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 Post subject: Re: Off-season Wish List
PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2022 10:47 am 
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Sounds like Poles is looking to build a 5-12 football team with no bad contracts.


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 Post subject: Re: Off-season Wish List
PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2022 10:56 am 
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Caller Bob wrote:
Sounds like Poles is looking to build a 5-12 football team with no bad contracts.


Pretty much. If Poles really wants to tank, he needs to consider trading Roquan. If the Bears can get a first-, second-, and third-round pick in return, that deal would be hard to pass up. Paying Roquan $20 million/season starting in 2023 doesn't seem like a sound idea.

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 Post subject: Re: Off-season Wish List
PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2022 11:36 am 
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Tall Midget wrote:
Caller Bob wrote:
Sounds like Poles is looking to build a 5-12 football team with no bad contracts.


Pretty much. If Poles really wants to tank, he needs to consider trading Roquan. If the Bears can get a first-, second-, and third-round pick in return, that deal would be hard to pass up. Paying Roquan $20 million/season starting in 2023 doesn't seem like a sound idea.

I disagree with trading Roquan. He's young and extremely talented. You need guys like that and he should be a key building block. Tanking doesn't require completely gutting the team & it's unlikely you would get somebody as good down the road. At this point I would focus on helping Fields and see what you've got. If he sucks, then tanking won't be a problem. If he's good they are ahead of the game and Smith will be needed to keep that side of the ball competitive.

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 Post subject: Re: Off-season Wish List
PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2022 11:44 am 
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For what it's worth, Pro Football focus had Roquan ranked as the 65th best linebacker out of 87 players ranked.

The draft will be an interesting window into Poles timeline, both for Fields and the Bears. At pick 39, the best player available will likely not be a WR, but more likely will be a Edge rusher, a linebacker or a CB. Will Poles bypass a better player to draft the best WR left for Fields or will he go best player available regardless of position?

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 Post subject: Re: Off-season Wish List
PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2022 11:48 am 
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Augie wrote:
For what it's worth, Pro Football focus had Roquan ranked as the 65th best linebacker out of 87 players ranked.

The draft will be an interesting window into Poles timeline, both for Fields and the Bears. At pick 39, the best player available will likely not be a WR, but more likely will be a Edge rusher, a linebacker or a CB. Will Poles bypass a better player to draft the best WR left for Fields or will he go best player available regardless of position?


And that's how you know Pro Football Focus is shit.....


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 Post subject: Re: Off-season Wish List
PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2022 12:01 pm 
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There's certainly an argument to be made what the value of a great MLB is in comparison to a great rush linebacker or corner. I think Roquan's still underrated as an MLB, but I think the ceiling of what a MLB can do is fairly low, but that's just ~analytics~


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 Post subject: Re: Off-season Wish List
PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2022 12:05 pm 
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Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Tall Midget wrote:
Caller Bob wrote:
Sounds like Poles is looking to build a 5-12 football team with no bad contracts.


Pretty much. If Poles really wants to tank, he needs to consider trading Roquan. If the Bears can get a first-, second-, and third-round pick in return, that deal would be hard to pass up. Paying Roquan $20 million/season starting in 2023 doesn't seem like a sound idea.

I disagree with trading Roquan. He's young and extremely talented. You need guys like that and he should be a key building block. Tanking doesn't require completely gutting the team & it's unlikely you would get somebody as good down the road. At this point I would focus on helping Fields and see what you've got. If he sucks, then tanking won't be a problem. If he's good they are ahead of the game and Smith will be needed to keep that side of the ball competitive.


Roquan isn't worth the contract he is going to command when his rookie deal expires, and, equally important, his career peak won't align with the peak of the core players Poles hopes to bring in through the next few drafts. He is a very good--but not transcendent--player who can be replaced fairly easily by what the team will receive in return by trading rather than re-signing him: multiple high draft picks, a significant amount of cap space that can be used to sign multiple quality free agents, and a worse record in 2022 that will yield a better 2023 draft first-round draft pick. Trading Roquan is the right decision for a team just embarking on a rebuilding phase as the Bears are. It would make sense to keep him if they were closer to contending--overpaying veterans at that juncture is a smart move.

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 Post subject: Re: Off-season Wish List
PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2022 12:24 pm 
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Poles is trying to enter the good graces of his bosses by cutting costs. He knows he'll have a grace period because dumbass fans won't criticize a first time HC and GM in the first year.

