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Zippy-The-Pinhead
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2024 5:39 pm 
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Brick wrote:
Jaw Breaker wrote:
Haugh argued that at this point, "doing right by Justin" means just releasing him and letting him sign somewhere. Waiting/hoping for some kind of haul is going to hurt him, and both he and Williams cannot co-exist in the same locker room.

Let's not act like Fields was a war hero. The Bears should salvage some of what they invested in him.

He has been professional and loyal to the Bears. Treating him badly won't go unnoticed by the rest of the league.

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Brick
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Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Brick wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Brick wrote:
Keep him and wait for a week 1 or 2 injury then.

They've already promised to be fair to Fields. Making him sit on the bench through Preseason and an unknown number of games is a bad look. It also doesn't guarantee a better pick, and a 3rd the next year is worse than a 3rd this one.

I think they'd take a 3rd pick with the chance to have it upgrade to a 2nd.

If you are right and no team wants Fields then why wouldn't it be fair to Fields to wait and send him to a place he would start for a team trying to make the playoffs.

If he is replacing a quality guy injured early in the season then it's also likely that guy will come back and Fields will go to the bench. It also means Fields isn't the day 1 starter with the benefit of preseason which would help him learn the system and ultimately make a case for a big contract extension on a team that presumably wants him and feels like he is a fit rather than an emergency replacement.

But again the point is that no one wants him now. That's your argument. Sending him to a place for a 6th round pick to be a backup isn't great for him or the Bears.

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Zippy-The-Pinhead
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2024 5:41 pm 
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Brick wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Brick wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Brick wrote:
Keep him and wait for a week 1 or 2 injury then.

They've already promised to be fair to Fields. Making him sit on the bench through Preseason and an unknown number of games is a bad look. It also doesn't guarantee a better pick, and a 3rd the next year is worse than a 3rd this one.

I think they'd take a 3rd pick with the chance to have it upgrade to a 2nd.

If you are right and no team wants Fields then why wouldn't it be fair to Fields to wait and send him to a place he would start for a team trying to make the playoffs.

If he is replacing a quality guy injured early in the season then it's also likely that guy will come back and Fields will go to the bench. It also means Fields isn't the day 1 starter with the benefit of preseason which would help him learn the system and ultimately make a case for a big contract extension on a team that presumably wants him and feels like he is a fit rather than an emergency replacement.

But again the point is that no one wants him now. That's your argument. Sending him to a place for a 6th round pick to be a backup isn't great for him or the Bears.

That's not what I said at all. I said he could bring a 3rd rd pick - which is still valuable.

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Brick
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2024 5:41 pm 
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Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Brick wrote:
Jaw Breaker wrote:
Haugh argued that at this point, "doing right by Justin" means just releasing him and letting him sign somewhere. Waiting/hoping for some kind of haul is going to hurt him, and both he and Williams cannot co-exist in the same locker room.

Let's not act like Fields was a war hero. The Bears should salvage some of what they invested in him.

He has been professional and loyal to the Bears. Treating him badly won't go unnoticed by the rest of the league.

Then he can be professional for another few games with the Bears.

Again, if no one wants him now then just keep him.

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Brick
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2024 5:46 pm 
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Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Brick wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Brick wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Brick wrote:
Keep him and wait for a week 1 or 2 injury then.

They've already promised to be fair to Fields. Making him sit on the bench through Preseason and an unknown number of games is a bad look. It also doesn't guarantee a better pick, and a 3rd the next year is worse than a 3rd this one.

I think they'd take a 3rd pick with the chance to have it upgrade to a 2nd.

If you are right and no team wants Fields then why wouldn't it be fair to Fields to wait and send him to a place he would start for a team trying to make the playoffs.

If he is replacing a quality guy injured early in the season then it's also likely that guy will come back and Fields will go to the bench. It also means Fields isn't the day 1 starter with the benefit of preseason which would help him learn the system and ultimately make a case for a big contract extension on a team that presumably wants him and feels like he is a fit rather than an emergency replacement.

But again the point is that no one wants him now. That's your argument. Sending him to a place for a 6th round pick to be a backup isn't great for him or the Bears.

