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Did he leave the family "alone" or "a loan"?
Alone 75%  75%  [ 12 ]
A Loan 25%  25%  [ 4 ]
Total votes : 16
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2020 9:46 am 
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Tall Midget wrote:
Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:
Tall Midget wrote:
What if he took out a loan from a loan shark?


I would think he would have had to.

The man never worked a day in his life.


Indeed, a person of Papa's financial standing is unlikely to obtain monetary resources through the "legitimate" economy. He would undoubtedly need to conduct his financial transactions through a shadow economy (as represented in the figure of the loan shark), part of the "illegitimate" social world that he almost exclusively inhabits. From this perspective, we must see Papa not as enforcer of the law and cornerstone of the reigning social structure--as in, say, Lacanian psychoanalysis, though we might be able to extend this thinking to the structuralism of Levi-Strauss--but as a symptom of chaos and a force for social disorder. As a result, it is a virtual certainty that the only legacy Papa has left for his legitimate family is a lifetime of illegitimate debt that will only serve to plunge his son into the shadow world of the informal economy from which his mother has sought to protect him. In this case, it is indeed "a loan" that the son inherits from the father, but this loan is not a gateway to economic freedom; rather, it is simply insurance that the parallel (anti)social world he embodies--built upon a foundation of false hope and deception--will be reproduced in future generations. Papa is, indeed, a "rolling stone", and his momentum leads in only one direction--downhill.


Of course, everyone can see that ongoing cycle. I own a pair of Levis. I like the way they fit.

Well, then why doesn't Mama just keep her mouth shut instead of filling in the gaps on how Papa led his life?

And, quite frankly, if she is going to say anything about it, why be so vague. A child is going to want to solve those mysteries and, in doing so, get him or herself wrapped in those same vices.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2020 9:48 am 
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good dolphin wrote:
Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:
Tall Midget wrote:
What if he took out a loan from a loan shark?


I would think he would have had to.

The man never worked a day in his life.


maybe he took out a PPP


Well, that would almost certainly be forgiven.

So, I would suppose "alone" is the correct answer.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2020 8:41 pm 
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Alright, thinking about this a bit more...

Wherever he laid his hat was his home.

Could that be a legal determination that would then transfer a legal obligation to his family?

Because, based on the rest of the song, that could be many homes and financial responsibility.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2020 8:46 pm 
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Tall Midget wrote:
"Papa Was a Rolling Stone" is a masterpiece, but I've always liked "Across 110th Street" better (as far as songs about the post-60s inner city go).

The theme to Good Times has them both beat.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2020 8:51 pm 
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Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Tall Midget wrote:
"Papa Was a Rolling Stone" is a masterpiece, but I've always liked "Across 110th Street" better (as far as songs about the post-60s inner city go).

The theme to Good Times has them both beat.



Crazy talk. Papa is a think piece. Makes you reevaluate every decision you've made in your life and its impact on those around you.

The act of taking a hat off your head might have implications.

After you get through the 5-minute intro.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2020 8:52 pm 
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I can't believe I got no traction on that shark joke. You guys are a tough crowd.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2020 8:52 pm 
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Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Tall Midget wrote:
"Papa Was a Rolling Stone" is a masterpiece, but I've always liked "Across 110th Street" better (as far as songs about the post-60s inner city go).

The theme to Good Times has them both beat.

Closing theme to WKRP.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2020 8:57 pm 
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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Tall Midget wrote:
"Papa Was a Rolling Stone" is a masterpiece, but I've always liked "Across 110th Street" better (as far as songs about the post-60s inner city go).

The theme to Good Times has them both beat.



Crazy talk. Papa is a think piece. Makes you reevaluate every decision you've made in your life and its impact on those around you.

The act of taking a hat off your head might have implications.

After you get through the 5-minute intro.

Interestingly there was a misunderstood lyric in Good Times as well...

The season one DVD box set has the lyric as "Hangin' in a chow line".
However the writers, the Bergmans, confirmed that it is actually "Hangin' in and jivin'

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2020 8:59 pm 
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The Jefferson's song, "Moving on Up" was very underrated as well in my opinion.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2020 9:00 pm 
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Alright, I'm ready to break down the Good Times theme as a white, Irish, 50 year old man that grew up on a farm in about the whitest area in America.

Let's do it.

I did watch Good Times. I had no context as a yout' to understand the social implications but I liked the show.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2020 9:06 pm 
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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:
Alright, I'm ready to break down the Good Times theme as a white, Irish, 50 year old man that grew up on a farm in about the whitest area in America.

Let's do it.

I did watch Good Times. I had no context as a yout' to understand the social implications but I liked the show.

The Chicago projects were scary to a young Zippy. Bob Newhart’s apartment seemed like a much safer area of town.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2020 9:10 pm 
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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:
Alright, I'm ready to break down the Good Times theme as a white, Irish, 50 year old man that grew up on a farm in about the whitest area in America.

Let's do it.

I did watch Good Times. I had no context as a yout' to understand the social implications but I liked the show.



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PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2020 9:12 pm 
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Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:
Alright, I'm ready to break down the Good Times theme as a white, Irish, 50 year old man that grew up on a farm in about the whitest area in America.