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 Post subject: Re: Off-season Wish List
PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2022 12:49 pm 
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veganfan21 wrote:
Poles is trying to enter the good graces of his bosses by cutting costs. He knows he'll have a grace period because dumbass fans won't criticize a first time HC and GM in the first year.


Poles is cutting costs because the Bears have a shit ton of dead cap space and had a bunch of expiring contracts following the 2021 season.

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 Post subject: Re: Off-season Wish List
PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2022 12:53 pm 
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They are using the dead money as an artificial (self imposed) salary cap. Yeah there is alot of dead money, but considering they are a 5 billion franchise you would think they could suck it up and still spend to the cap this year....but like I said, Wolworth 5 and Dime


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 Post subject: Re: Off-season Wish List
PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2022 1:07 pm 
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Tall Midget wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Poles is trying to enter the good graces of his bosses by cutting costs. He knows he'll have a grace period because dumbass fans won't criticize a first time HC and GM in the first year.


Poles is cutting costs because the Bears have a shit ton of dead cap space and had a bunch of expiring contracts following the 2021 season.


why not both?

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 Post subject: Re: Off-season Wish List
PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2022 1:17 pm 
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Caller Bob wrote:
They are using the dead money as an artificial (self imposed) salary cap. Yeah there is alot of dead money, but considering they are a 5 billion franchise you would think they could suck it up and still spend to the cap this year....but like I said, Wolworth 5 and Dime


It's not really a self-imposed cap if you start signing free agents to backloaded contracts with voidable years because you will then find yourself in a situation where you need to cut payroll just as the foundational core you drafted is reaching its prime and/or nearing the end of rookie contracts.

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 Post subject: Re: Off-season Wish List
PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2022 1:24 pm 
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City of Fools wrote:
Tall Midget wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Poles is trying to enter the good graces of his bosses by cutting costs. He knows he'll have a grace period because dumbass fans won't criticize a first time HC and GM in the first year.


Poles is cutting costs because the Bears have a shit ton of dead cap space and had a bunch of expiring contracts following the 2021 season.


why not both?


Because the Bears have a shit ton of dead cap space and had a bunch of expiring contracts following the 2021 season.

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 Post subject: Re: Off-season Wish List
PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2022 1:49 pm 
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Tall Midget wrote:
City of Fools wrote:
Tall Midget wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Poles is trying to enter the good graces of his bosses by cutting costs. He knows he'll have a grace period because dumbass fans won't criticize a first time HC and GM in the first year.


Poles is cutting costs because the Bears have a shit ton of dead cap space and had a bunch of expiring contracts following the 2021 season.


why not both?


Because the Bears have a shit ton of dead cap space and had a bunch of expiring contracts following the 2021 season.

It is shit ton of dead cap space and expiring contracts....on BAD players.

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 Post subject: Re: Off-season Wish List
PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2022 5:34 pm 
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I'm in complete agreement with TM on Roquan. He's clearly a guy who likes to eat, too. That catches up with you.

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 Post subject: Re: Off-season Wish List
PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2022 7:01 pm 
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I'm fascinated to see how Poles pulls this off. He's tearing the Bears down to the studs with a QB in year 2 on a rookie deal.

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 Post subject: Re: Off-season Wish List
PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2022 7:26 pm 
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Lamented this from day 1 of this dude's era. Where is the fucking strategy? Who the fuck doesn't surround the prospect with the personnel he needs to optimize his skills and let you know just what you have in him? What the fuck is the point of all this bargain bin dollar store shopping shit? Makes no sense at all.

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 Post subject: Re: Off-season Wish List
PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2022 7:41 pm 
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He’s not sold on Fields and wants to draft his own QB. Only explanation


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 Post subject: Re: Off-season Wish List
PostPosted: Sat Apr 09, 2022 8:01 am 
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Caller Bob wrote:
He’s not sold on Fields and wants to draft his own QB. Only explanation


Does seem odd to not build the Oline with at least competent vets via FA, would seem evaluating Fields is crucial and giving him at least a competent Oline would be the only way to really see what he could produce.

Seeing stuff leaked out discussing how much Poles supposedly disliked nearly every offensive lineman on the roster when he took over, and that makes sense given the decision he made not to bring Daniels back, and the leaked articles about him not liking Borom or Jenkins. The problem is that he will have to rely on guys he supposedly does not like to fill crucial roles on the team, Jenkins needs to be able to play RT and Borom will likely get starts at either tackle or guard at some time during the year.

