Should the 2021 White Sox be viewed similarly to the 2005 White Sox?

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

I nominate that as the King of Strawman Arguments.

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Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

Nas bolded this text of yours: I think he feels that winning a World Series isn't the definitive measure of his performance.

So, unless Beane is wrong, would he not view the 2021 White Sox and the 2005 White Sox similarly?

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

No. You're looking at events after they have occurred. Beane consistently builds good teams with a low budget. Kenny Williams regularly builds losers with high payrolls. One year he threw a tantrum and traded good players for bums and got lucky. That clearly wasn't repeatable.

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Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

For the " managers don't matter crew" explain Philly this year.

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This is a strange road to go down when Girardi has always been considered a "good" manager.

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Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

You have to look back to judge careers.

If you want me to say it another way though.

I tell you that the White Sox will:
1) Make the playoffs the next 10 years. World Series wins 0.
2) Make the playoffs 2 times in the next 10 years. World Series wins 1.

Which option do you choose? What if you change it to 30 years? Does it change your answer?

We can assign the unlucky label to Beane as that is a better excuse than the wins per dollar spent thing.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

I'm honestly not sure. It's a tough question.

How about this though? Would you rather have your team make the playoffs ten times or twice in the next ten years assuming we don't know what will happen after they make it? Which one has a better chance to win a World Series?

I get that you're not a gambler. People that aren't often have difficulty interpreting odds and understanding that a losing bet can be better than a winning one. For example, a guy at the craps table playing the pass line and taking his max odds may lose $3000 on the night while a drunk comes stumbling up to the table and throws $100 on the Yo and happens to win. That doesn't mean the second guy is a better gambler or did anything right at all.

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Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

GM's are judged on success. You don't generally get called a genius because you consistently lose. Despite creating really good odds for yourself.

I don't consider the *Dodgers or Athletics to be more successful than the Sox over the past 20 years.

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Be well

GO BEARS!!!

Beane doesn't consistently lose though.

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Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

[quote="Joe Orr Road Rod"]

Only 1 team "wins" every year. A Billy Beane team hasn't been one of those teams in 30 years. What would be his player comp as a GM?

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Be well

GO BEARS!!!

In the playoffs he does.

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Danny Ainge

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Scotty PODS!!!!! SCOPO!!!!!

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Wattabout Kodak Black?

I think that gets into a philosophical discussion. Do we hold Bill Buckner at fault for missing the ball considering he had a 99% chance of getting the ball and he was just unlucky?

I think ultimately in sports you have to judge someone based on what happened rather than on the probability of that thing happening.

Though, I would argue the sample size on Beane is big enough to make it fairly obvious that how he builds a team does not win in the playoffs. It's not like he is the Braves or Bills getting right to the doorstep of a title and failing. Beane's teams have less playoff series wins than the 2005 Chicago White Sox and one of those series wins was the wild card round that didn't exist in 2005.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

I think that White Sox fans are pretty unique fans in terms of frustration. Maybe there are other owners similar to Reinny ?I don't know but I think that the great percentage of White Sox fans know baseball and what it takes to win a championship. Their frustration is basically that they know that the team owner is not committed to winning championships. He never has. He's a self centered egotist that refuses to invest in building a team by hiring smart baseball people to do their jobs and whose first priority is to win a World Series.

Just look back to 2019-2020. The young talent was being gathered and the future was bright. They had the makings of a good pitching staff and a bunch of young talent and future stars. What has happened since then? I say NOTHING and in effect, they are WORSE THAN THAT 2020 team. They have needed a right fielder, a second baseman, and left handed hitting for three years and did NOTHING to improve the roster.

So now they miss out on the play-offs and there is NO CHANCE that anything will happen. MEanwhile, somehow, Sox attendance was good and that is the ONLY THING that Reinny cares about. He's like a fat war lord sitting on top of his castle collecting his tithes, drinking his ale and dining on venison.

I believe that Hahn will quit while he is still young enough to get out and find a place which wants to win a championship. Williams is a puppet who cowtows to Rienny, LaRussa was a bum who sold Reinny an idea that he was the guy to take the team and more talent was not needed. Every good baseball person KNEW that the White Sox team roster over the last three years was not a championship team. When have we seen Hahn say anything profound about the team's fortune? HE's got to be pissed off, right? He knows talent and knows how to make deals yet there haven't been any deals to fix the inadequacies of this roster. Why is that? Reinny for sure.

Its been said hundreds of times but it is true enough to be said again. Reinsdork doesn't give a shit about winning a championship. He's perfectly happy to rake in the money and take it with him when he dies.

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An Ode to the Texas man who shot an Antifa terrorist:

Oh, he might have went on livin'
But he made one fatal slip
When he tried to match the Ranger
With the big iron on his hip

I think that as bad as being a White Sox fan is in terms of frustration, being an A's fan must be worse. I think that Beane is a very smart innovative guy but really is bad for baseball in that other owners look at the A's and think that they can compete without spending money. It still takes money to win championships an/or compete for them.

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An Ode to the Texas man who shot an Antifa terrorist:

Oh, he might have went on livin'
But he made one fatal slip
When he tried to match the Ranger
With the big iron on his hip

no he should have made that play it wasn't some super bad hop , c'mon

yes there are bad hops or odd bounces that i wouldn't knock someone for missing, but that isn't one of them

Alex Gonzalez?

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Be well

GO BEARS!!!

So when Beanes teams fail so miserably every postseason shouldn't we look at it similarly instead of saying that statistically they should have won one by now?

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Its funny JOrr seems to be all for winning the most games with the lowest payroll, but he is the same guy who was also started at least four or five threads in the douchebag section because the White Sox will sell tickets cheaper than when he buys them in the offseason. He should be praising those fans who buy a Bleachers and Brews or whatever forgetting the most bang for their buck.

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I would argue the sample isn't big enough even though it may seem like it is.

I mean, if you're arguing that in the next ten years Beane will have 6-7 playoff teams like he usually does and Kenny will have 1-2 like he usually does, but Kenny's 1-2 playoff teams are more likely to win a World Series than Beane's 6-7, I'm gonna disagree.

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Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

Hey Simple Frank, I don't have a problem with a fan cutting his best deal. But tell the Sox to stop constantly contacting me to commit to tickets when they always offer a better deal later.

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Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

He's got two total playoff series wins, and one is the wild card round that didn't exist in 2005.
The 2005 White Sox have three series wins.

It has to be more than luck for the A's.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Are you saying that there's some flaw in his teams that have won 90+ games that causes them to be ineffective in short postseason series? I guess that's possible, but I find it unlikely.

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Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

So are you suggesting that his teams are quite effective in the regular season, and ineffective in the postseason? If he can't build a team that's effective in the postseason, how can you argue he's better at his job than any GM that has won multiple postseason series, or a World Series in the last 20 or 30 years?

It's not my job to tell the White Sox to stop calling people who give them money in January year after year after year, crazy JOrr.

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What is the other answer? It's not like they are making the World Series and failing. They have two postseason series wins since the 90s and one of them is the new wild card round. That's 25 years of Billy Beane since he took over as GM of the A's and that is 2 playoff series wins. I can't imagine many franchises have less than that.

He's either the unluckiest person in sports history or there has to be some reason why that happens.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

It's weird. Go back and look at his rosters over the years. It's full of established high end players. It's just that they weren't established with Oakland. It's like Oakland is the place to get your feet wet, and then they're gone.

I'm going to guess that they don't get to the big show because of turnover. Too much of it.

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Wattabout Kodak Black?

Whoever they hire, I hope the Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion committee is involved, like the Bears process.

Last I hard Soup is available for employment...so it is possible

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