That's not what I said at all. I said he could bring a 3rd rd pick - which is still valuable.

You just had a post saying the Bucs are the only team that would have interest.

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This Ends in Antioch
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2024 5:50 pm 
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Fields is simultaneously suggested to be both extremely professional and also unable to coexist in a locker room with his replacement.

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veganfan21
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2024 5:51 pm 
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Brick wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Brick wrote:
Jaw Breaker wrote:
Haugh argued that at this point, "doing right by Justin" means just releasing him and letting him sign somewhere. Waiting/hoping for some kind of haul is going to hurt him, and both he and Williams cannot co-exist in the same locker room.

Let's not act like Fields was a war hero. The Bears should salvage some of what they invested in him.

He has been professional and loyal to the Bears. Treating him badly won't go unnoticed by the rest of the league.

Then he can be professional for another few games with the Bears.

Again, if no one wants him now then just keep him.


It'd be mismanagement if you keep him and Williams after all the drama. Part of being an executive is reading the room - having both around can lead to a toxic work environment. Having a clean start with Williams is worth more than keeping Fields around until someone coughs up a fourth for him during week 3.

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veganfan21
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2024 5:52 pm 
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This Ends in Antioch wrote:
Fields is simultaneously suggested to be both extremely professional and also unable to coexist in a locker room with his replacement.


It's not necessarily him. It's DJ Moore and all the others who insulted Caleb, Drake, etc while backing their guy.

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Zippy-The-Pinhead
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2024 5:55 pm 
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Brick wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Brick wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Brick wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
They've already promised to be fair to Fields. Making him sit on the bench through Preseason and an unknown number of games is a bad look. It also doesn't guarantee a better pick, and a 3rd the next year is worse than a 3rd this one.

I think they'd take a 3rd pick with the chance to have it upgrade to a 2nd.

If you are right and no team wants Fields then why wouldn't it be fair to Fields to wait and send him to a place he would start for a team trying to make the playoffs.

If he is replacing a quality guy injured early in the season then it's also likely that guy will come back and Fields will go to the bench. It also means Fields isn't the day 1 starter with the benefit of preseason which would help him learn the system and ultimately make a case for a big contract extension on a team that presumably wants him and feels like he is a fit rather than an emergency replacement.

But again the point is that no one wants him now. That's your argument. Sending him to a place for a 6th round pick to be a backup isn't great for him or the Bears.

That's not what I said at all. I said he could bring a 3rd rd pick - which is still valuable.

You just had a post saying the Bucs are the only team that would have interest.

I simply am saying I don't think there will be a bidding war. I think they'll get a 3rd for him and that's fine.

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good dolphin
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2024 5:56 pm 
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Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
good dolphin wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
NFL combine's biggest loser: Chicago Bears' trade market for Justin Fields

Bo Nix placed his passes with precision. Michael Penix Jr. threw with power. J.J. McCarthy was mobile, accurate and strong.
Yes, it was just a Saturday afternoon at the NFL scouting combine, college stars throwing against air. Yet with each impressive performance you could practically see the draft position of each quarterback solidified — first-rounders — just as the corresponding trade market for Chicago’s Justin Fields softened. Chicago could still get something for Fields, just perhaps not what it was hoping for a few weeks ago. The combine turned a draft that was top heavy with QBs — Williams, Maye and Daniels — into one that is also deep with QBs — McCarthy, Penix and Nix.

Previously, a team such as Atlanta, with the eighth overall draft pick, may have felt the need to grab Fields in the hope that the Falcons can maximize his talents in a way the Bears haven’t. Now, at least if the Falcons hold the consensus opinion of scouts following the combine, they may believe they have viable options through the draft, namely McCarthy. In other words, rather than give up trade assets to get Fields, who would require a $25 million payout in 2025 and an even heftier extension beyond that, the Falcons could take McCarthy without giving up picks and have him on a cheaper rookie contract. If that's the route Atlanta takes, that’s one prime suitor off the market for Chicago.

Penix must still make it through medical exams and concerns from an injury-plagued college career at Washington and Indiana, but his performance at the combine mimicked his huge season in leading the Huskies to the national championship game. To many, he had the best throwing performance of the group. He looks pro ready.
If his knee checks out, he’s a likely first-round pick — offering another cheaper option than trying to deal for Fields.