The only thing that would make sense given his supposed comments would be to bring more FA's in to fill crucial roles and go heavy at Oline in the draft, then pray that the rookie guys will be able to start, this all seems like a fairly tall order, so it looks like he is going to go into the year with at best a well below average offensive line, which would make it difficult to evaluate Fields.


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 Post subject: Re: Off-season Wish List
PostPosted: Sat Apr 09, 2022 8:11 am 
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If Poles is operating under the assumption he’s going build an entirely new roster, I go back to the idea this is a minimum 4-5 year rebuild and he’ll be out of work by the time it’s over.

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 Post subject: Re: Off-season Wish List
PostPosted: Sat Apr 09, 2022 8:30 am 
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I still don't have an issue with Poles' approach before the draft. For the most part, it's pretty sound to me.

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 Post subject: Re: Off-season Wish List
PostPosted: Sat Apr 09, 2022 8:32 am 
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Nas wrote:
I still don't have an issue with Poles' approach before the draft. For the most part, it's pretty sound to me.



Im with ya, he is gutting the team, getting rid of dead weight anf clearing up cap space.. next year is his time to make moves..this year just get a WR and O line and secondary from the draft.

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 Post subject: Re: Off-season Wish List
PostPosted: Sat Apr 09, 2022 8:33 am 
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This Ends in Antioch wrote:
If Poles is operating under the assumption he’s going build an entirely new roster, I go back to the idea this is a minimum 4-5 year rebuild and he’ll be out of work by the time it’s over.


In the NFL you can go from outhouse to penthouse on 2 years.

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 Post subject: Re: Off-season Wish List
PostPosted: Sat Apr 09, 2022 11:48 am 
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I think he is waiting to see what the draft brings including the ensuing cuts of veterans by other teams.

I've always liked that approach. There are always good players that come available on the cheap in May but we never seemed to have money left with Pace. Right now, there are really good veteran FA still on the market. They just need a few more weeks of expectations readjustment before they start jumping at lifeboat offers.

by the way, we are going to end up liking the Tavon Young signing

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 Post subject: Re: Off-season Wish List
PostPosted: Sat Apr 09, 2022 7:24 pm 
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good dolphin wrote:

by the way, we are going to end up liking the Tavon Young signing


Let's hope he doesn't blow out his knee for a third time by October.

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 Post subject: Re: Off-season Wish List
PostPosted: Mon Apr 11, 2022 8:58 am 
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Just read an article on Pace's draft of 2019.

David Montgomery and Duke Shelley are the only two picks that even remain.

What a fuckin shit show Pace ran.

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 Post subject: Re: Off-season Wish List
PostPosted: Mon Apr 11, 2022 9:01 am 
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Seacrest wrote:
Just read an article on Pace's draft of 2019.

David Montgomery and Duke Shelley are the only two picks that even remain.

What a fuckin shit show Pace ran.


They didn't have a 1st or 2nd because of Thieving Mack, and they traded up for wildly overrated Montgomery.

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 Post subject: Re: Off-season Wish List
PostPosted: Mon Apr 11, 2022 9:01 am 
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Seacrest wrote:
Just read an article on Pace's draft of 2019.

David Montgomery and Duke Shelley are the only two picks that even remain.

What a fuckin shit show Pace ran.


They didn't have a 1st or 2nd because of Thieving Mack, and they traded up for wildly overrated Montgomery.

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 Post subject: Re: Off-season Wish List
PostPosted: Mon Apr 11, 2022 9:10 am 
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Nas wrote:
Seacrest wrote:
Just read an article on Pace's draft of 2019.

David Montgomery and Duke Shelley are the only two picks that even remain.

What a fuckin shit show Pace ran.


They didn't have a 1st or 2nd because of Thieving Mack, and they traded up for wildly overrated Montgomery.


They didn't have a 2nd round pick in 2019 because Ryan Pace gave it up a year earlier for future HOF WR Anthony Miller.


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 Post subject: Re: Off-season Wish List
PostPosted: Mon Apr 11, 2022 9:12 am 
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Caller Bob wrote:
Nas wrote:
Seacrest wrote:
Just read an article on Pace's draft of 2019.

David Montgomery and Duke Shelley are the only two picks that even remain.

What a fuckin shit show Pace ran.


They didn't have a 1st or 2nd because of Thieving Mack, and they traded up for wildly overrated Montgomery.


They didn't have a 2nd round pick in 2019 because Ryan Pace gave it up a year earlier for future HOF WR Anthony Miller.


I think you're right. I thought they gave up a 2nd for Reggie White 2.0.

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