Let's do it.

I did watch Good Times. I had no context as a yout' to understand the social implications but I liked the show.

The Chicago projects were scary to a young Zippy. Bob Newhart’s apartment seemed like a much safer area of town.


The degree of difficulty of breaking down the theme to The Bob Newhart show is significantly higher.

I did love that show, though. That might be prime for a rewatch.

You have to love the story of an Illinois guy that got his accounting degree and realized later in life that comedy was his real calling.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2020 9:13 pm 
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Hawg Ass wrote:
The Jefferson's song, "Moving on Up" was very underrated as well in my opinion.

Yeah, but they lived across from the Bunkers before that so it wasn’t like they were on skid row.

Side note: The All in the Family theme also had a difficult to decipher lyric. Notice in later seasons they slow down when they sing “gee our old LaSalle ran great”.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2020 9:13 pm 
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Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:
Alright, I'm ready to break down the Good Times theme as a white, Irish, 50 year old man that grew up on a farm in about the whitest area in America.

Let's do it.

I did watch Good Times. I had no context as a yout' to understand the social implications but I liked the show.

The Chicago projects were scary to a young Zippy. Bob Newhart’s apartment seemed like a much safer area of town.

Plus a 35 year old Suzanne Pleshette was an obviously better fuck than a 45 year old Esther Rolle.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2020 9:14 pm 
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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:
Alright, I'm ready to break down the Good Times theme as a white, Irish, 50 year old man that grew up on a farm in about the whitest area in America.

Let's do it.

I did watch Good Times. I had no context as a yout' to understand the social implications but I liked the show.

The Chicago projects were scary to a young Zippy. Bob Newhart’s apartment seemed like a much safer area of town.


The degree of difficulty of breaking down the theme to The Bob Newhart show is significantly higher.

I did love that show, though. That might be prime for a rewatch.

You have to love the story of an Illinois guy that got his accounting degree and realized later in life that comedy was his real calling.

That was the height of bad clothing. The wide ties and plaid clothing is very distracting.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2020 9:16 pm 
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Chet Coppock's Fur Coat wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:
Alright, I'm ready to break down the Good Times theme as a white, Irish, 50 year old man that grew up on a farm in about the whitest area in America.

Let's do it.

I did watch Good Times. I had no context as a yout' to understand the social implications but I liked the show.

The Chicago projects were scary to a young Zippy. Bob Newhart’s apartment seemed like a much safer area of town.

Plus a 35 year old Suzanne Pleshette was an obviously better fuck than a 45 year old Esther Rolle.

You don’t know that.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2020 9:17 pm 
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Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:
Alright, I'm ready to break down the Good Times theme as a white, Irish, 50 year old man that grew up on a farm in about the whitest area in America.

Let's do it.

I did watch Good Times. I had no context as a yout' to understand the social implications but I liked the show.

The Chicago projects were scary to a young Zippy. Bob Newhart’s apartment seemed like a much safer area of town.


The degree of difficulty of breaking down the theme to The Bob Newhart show is significantly higher.

I did love that show, though. That might be prime for a rewatch.

You have to love the story of an Illinois guy that got his accounting degree and realized later in life that comedy was his real calling.

That was the height of bad clothing. The wide ties and plaid clothing is very distracting.


ya the 70s sucked


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2020 9:17 pm 
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Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Chet Coppock's Fur Coat wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:
Alright, I'm ready to break down the Good Times theme as a white, Irish, 50 year old man that grew up on a farm in about the whitest area in America.

Let's do it.

I did watch Good Times. I had no context as a yout' to understand the social implications but I liked the show.

The Chicago projects were scary to a young Zippy. Bob Newhart’s apartment seemed like a much safer area of town.

Plus a 35 year old Suzanne Pleshette was an obviously better fuck than a 45 year old Esther Rolle.

You don’t know that.

To a 12 year old, it was pretty obvious.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2020 9:29 pm 
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Chet Coppock's Fur Coat wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Chet Coppock's Fur Coat wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:
Alright, I'm ready to break down the Good Times theme as a white, Irish, 50 year old man that grew up on a farm in about the whitest area in America.

Let's do it.

I did watch Good Times. I had no context as a yout' to understand the social implications but I liked the show.

The Chicago projects were scary to a young Zippy. Bob Newhart’s apartment seemed like a much safer area of town.

Plus a 35 year old Suzanne Pleshette was an obviously better fuck than a 45 year old Esther Rolle.

You don’t know that.

To a 12 year old, it was pretty obvious.
yeah probably. That smoky voice was enticing.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2020 9:34 pm 
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Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Chet Coppock's Fur Coat wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Chet Coppock's Fur Coat wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:
Alright, I'm ready to break down the Good Times theme as a white, Irish, 50 year old man that grew up on a farm in about the whitest area in America.

Let's do it.

I did watch Good Times. I had no context as a yout' to understand the social implications but I liked the show.

The Chicago projects were scary to a young Zippy. Bob Newhart’s apartment seemed like a much safer area of town.

