The highest performing ones perform at about the level of your lowest performing Selective enrollments/Higher performing neighborhood schools.

The best performing ones are fairly solid but even their best are nowhere in the league of Young, Payton, North Side, Jones, or Lane Tech.

As Charters have proliferated the overall quality of them has declined. They have to fill seats like any other school and as they have had to keep enrollment up their lesser schools have tended to suffer.

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The rest of America has nothing to do with forcing kids who could have better outcomes into under performing schools when there is a better educational opportunities available to them.

And selectively pointing out racist policies of others, while excusing those of your employer.

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Just like you didn't know much about the ability of students to "choose" Fenwick or Lab you really don't know much about this either.

Claiming that Charters "really do care" about their kids is further indicative of this.

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There are high performing selective enrollments with a large percentage of blacks. In fact I listed them already. Meanwhile Fenwick has a black population percentage of 2.8%.

I guess they couldn't find enough scholarships to dish out to all of the needy kids desiring the sort of "choice" that you have been touting aye?

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Why is that a good thing? Taking some of the best students and tax dollars with them isn't a great deal for the school.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

You’re so opposed to Medicare for All presumably because you like your private insurance. But when presented with a market of private and public education, you are against private education. Where is the disconnect?

You are depriving the public health care system of dollars by going into a private plan. I mean, that is your education argument above, right?

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Hawaii (fuck) You

Public dollars shouldn't be funneled into private education. If you want your child to attend private then you should have to pay for it.

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I agree with that. But these movements toward charters, which are public, and tax credits for private schools is a direct reaction to the poorly run public school districts.

For high school, I paid $11,000 or so per child per year and received a $500 IL tax credit per child. The credit made no difference to me.

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Hawaii (fuck) You

The performance of most private schools isn't that great and the cost for the better ones are astronomical.

The movement is mostly due to a larger movement to further privatize education. It's not because of the performance of public schools either. Private School performance once you get past the truly elite isn't particularly great either.

They have built in advantages which inflate their numbers. Just like Charter Schools do. Public Schools do not have the same advantages.

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There is never going to be enough.

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Fenwick has a Black population of 2.8%. Most are probably athletes. By your logic Fenwick would be a rather racist school correct?

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There is no logical formulation to your statement.

The most are probably athletes is quite biased,(against young black men) but not surprising coming from you.

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My mom worked in District 54 for two decades. It is one of the better districts in the state. The stories she would tell me about disengaged teachers, uncaring parents, and the inability to discipline students were very sad.

The private schools that my children attended were quite the opposite. Parents were heavily involved. Every student and parent signed a code of conduct. Teachers were very committed to the students even showing up to my son’s travel baseball games on their own time to watch him. Sure, it’s a self selected group. But we don’t have to deal with the nonsense that goes along in the public schools including girls who think they are boys peeing in the urinals at Dundee Crown.

I’d love to fix the public schools. But try to enact rigorous standards and real teacher evaluations and see how hard teachers and parents push back.

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Hawaii (fuck) You

Nah I just demonstrated once again how much of a phony and a hypocrite that you happen to be.

As far as the actual math goes it was a simple deduction. In one instance you were quick to label CPS racist but not Fenwick which has an even lower percentage of blacks.

Again you are quite the phony and the hyoocrite.

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If they actually privatized schools to the level that you are advocating the overall quality of them would diminish too.

We work in a system which tells you that every child has to be educated. Private schools don't have that hindrance. When you have the ability to "self select" it makes a difference. You can talk about arbitrary things like standards but CPS has and has had them every year that I worked in it. It made little to know difference. The greatest predictor of achievement is the income level of the child's parent. That is what studies have shown.

We have to reform society first and then we can reform schools. I have worked in environments with extreme poverty. 95% plus poverty rates. I know what the challenges are which confront kids and teachers in theat environment. Kids I have worked with were sometimes shot or shot at as they walked to school in the morning. Parents non existent with many students in attendance just so that they would be guaranteed 2 meals (breakfast and lunch) per day. 15%-20% homeless rates.

