Again, we just disagree. I don't think the citizen choked the criminal to death. He subdued the criminal and the criminal happened to die. There were other citizens on the train assisting the citizen as the criminal was dealt with.

If you don't want the citizens to protect themselves you must protect the citizens. Most people can't afford private security.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Kash, and Don

Could the Marine sue NYC? Neely was on a Top 50 list of homeless people in need of urgent assistance. He was suppose to be in a drug treatment center but left and had a warrant out. He wasn't held accountable for his assaults, refused treatments, and then again not held accountable for that. Are we suppose to let the mentally ill, some violent, just do whatever they want in society?

You want to pay for it?

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https://nypost.com/2023/05/10/suspect-w ... ate-crime/


Threatening to kill people? It's not a big deal, go back to Iowa if you can't handle it. Pooping on a flag? Hate crime.


Sounds like he's Fred Guilty.


The wall just got 10 feet gayer.

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Man if only Fred Innocent could’ve met Lundin Hathcock. But he’s dead.

I think the guy that got killed wished he was charged with a crime instead

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The marine guy took it too far. He should not have killed him but let him go after he was subdued.

But with city officials not letting the police do their jobs, what did society expect? People are going to take shit into their own hands now. Im sure another incident like this will happen.

Also, fucking media loving this to divide us w/ race. Say the marine was a black guy doing the choke hold on the black passenger, would this even be news today?

Anyway, crazy people are what their name applies CRAZY! One of these guys could snap at any moment and start stabbing someone multiple times to death. It's like an untamed animal. I never feel safe around them. Take all the precautions too. If I'm walking down the street and see one on the way, i cross the street to the other side.

This would be ideal but people don’t want to pay for it to happen

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More than likely we do anyway. The real difficulty would be about more about rights and who would decide what.

He was. They let him go more than a few times, jail and a treatment facility, and suppose to be in jail again. Maybe if he committed the grave crime of shitting on a trans flag he'd be alive. I don't really believe there is a right answer here but if we continue down this path you can expect more of people having to defend themselves which I think is the wrong answer.

We do? How come they’re all over our trains then?

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Several are in jail, in treatment facilities, and receive aid from public and private programs. We are almost always paying for them in some sort of way financially whether it's efficient or sufficient is another discussion. They are on the trains in NY because places like NYC release them or don't/can't do what is probably necessary for the good of society. Again the real difficulty would be about more about rights and who would decide what. What do you do with someone like Neely? I'm not sure but I know it's not let him run around in public assaulting people.

Is it getting hot in here?

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Well we can’t be throwing enough money at the problem if they’re allowed to be on the trains acting like they do

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Idk, maybe we are. More money is not always the answer. We are allowing them on trains, specifically in this case or in NYC. It's obvious he shouldn't have been on one, not only socially and morally but legally.

He was out in public so clearly not enough money has been spent to keep him off the train

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Why do you think lack of funding is the case? After he assaulted a 67 yo woman he had a spot in a residential treatment facility for 15 months. He left it after 2 weeks. Neely was on some sort of task force subway list. It all went ignored or unknown to each party and they kept releasing him, this is a policy or inaction problem. He was given resources. Resources aren't going to save everyone all of the time. At the very least maybe he could trade places with the guy who shit on the flag?

We offered him resources and he didn’t use them. He needed treatment not jail I think that’s clear enough. But we don’t have the balls/resources to lock him up in a mental health facility against his will

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This is correct but I would say they had the resources at least in this case. So what do you do with the criminally insane who is violent and threatens people in public that has refused help? And what do we expect people to do when confronted with this type of person?

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Hawaii (fuck) You

Kill them on a train or in some kind of electric chair or something

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What’s the end game for those supportive of forcible institutionalization?

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2018
#ExtendLafleur
10 More Wins

Sounds like they could have detained Neely in the days/weeks prior either under mental health considerations or....for an outstanding warrant:


https://www.nytimes.com/2023/05/13/nyregion/jordan-neely-top-50-mental-illness.html















https://www.nytimes.com/2023/05/13/nyre ... lness.html

posted the whole thing cuz it's paywalled.

So your position is crazy people should be allowed to threaten, assault, or kill others on a train and people have no right to defend themselves? They just have to accept injury or death on a train at the hands of a mentally ill person?

Yup. That’s what my guy said too.

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while Neely may have been violent in other situations, from what's reported happened on the train when Neely was murdered by the Marine, Neely was only "shouting"...which as everyone who has ridden on public transit has noted we've all dealt with crazy people on trains yelling without needing to resort to violence--fatal or otherwise.

Or take them to the floor while other citizens contact a defunded and slow to respond police department. But when one in 100,000 happens to die in such an incident, don't demonize the citizen(s).

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Kash, and Don

The insane shouting is often a precursor to the violent act.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Kash, and Don

"often"? it's way more often a nothing burger of momentary discomfort. if someone's making you uncomfortable on the subway, it's like 5 minutes between stops....jump out at the next stop and catch the next train. I don't know what marine dude thought he was going to accomplish by engaging a shouting guy physically who by all reports had not initiated any physical contact with anyone.