Plus a 35 year old Suzanne Pleshette was an obviously better fuck than a 45 year old Esther Rolle.

You don’t know that.

To a 12 year old, it was pretty obvious.
yeah probably. That smoky voice was enticing.

Although Mary Tyler Moore smoked all of them, especially once she dumped the Season One long wig.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2020 9:36 pm 
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Dr. Ken, after Good Times, can you decompose the differences in the MTM theme song and intro graphics across seasons?

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 24, 2020 8:41 am 
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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:
Alright, I'm ready to break down the Good Times theme as a white, Irish, 50 year old man that grew up on a farm in about the whitest area in America.

Let's do it.

I did watch Good Times. I had no context as a yout' to understand the social implications but I liked the show.

The Chicago projects were scary to a young Zippy. Bob Newhart’s apartment seemed like a much safer area of town.


The degree of difficulty of breaking down the theme to The Bob Newhart show is significantly higher.

I did love that show, though. That might be prime for a rewatch.

You have to love the story of an Illinois guy that got his accounting degree and realized later in life that comedy was his real calling.


SICP creates Renaissance men.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 24, 2020 8:47 am 
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Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:
Alright, I'm ready to break down the Good Times theme as a white, Irish, 50 year old man that grew up on a farm in about the whitest area in America.

Let's do it.

I did watch Good Times. I had no context as a yout' to understand the social implications but I liked the show.

The Chicago projects were scary to a young Zippy. Bob Newhart’s apartment seemed like a much safer area of town.


I always found them fascinating. Same with the beginning of Welcome Back Kotter. I always laughed when the kid playing wall ball got hit with the pitch.

Still, those shows are just slightly ahead of my time. I enjoyed them more through the magic of WGN daytime re runs

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 24, 2020 9:57 am 
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Chet Coppock's Fur Coat wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:
Alright, I'm ready to break down the Good Times theme as a white, Irish, 50 year old man that grew up on a farm in about the whitest area in America.

Let's do it.

I did watch Good Times. I had no context as a yout' to understand the social implications but I liked the show.

The Chicago projects were scary to a young Zippy. Bob Newhart’s apartment seemed like a much safer area of town.

Plus a 35 year old Suzanne Pleshette was an obviously better fuck than a 45 year old Esther Rolle.

This guy gets it, once again.

I watch the old Newhart episodes when I can. They hold up really well.

The first few seasons of Good Times were great. We didn't get to watch them in our house, so, like Illini hoops, I watched on the sly.

I knew both were set in Chicago, but I sure as hell didn't recognize anything Chicago in them. When I was about eight, I just assumed Chicago was neighborhood after neighborhood of bars and homes with a big Catholic church in the middle (or the former big Catholic church in the black neighborhoods) and a downtown, which was always cold.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 24, 2020 10:21 am 
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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:
Alright, I'm ready to break down the Good Times theme as a white, Irish, 50 year old man that grew up on a farm in about the whitest area in America.

Let's do it.

I did watch Good Times. I had no context as a yout' to understand the social implications but I liked the show.



Hey.. Bureau county is only 98% white (not sure I’d that’s the right number but it’s believable).

94.2. I was close.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 24, 2020 10:46 am 
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Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Bob Newhart’s apartment seemed like a much safer area of town.


Where did that fucker live anyway? He definitely gets on the Brown Line heading north at Chicago Avenue but I'm not sure where he gets off. Is it Quincy? And then somehow he ends up in a building that looks like mine.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V-PLEhiOeVA

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 24, 2020 11:04 am 
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Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Bob Newhart’s apartment seemed like a much safer area of town.


Where did that fucker live anyway? He definitely gets on the Brown Line heading north at Chicago Avenue but I'm not sure where he gets off. Is it Quincy? And then somehow he ends up in a building that looks like mine.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V-PLEhiOeVA


I never realized Lorenzo Music created that show.

He was the voice of Garfield.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 24, 2020 11:12 am 
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Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Bob Newhart’s apartment seemed like a much safer area of town.


Where did that fucker live anyway? He definitely gets on the Brown Line heading north at Chicago Avenue but I'm not sure where he gets off. Is it Quincy? And then somehow he ends up in a building that looks like mine.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V-PLEhiOeVA

Isn't that building on the Inner Drive around Bryn Mawr?

I thought you lived in West Rogers Park around Lunt? There's no buildings like that in that part of the RP. Sounds like you're an Edgewater/Sheridan Rd. guy now.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 24, 2020 11:50 am 
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Tall Midget wrote:
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Bob Newhart’s apartment seemed like a much safer area of town.


Where did that fucker live anyway? He definitely gets on the Brown Line heading north at Chicago Avenue but I'm not sure where he gets off. Is it Quincy? And then somehow he ends up in a building that looks like mine.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V-PLEhiOeVA

Isn't that building on the Inner Drive around Bryn Mawr?

I thought you lived in West Rogers Park around Lunt? There's no buildings like that in that part of the RP. Sounds like you're an Edgewater/Sheridan Rd. guy now.



I think you're right that his building is in Edgewater. I'm still in the same place. I know that isn't my building, just similar mid-mod construction.

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