asked to make the most basic of stands in support of free speech because it might cost them some dough. You're smart enough to see what is going on. They want the accolades for being activists by taking easy positions yet suddenly play dumb when there is actually a price to pay for taking a position.

I think some want the accolades, but I think most of them speaking out against Trump and police brutality and gun violence aren't doing it for the accolades.

LeBron is really the only one that comes off as a marketing campaign. Now he is trying to take credit for the fact that college players may be able to make money off of their likeness without any real reason to believe he had anything to do with it except being a leading voice in a players association that kept the one and done rule. I think other players are much more genuine and not doing it to glorify themselves. Even LeBron's "school" has been shown to be a pretty small investment by him for the branding he did on it.

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 Post subject: Re: The NBA
PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2019 10:03 am 
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Hatchetman wrote:
Being reprimanded or fired for saying something mean to another country is not related to US policy?


No, it's a business decision.

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 Post subject: Re: The NBA
PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2019 10:04 am 
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Boilermaker Rick wrote:
FavreFan wrote:
Ogie Oglethorpe wrote:
Funny, these guys want to pretend they are Muhammad Ali and pretend they are taking big stances when they repeat an opinion that is held by the majority of the country, especially when it costs them nothing but earns them heaps of praise. They are suddenly silent when asked to make the most basic of stands in support of free speech because it might cost them some dough. You're smart enough to see what is going on. They want the accolades for being activists by taking easy positions yet suddenly play dumb when there is actually a price to pay for taking a position.

I think some want the accolades, but I think most of them speaking out against Trump and police brutality and gun violence aren't doing it for the accolades.

LeBron is really the only one that comes off as a marketing campaign. Now he is trying to take credit for the fact that college players may be able to make money off of their likeness without any real reason to believe he had anything to do with it except being a leading voice in a players association that kept the one and done rule. I think other players are much more genuine and not doing it to glorify themselves. Even LeBron's "school" has been shown to be a pretty small investment by him for the branding he did on it.

LeBron is 100% avoiding this question because he needs Space Jam 2 to get the Chinese market. It's really pathetic on his part.

It's funny how South Park had NBA players on that plane to China with the Disney characters a full 4 days before this controversy erupted.

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 Post subject: Re: The NBA
PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2019 10:06 am 
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 Post subject: Re: The NBA
PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2019 10:13 am 
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I should add that the NBA shutting down that press conference is a great way to demonstrate that Silver is totally 100% serious and sincere when saying he supports freedom of expression.

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 Post subject: Re: The NBA
PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2019 10:22 am 
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Ogie has never met an Israeli Human Rights abuse that he wouldn't endorse and is per usual from the "silent majority" contingent he gets a pass on his hypocrisy.

I also find it interesting that they are now expected to speak out on all of the worldwide injustices simply because they decided to speak out on American related injustices. Also interesting is how the focus is now on the players (shocking) when the first person to grovel at the feet of the Chinese were the owners and the guy whom they paid to grovel.

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Last edited by long time guy on Thu Oct 10, 2019 10:23 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: The NBA
PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2019 10:22 am 
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Ogie Oglethorpe wrote:
Funny, these guys want to pretend they are Muhammad Ali and pretend they are taking big stances when they repeat an opinion that is held by the majority of the country, especially when it costs them nothing but earns them heaps of praise. They are suddenly silent when asked to make the most basic of stands in support of free speech because it might cost them some dough. You're smart enough to see what is going on. They want the accolades for being activists by taking easy positions yet suddenly play dumb when there is actually a price to pay for taking a position.


What are you talking about? Prior to LeBron making political statements costs guys their careers. The players and coaches spoke out about issues that impacted their country and their community. Demanding that they make statements about other countries is ridiculous. How many other countries do you want them to chime in on and push so called American ideals?

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 Post subject: Re: The NBA
PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2019 10:23 am 
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It's the worst look yet. The NBA is in quicksand, no doubt about it.


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 Post subject: Re: The NBA
PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2019 10:28 am 
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Nas wrote:
Ogie Oglethorpe wrote:
Funny, these guys want to pretend they are Muhammad Ali and pretend they are taking big stances when they repeat an opinion that is held by the majority of the country, especially when it costs them nothing but earns them heaps of praise. They are suddenly silent when asked to make the most basic of stands in support of free speech because it might cost them some dough. You're smart enough to see what is going on. They want the accolades for being activists by taking easy positions yet suddenly play dumb when there is actually a price to pay for taking a position.


