Aren't you arguing that Babe Ruth was as athletic as Barry Bonds?

_________________
You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

More athletic.

Here's one of those tiny and weak white guys from the 50s who could never hold his own against the power of P.K. Subban:

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

Think about how good whoever that person is could have been if they hadn't had to be a fisherman in the offseason.

_________________
You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Robert Marvin Hull

_________________
Proud member of the white guy grievance committee

It aint the six minutes. Its what happens in those six minutes.

JORR, how do you know Butkus was faster than Ray Lewis?

_________________
"He is a loathsome, offensive brute
--yet I can't look away."

Shouldn't they rename the negro leagues to the Person of Color leagues?

I've seen his 40 times. But whatever. I don't even really want to have such a dumb argument. Whether or not one guy was slightly faster is immaterial. It's not like Butkus was running with his shoes tied together. And if you think George Mikan couldn't have guarded Daniel Oturu, you're just mistaken.

Let's try it this way. Do you think Jack Johnson and Joe Lewis were less athletic than Anthony Joshua and Andy Ruiz?

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

I am on your side in this argument. I was just curious what you were basing that statement on.

_________________
"He is a loathsome, offensive brute
--yet I can't look away."

Bobby Hull wins it! Much the best!

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

Does establishing them as Major League provide any benefits to the former players like pension and healthcare?

_________________
O judgment! Thou art fled to brutish beasts,
And men have lost their reason.

I like the mental image of Brick arguing with Isaac Newton and not conceding a point.

_________________
O judgment! Thou art fled to brutish beasts,
And men have lost their reason.

They did get a small pension about twenty years back. It wasn't too much, if I remember korrectli. Not sure about health care.

I wonder how many are left? Hammerin' Hank and Minnie Minoso were the last ones to play.

I think all the families get 40 acres and a mule .

_________________
Proud member of the white guy grievance committee

It aint the six minutes. Its what happens in those six minutes.

They honored Federal League stats. It's hard to say Japan's league is NOT a major league.

According to the Baseball Hall of Fame, Gibson officially has 115 HRs. My guess is they'll dig up a few hundred more. Enough to get him over the 500 mark.

Gonna have to agree with this.

I don't know, Nardi. What's next? The Korean league? The Mexican leagues? I mean, the Japanese league is a major league, but still not quite MLB-caliber. It's not the CFL, but it's probably better than Triple A.

You're right about Federal League stats. I meant to say that somewhere above. But that was a pretty good league, from the sounds of it.

Why honor stats before 1910? The invention of the cork center in the ball. Before then, teams scored 3 runs and routinely made 8 errors.

You guys are raising some legit questions. 1) What defines a major league? 2) Why do the AL and NL get to declare what it is?

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

Japan has a major league. It's objectively true.

What makes a league "major"?

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

Where does Bruce get 800 hrs from?

_________________

Barnstorming MLBers playing them and losing. MLBers saying "they're good".

Thats not really what was happening. Framing this like the Harlem globetrotters is wrong.

_________________

And when has a Japanese team beaten MLB players? Charlie Manuel and Tuffy Rhodes were Japanese MVPs for God's sake. Plus there is a limit to foreign players on teams.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

I would agree with the soft version of this argument. I think there were some Black players (they called them "Chief" and "Babe"). The pre-1900 numbers seem a little silly, but the problem is that you can say that about the dead ball era, and then again about the 20s and 30s (the rabbit ball), and then during WWII. It seems like that argument says that it wasn't "real" baseball.

Yet the game would have been significantly better with Negro League stars. I wonder which owners would have had the balls to sign a bunch of them? (Bill Veeck always wanted to, even when he was with the cubs, who suck balls.)

Cy Young and a few others are aberrations. But at least he knew how to stay healthy. Not sure how hard he threw, but there was a reason they called young Denton "Cyclone." But I do wish the award was the Walter Johnson award.

The game's best player played back then, too. And unlike Bonds, he wasn't the product of his era (steroids); he created his own era, like YHWH, out of nothing. The rest of the league (with the exception of the White Sox) caught on.

Japan has had a professional league since 1934 after Babe Ruth and some of the boys barnstormed Japan.

https://www.mlb.com/news/japan-wins-for ... c300750774

They dominated Little League for the past decade. Japan also won the World Baseball Classic a few times.

_________________
Why are only 14 percent of black CPS 11th-graders proficient in English?

--the highest level possible as determined by the players and the market
--the league where, for a collection or aggregate of skills, success in one league would translate to success in every other

Generally, Negro league pitching could never catch up to the hitting. It was bad. I don't doubt Gibson had 800+.

BIPOC Leagues would be the preferred nomenclature.

_________________