It’s the same with Nix. His arm may lack the pop of the elite draft prospects but his accuracy Saturday showed that his FBS-record 77.45 percent completion percentage last season wasn't merely the product of the Oregon offensive system. His footwork was also vastly improved and no one is questioning his football acumen or leadership.
If he can keep it up throughout the draft process, it is not out of the question that six quarterbacks are taken in the first round — or twice as many as some big boards predicted just a few weeks ago.

Is Fields worth a second-round pick? A third? Some combination of third day selections? The better this crop of incoming quarterbacks looks, the smaller the market for Fields and thus the less he is likely to fetch. Individual pro days and private workouts are the next data points that could determine things. The Bears are still in a nice spot headed into this draft, perhaps not as nice as they once hoped.


source: the green and gold report


source: Dan Wetzel·Columnist
https://us.yahoo.com/sports/nfl-combines-biggest-loser-chicago-bears-trade-market-for-justin-fields-190007296.html


brilliant analysis

if and if and if equals definite

thanks for your concern

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Brick
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2024 5:57 pm 
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Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
I simply am saying I don't think there will be a bidding war. I think they'll get a 3rd for him and that's fine.

Yeah and if they can't get a 3rd then keep him.

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Zippy-The-Pinhead
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2024 5:58 pm 
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good dolphin wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
good dolphin wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
NFL combine's biggest loser: Chicago Bears' trade market for Justin Fields

Bo Nix placed his passes with precision. Michael Penix Jr. threw with power. J.J. McCarthy was mobile, accurate and strong.
Yes, it was just a Saturday afternoon at the NFL scouting combine, college stars throwing against air. Yet with each impressive performance you could practically see the draft position of each quarterback solidified — first-rounders — just as the corresponding trade market for Chicago’s Justin Fields softened. Chicago could still get something for Fields, just perhaps not what it was hoping for a few weeks ago. The combine turned a draft that was top heavy with QBs — Williams, Maye and Daniels — into one that is also deep with QBs — McCarthy, Penix and Nix.

Previously, a team such as Atlanta, with the eighth overall draft pick, may have felt the need to grab Fields in the hope that the Falcons can maximize his talents in a way the Bears haven’t. Now, at least if the Falcons hold the consensus opinion of scouts following the combine, they may believe they have viable options through the draft, namely McCarthy. In other words, rather than give up trade assets to get Fields, who would require a $25 million payout in 2025 and an even heftier extension beyond that, the Falcons could take McCarthy without giving up picks and have him on a cheaper rookie contract. If that's the route Atlanta takes, that’s one prime suitor off the market for Chicago.

Penix must still make it through medical exams and concerns from an injury-plagued college career at Washington and Indiana, but his performance at the combine mimicked his huge season in leading the Huskies to the national championship game. To many, he had the best throwing performance of the group. He looks pro ready.
If his knee checks out, he’s a likely first-round pick — offering another cheaper option than trying to deal for Fields.

It’s the same with Nix. His arm may lack the pop of the elite draft prospects but his accuracy Saturday showed that his FBS-record 77.45 percent completion percentage last season wasn't merely the product of the Oregon offensive system. His footwork was also vastly improved and no one is questioning his football acumen or leadership.
If he can keep it up throughout the draft process, it is not out of the question that six quarterbacks are taken in the first round — or twice as many as some big boards predicted just a few weeks ago.

Is Fields worth a second-round pick? A third? Some combination of third day selections? The better this crop of incoming quarterbacks looks, the smaller the market for Fields and thus the less he is likely to fetch. Individual pro days and private workouts are the next data points that could determine things. The Bears are still in a nice spot headed into this draft, perhaps not as nice as they once hoped.


source: the green and gold report


source: Dan Wetzel·Columnist
https://us.yahoo.com/sports/nfl-combines-biggest-loser-chicago-bears-trade-market-for-justin-fields-190007296.html


brilliant analysis

if and if and if equals definite

thanks for your concern
First time reading a sports article?