What are you talking about? Prior to LeBron making political statements costs guys their careers. The players and coaches spoke out about issues that impacted their country and their community. Demanding that they make statements about other countries is ridiculous. How many other countries do you want them to chime in on and push so called American ideals?

This isn't some random country. If they were asked to speak about Kashmir, you might have a point. However, in this case they are 1: playing the games in said country and 2: have sponsorships with items being made by slave labor in said country


These factors have made the questions fair game, especially when the league clearly forced an employee of a team to apologize for criticizing China and then issued an apology in Chinese on their social media accounts condemning the employee in question.

If you're going to brag about how woke your league is and do away with the word "owner" because you want accolades for your wokeness, then you should have no problem taking a stand for the most basic of inalienable rights

None of these guys will lose their career if they say they support freedom of expression and are against China's organ harvesting, reeducation camps, etc.

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 Post subject: Re: The NBA
PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2019 10:32 am 
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long time guy wrote:
Ogie has never met an Israeli Human Rights abuse that he wouldn't endorse and is per usual from the "silent majority" contingent he gets a pass on his hypocrisy.

I also find it interesting that they are now expected to speak out on all of the worldwide injustices simply because they decided to speak out on American related injustices. Also interesting is how the focus is now on the players (shocking) when the first person to grovel at the feet of the Chinese were the owners and the guy whom they paid to grovel.


If LeBron would have been the one to tweet that the same people would have torched him for causing an international crisis and a bunch of other things. Now Ogie and many others are the ones virtue signaling.

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 Post subject: Re: The NBA
PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2019 10:34 am 
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Nardi wrote:
It's the worst look yet. The NBA is in quicksand, no doubt about it.

Yeah they seemed to be getting on track a few days ago and now they're back to handling this about as poorly as possible.

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 Post subject: Re: The NBA
PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2019 10:35 am 
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FavreFan wrote:
Nardi wrote:
It's the worst look yet. The NBA is in quicksand, no doubt about it.

Yeah they seemed to be getting on track a few days ago and now they're back to handling this about as poorly as possible.

The NBA under Adam Silver has never faced any real controversy so they don't know how to handle it. They are accustomed to receiving nothing but accolades.

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 Post subject: Re: The NBA
PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2019 10:36 am 
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Nas wrote:
long time guy wrote:
Ogie has never met an Israeli Human Rights abuse that he wouldn't endorse and is per usual from the "silent majority" contingent he gets a pass on his hypocrisy.

I also find it interesting that they are now expected to speak out on all of the worldwide injustices simply because they decided to speak out on American related injustices. Also interesting is how the focus is now on the players (shocking) when the first person to grovel at the feet of the Chinese were the owners and the guy whom they paid to grovel.


If LeBron would have been the one to tweet that the same people would have torched him for causing an international crisis and a bunch of other things. Now Ogie and many others are the ones virtue signaling.


What are the odds that any of the newly anointed "virtue signalers" and "SJWs" would ever criticize American farmers for remaining silent on human rights abuses found in China?

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 Post subject: Re: The NBA
PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2019 10:38 am 
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Nas wrote:
long time guy wrote:
Ogie has never met an Israeli Human Rights abuse that he wouldn't endorse and is per usual from the "silent majority" contingent he gets a pass on his hypocrisy.

I also find it interesting that they are now expected to speak out on all of the worldwide injustices simply because they decided to speak out on American related injustices. Also interesting is how the focus is now on the players (shocking) when the first person to grovel at the feet of the Chinese were the owners and the guy whom they paid to grovel.


If LeBron would have been the one to tweet that the same people would have torched him for causing an international crisis and a bunch of other things. Now Ogie and many others are the ones virtue signaling.


1. Bring up Israel. Check.

2. Single out. Ogie. Check.

3. Offer baseless accusations based on some imaginary scenario. Check.

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 Post subject: Re: The NBA
PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2019 10:40 am 
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WaitingforRuffcorn wrote:
Nas wrote:
long time guy wrote:
Ogie has never met an Israeli Human Rights abuse that he wouldn't endorse and is per usual from the "silent majority" contingent he gets a pass on his hypocrisy.

I also find it interesting that they are now expected to speak out on all of the worldwide injustices simply because they decided to speak out on American related injustices. Also interesting is how the focus is now on the players (shocking) when the first person to grovel at the feet of the Chinese were the owners and the guy whom they paid to grovel.


If LeBron would have been the one to tweet that the same people would have torched him for causing an international crisis and a bunch of other things. Now Ogie and many others are the ones virtue signaling.