The type of upheaval in their daily lives that you couldn't even imagine and amidst all of that they were expected to receive a "quality" education. They were the sort of kids that were invisible to the rest of society. Often times what they really and truly needed no school system was ever designed to provide for them.

And with all of this I will simply say that I would not have changed anything one bit. I preferred to work in that sort of environment because I truly believed that there was a tremendous need in them. You don't understand what teaching actually is until you have to teach in that environment.

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You and Nas discussed unruly, disruptive students last week. It's seen in middle class districts and becoming more prevalent. I think that's the issue and the school districts don't have the power to do anything about it.

They are getting away from holding kids accountable in CPS and around the state too apparently from what you're describing. It's due mostly to the SB 100 law that was passed about 5 years ago.

I believe that it is a huge mistake. There has to be accountability in the school system. Not just for teachers either. That seems to be where most of the pendulum shift has occurred in the 15-20 years or so unfortunately.
The social justice movement is running roughshod over public education currently. Much to the detriment of it imo.

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I'm not against private education. I'm against public dollars going to private education. Medicaid For All would ban private insurance. Private insurance and private schools should exist. Public tax dollars shouldn't fund private insurance or private schools.

That's consistent.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

There's no accountability for most things. I think that's the key. Catholic schools don't really have those issues not because they can kick people out but because it's not tolerated, by the teachers or the parents. Teachers and parents are still more of a team and the admin is directed by them not the other way around.

There's still a lot of goofy parents in Catholic schools who want their little angel coddled and will complain to the principal about a teacher being too hard.

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Senate Bill 100 is the worst thing to happen in education in Illinois since I started almost 20 years ago.

As for fixing teaching evals and more rigorous standards, unless the district pays well, many places have jobs they can not fill or even get applications for. We had two jobs go unfilled the entire year.

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Sure, but their impact on others is not the same.

The first school I taught at closed specifically because the pastor did not hire a teacher at the school who applied to be principal. The lady who came in took a bunch of shit all year from the parent groups and when the pastor refused to fire her, more half the school up and left for another local catholic school at the end of the year. Went from a school of 200 to less than 90 and closed the following year.

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Herein lies the problem with Charters. No one wants to work in an environment where they are underpaid, underappreciated, and with little to no job security.

The turnover rate in such schools is obscene.

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The ability to kick kids out without due process is something that cannot happen in CPS. That is one difference.

The ability to kick students out that aren't on course to graduate allows them to fraudulently inflate their graduation rate.

They can deny admittance to students they don't want. Public Schiols cannot. Ambiguous analysis such as parents and administration working as a team is just that, ambiguous.

Public Schools are required by law to accept every student. Catholics are not and when they want they can simply get rid of students. That makes a huge difference whether you think so or not.

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Do you think that a lot of Catholic Schools kick kids out? They don't and it's not arbitrary. You and Nas had a lengthy discussion about students, parents,and the administration. That's the real problem. You know there are disruptive kids but the public schools can't or don't do anything about it, they aren't allowed to. They cater to them and everybody else is left behind. Volunteers don't help, more money doesn't help, and you know the teachers are helpless.

My son's high school has a 98%+ acceptance rate I think. It's not competitive. They don't kick people out. The economic, racial, and social status doesn't matter.

Catholic School enrollment has been on the decline for decades now. If they were the panacea or even a much better option that would not have occurred.

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Should someone get a tax break if they have their own private security team because they have relieved that state of the financial prudence of police protection for that individual?

Should Elon Musk get a tax break because he has relieved the government of going to space?
Who pays for the UN to shit all over the US?
Why does Joe Windmill get breaks and not Pete Nuclear?
Are these good questions or stupid questions?

Well, the students aren't buying the CPS party line anymore.


https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/bre ... story.html

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