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Nas
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2024 6:00 pm 
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Terrible thought. The same people who lied about Caleb are reporting stuff put out there by teams who are looking to get a great deal on Fields. The market will be clear soon. Zero reason to panic.

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Zippy-The-Pinhead
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2024 6:02 pm 
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Nas wrote:
Terrible thought. The same people who lied about Caleb are reporting stuff put out there by teams who are looking to get a great deal on Fields. The market will be clear soon. Zero reason to panic.

Image

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Darkside
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2024 8:12 pm 
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The Hawk wrote:
Nas wrote:
BD wrote:
NME wrote:
Clawmaster wrote:
If you think Maye gets past Cards why not trade back with Washington or New England and pick up extra picks?

You would get Maye, Nabers or Odunze, maybe pick up a second this year where you pick your center, or a different WR from what is supposedly a deep WR class?




If the Bears are going QB with that 1st pick.. I think it’s getting riskier to move back (even AZ might consider a QB up this high and maybe trade Call of Duty). Atm I think you take your guy and don’t look back. After all, if you finally nail that pick your franchise’s future is set for the next decade.


At most, if the Bears like both Maye and Williams, right now they trade back the one spot and take the one that falls to them. But atm I don’t think the smart move is to go back even a couple of slots if QB is indeed their top priority.


The Bears aren't going to be indifferent between Maye and Williams. If they move on from Fields, they are going to get the one they want, not settle for who is left. It's even more important to take the one that is supposedly a difference maker. Maybe both become a difference maker, but the Bears have to hit on this else Poles will probably get fired a year from now.


I think the chance of Poles losing his job, after one more year, is near zero.


If he trades fields and signs Williams he will be gone this year.

No offense intended but that's just ridiculous. I don't understand how anyone can know football and think that Fields is a top 25 NFL quarterback.

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veganfan21
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2024 8:31 pm 
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League GMs, player personnel officials, scouts, etc. are saying no thanks to Fields. The cult however thinks Fields is better than Mahomes. Great to see reality set in for the cult - I'm sure they had fun while the mirage lasted.

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good dolphin
PostPosted: Wed Mar 06, 2024 8:10 am 
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Nas wrote:
Terrible thought. The same people who lied about Caleb are reporting stuff put out there by teams who are looking to get a great deal on Fields. The market will be clear soon. Zero reason to panic.


Yep. Sit back and let the market come to you.

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BD
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Brick wrote:
Jaw Breaker wrote:
Haugh argued that at this point, "doing right by Justin" means just releasing him and letting him sign somewhere. Waiting/hoping for some kind of haul is going to hurt him, and both he and Williams cannot co-exist in the same locker room.

Let's not act like Fields was a war hero. The Bears should salvage some of what they invested in him.


This has taken some major turns.

Just a few weeks ago, there was some national speculation (from Kiper) that the Bears could get the #8 pick for Fields. Even after some pushback on that, #20 was seen as not crazy.

Then it sort of morphed back to the original though of a 2nd and 4th.

Then it became the free agent market must shake out first and now Cousins is likely to go to Atlanta where several media people were having informed conversations about the likelihood of that happening because Fields is from the area.

Now it's the demand for Fields is not there, he may not get a landing spot from one of the obvious choices....

Does anyone know what's going on? Probably not.

(although Laurence Holmes did tell us last week that he was being told a Fields trade to Atlanta was imminent, meaning during the draft combine, based on people in the know)....
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Caller Bob
PostPosted: Wed Mar 06, 2024 11:40 am 
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The Bills are still 40+ million over the cap (worst cap situation in football). Not the best poker face, Ryan...
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BD
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Caller Bob wrote:
The Bills are still 40+ million over the cap (worst cap situation in football). Not the best poker face, Ryan...




I don't mind them trading for Bates, but I do question why they had to give up anything with their cap issues. Maybe other teams were interested?
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veganfan21
PostPosted: Wed Mar 06, 2024 11:45 am 
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Could have signed a similar guy for money without giving up a pick.

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Nas
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veganfan21 wrote:
Could have signed a similar guy for money without giving up a pick.


It's a 5th round pick. Who cares? He didn't have to risk the guy being traded to another team for a 6th or signing somewhere else as a free agent. Bates was a guy that he targeted.