1. Bring up Israel. Check.

2. Single out. Ogie. Check.

3. Offer baseless accusations based on some imaginary scenario. Check.


Remain a lapdog and completely ignorant of the point being made. Check

Singling out the Athletes (Unsurprisingly) when its the owners that are driving this bus. Also check.


Relevancy among other things, has never been an actual strong suit of yours.

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 Post subject: Re: The NBA
PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2019 10:43 am 
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Ogie Oglethorpe wrote:
Nas wrote:
Ogie Oglethorpe wrote:
Funny, these guys want to pretend they are Muhammad Ali and pretend they are taking big stances when they repeat an opinion that is held by the majority of the country, especially when it costs them nothing but earns them heaps of praise. They are suddenly silent when asked to make the most basic of stands in support of free speech because it might cost them some dough. You're smart enough to see what is going on. They want the accolades for being activists by taking easy positions yet suddenly play dumb when there is actually a price to pay for taking a position.


What are you talking about? Prior to LeBron making political statements costs guys their careers. The players and coaches spoke out about issues that impacted their country and their community. Demanding that they make statements about other countries is ridiculous. How many other countries do you want them to chime in on and push so called American ideals?

This isn't some random country. If they were asked to speak about Kashmir, you might have a point. However, in this case they are 1: playing the games in said country and 2: have sponsorships with items being made by slave labor in said country


These factors have made the questions fair game, especially when the league clearly forced an employee of a team to apologize for criticizing China and then issued an apology in Chinese on their social media accounts condemning the employee in question.

If you're going to brag about how woke your league is and do away with the word "owner" because you want accolades for your wokeness, then you should have no problem taking a stand for the most basic of inalienable rights

None of these guys will lose their career if they say they support freedom of expression and are against China's organ harvesting, reeducation camps, etc.


Are you going to throw away your phone and other items that were manufactured in China? How often have you gone against the wishes of your employer?

If speaking out against injustices in your community is considered "woke" then that also makes you woke. You're a fervent defender of Israel and there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. LeBron and others feel that way about minority communities in America. Kanter does the same thing with Turkey.

Prior to LeBron guys routinely lost their careers speaking out against injustices in America. Now they've been given the freedom to do that they should continue to focus on America and allow the politicians to focus on countries around the world.

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 Post subject: Re: The NBA
PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2019 10:44 am 
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Ogie Oglethorpe wrote:
FavreFan wrote:
Nardi wrote:
It's the worst look yet. The NBA is in quicksand, no doubt about it.

Yeah they seemed to be getting on track a few days ago and now they're back to handling this about as poorly as possible.

The NBA under Adam Silver has never faced any real controversy so they don't know how to handle it. They are accustomed to receiving nothing but accolades.

Most of those are pretty deserved accolades considering they are compared to the NFL, NHL, and MLB. But yes, this is the moment Silver's tenure as commissioner will be defined by and he's handling it pretty poorly. I still think any criticism of the players is misguided.

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 Post subject: Re: The NBA
PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2019 10:44 am 
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WaitingforRuffcorn wrote:
Nas wrote:
long time guy wrote:
Ogie has never met an Israeli Human Rights abuse that he wouldn't endorse and is per usual from the "silent majority" contingent he gets a pass on his hypocrisy.

I also find it interesting that they are now expected to speak out on all of the worldwide injustices simply because they decided to speak out on American related injustices. Also interesting is how the focus is now on the players (shocking) when the first person to grovel at the feet of the Chinese were the owners and the guy whom they paid to grovel.


If LeBron would have been the one to tweet that the same people would have torched him for causing an international crisis and a bunch of other things. Now Ogie and many others are the ones virtue signaling.


1. Bring up Israel. Check.

2. Single out. Ogie. Check.

3. Offer baseless accusations based on some imaginary scenario. Check.


What's the prize?

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 Post subject: Re: The NBA
PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2019 10:45 am 
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WaitingforRuffcorn wrote:
Nas wrote:
long time guy wrote:
Ogie has never met an Israeli Human Rights abuse that he wouldn't endorse and is per usual from the "silent majority" contingent he gets a pass on his hypocrisy.

I also find it interesting that they are now expected to speak out on all of the worldwide injustices simply because they decided to speak out on American related injustices. Also interesting is how the focus is now on the players (shocking) when the first person to grovel at the feet of the Chinese were the owners and the guy whom they paid to grovel.


If LeBron would have been the one to tweet that the same people would have torched him for causing an international crisis and a bunch of other things. Now Ogie and many others are the ones virtue signaling.


1. Bring up Israel. Check.

2. Single out. Ogie. Check.

3. Offer baseless accusations based on some imaginary scenario. Check.


For the record WFR can you ever provide an example of a human rights abuse that actually bothered you? Particularly one that is not Euro/anglocentric? How about Ogie since you are oh clingy where he is concerned?

Instead of being a dissenting voice actually provide "evidence to support your claim". Make it the academic exercise that your rather ignorant ass missed out on all those years ago and simply prove me wrong.


We both know however that you can't. Don't we

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 Post subject: Re: The NBA
PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2019 11:03 am 
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FavreFan wrote:
Ogie Oglethorpe wrote:
FavreFan wrote:
Nardi wrote:
It's the worst look yet. The NBA is in quicksand, no doubt about it.

Yeah they seemed to be getting on track a few days ago and now they're back to handling this about as poorly as possible.

The NBA under Adam Silver has never faced any real controversy so they don't know how to handle it. They are accustomed to receiving nothing but accolades.

Most of those are pretty deserved accolades considering they are compared to the NFL, NHL, and MLB. But yes, this is the moment Silver's tenure as commissioner will be defined by and he's handling it pretty poorly. I still think any criticism of the players is misguided.



Yeah especially considering that Silver is an employee of the owners. The owners groveled and the players followed suit.

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 Post subject: Re: The NBA
PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2019 11:13 am 
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Nas wrote:
WaitingforRuffcorn wrote:
Nas wrote:
long time guy wrote:
Ogie has never met an Israeli Human Rights abuse that he wouldn't endorse and is per usual from the "silent majority" contingent he gets a pass on his hypocrisy.

I also find it interesting that they are now expected to speak out on all of the worldwide injustices simply because they decided to speak out on American related injustices. Also interesting is how the focus is now on the players (shocking) when the first person to grovel at the feet of the Chinese were the owners and the guy whom they paid to grovel.


If LeBron would have been the one to tweet that the same people would have torched him for causing an international crisis and a bunch of other things. Now Ogie and many others are the ones virtue signaling.


1. Bring up Israel. Check.

2. Single out. Ogie. Check.

3. Offer baseless accusations based on some imaginary scenario. Check.


What's the prize?


More ignoring of a rather salient and relevant point.

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 Post subject: Re: The NBA
PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2019 11:14 am 
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Jorge Sedano on LeBatard show agreeing with Nas and LTG’s take on the business decision, and my take about how someone can be detained in China for being critical of the regime.

Basically, China doesn’t play by our rules or moral code.

It would be an international incident if Rachel Nichols or Lebron James were put in a Chinese prison.

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 Post subject: Re: The NBA
PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2019 11:26 am 
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Jbi11s wrote:
Jorge Sedano on LeBatard show agreeing with Nas and LTG’s take on the business decision, and my take about how someone can be detained in China for being critical of the regime.

Basically, China doesn’t play by our rules or moral code.

It would be an international incident if Rachel Nichols or Lebron James were put in a Chinese prison.


Then maybe they shouldn't be in business with dictators.

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 Post subject: Re: The NBA
PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2019 11:27 am 
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Terry's Peeps wrote:
Jbi11s wrote:
Jorge Sedano on LeBatard show agreeing with Nas and LTG’s take on the business decision, and my take about how someone can be detained in China for being critical of the regime.

Basically, China doesn’t play by our rules or moral code.

It would be an international incident if Rachel Nichols or Lebron James were put in a Chinese prison.


Then maybe they shouldn't be in business with dictators.

Image

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 Post subject: Re: The NBA
PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2019 11:33 am 
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Jbi11s wrote:
Jorge Sedano on LeBatard show agreeing with Nas and LTG’s take on the business decision, and my take about how someone can be detained in China for being critical of the regime.

Basically, China doesn’t play by our rules or moral code.

It would be an international incident if Rachel Nichols or Lebron James were put in a Chinese prison.

Their stature is too high for that to even happen. At worst they would be deported. That's why it falls upon them to speak up, because no one else on the ground in China can.

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 Post subject: Re: The NBA
PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2019 11:35 am 
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Joined: Fri Jul 27, 2007 9:10 am
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Terry's Peeps wrote:
Jbi11s wrote:
Jorge Sedano on LeBatard show agreeing with Nas and LTG’s take on the business decision, and my take about how someone can be detained in China for being critical of the regime.

Basically, China doesn’t play by our rules or moral code.

It would be an international incident if Rachel Nichols or Lebron James were put in a Chinese prison.


Then maybe they shouldn't be in business with dictators.


They aren't much of an outlier in that regard. This country made its "peace" with China (and human rights abusers) a long time ago. It's not the responsibility of the NBA to right that particular wrong.

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This is going to reach a head pretty soon.


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