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Tall Midget
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Caller Bob wrote:
The Bills are still 40+ million over the cap (worst cap situation in football). Not the best poker face, Ryan...




Additionally, the Bears very likely could have signed him a couple years ago if they had front-loaded the contract. That would have been fine for the Bears' cap situation, but it would have created a mess for the Bills.

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Nas
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Tall Midget wrote:
Caller Bob wrote:
The Bills are still 40+ million over the cap (worst cap situation in football). Not the best poker face, Ryan...




Additionally, the Bears very likely could have signed him a couple years ago if they had front-loaded the contract. That would have been fine for the Bears' cap situation, but it would have created a mess for the Bills.


Yeah, this was the real problem. They didn't structure the contract in a way that the Bills couldn't match.

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This Ends in Antioch
PostPosted: Wed Mar 06, 2024 12:11 pm 
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Nas wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Could have signed a similar guy for money without giving up a pick.


It's a 5th round pick. Who cares? He didn't have to risk the guy being traded to another team for a 6th or signing somewhere else as a free agent. Bates was a guy that he targeted.

Those are depth picks. Jones came from the 5th round.

There’s a little bit of a pattern forming that suggests Poles will prioritize FA signings & trades over the draft.

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Last edited by This Ends in Antioch on Wed Mar 06, 2024 12:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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veganfan21
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Nas wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Could have signed a similar guy for money without giving up a pick.


It's a 5th round pick. Who cares? He didn't have to risk the guy being traded to another team for a 6th or signing somewhere else as a free agent. Bates was a guy that he targeted.


Puka Nacua was a 5th rounder. Bates is not some diamond in the rough OL. He's a generic swing dude you can find in FA or develop. Poles is compounding the mistake he made when he failed to structure Bates offer the right way. He needs to calm down and stop turning into Ryan Pace/Josh Lucas with the trading picks thing.

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good dolphin
PostPosted: Wed Mar 06, 2024 12:11 pm 
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I read somewhere the plan is that he is going to play center. That sounds like a similar plan to last year and the year before.

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good dolphin
PostPosted: Wed Mar 06, 2024 12:13 pm 
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BD wrote:
Brick wrote:
Jaw Breaker wrote:
Haugh argued that at this point, "doing right by Justin" means just releasing him and letting him sign somewhere. Waiting/hoping for some kind of haul is going to hurt him, and both he and Williams cannot co-exist in the same locker room.

Let's not act like Fields was a war hero. The Bears should salvage some of what they invested in him.


This has taken some major turns.

Just a few weeks ago, there was some national speculation (from Kiper) that the Bears could get the #8 pick for Fields. Even after some pushback on that, #20 was seen as not crazy.

Then it sort of morphed back to the original though of a 2nd and 4th.

Then it became the free agent market must shake out first and now Cousins is likely to go to Atlanta where several media people were having informed conversations about the likelihood of that happening because Fields is from the area.

Now it's the demand for Fields is not there, he may not get a landing spot from one of the obvious choices....

Does anyone know what's going on? Probably not.

(although Laurence Holmes did tell us last week that he was being told a Fields trade to Atlanta was imminent, meaning during the draft combine, based on people in the know)....


It's the lying season. Reporters are useful idiots for the teams and not to be believed.

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Nas
PostPosted: Wed Mar 06, 2024 12:13 pm 
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good dolphin wrote:
I read somewhere the plan is that he is going to play center. That sounds like a similar plan to last year and the year before.


I thought he was a hedge in case they struck out in free agency and the draft.

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Nas
PostPosted: Wed Mar 06, 2024 12:16 pm 
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This Ends in Antioch wrote:
Nas wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Could have signed a similar guy for money without giving up a pick.


It's a 5th round pick. Who cares? He didn't have to risk the guy being traded to another team for a 6th or signing somewhere else as a free agent. Bates was a guy that he targeted.

Those are depth picks. Jones came from the 5th round.

There’s a little bit of a pattern forming that suggests Poles will prioritize FA signings & trades over the draft.


He turns middle round picks into a shitload of late round picks every year. I doubt that will change, even before our Fields return.

How? He fielded a team with damn near nothing but his draft picks.

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