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PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2024 4:02 pm 
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Brick wrote:
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Didn’t they trade Fields because he wasn’t great then too according to that logic, if he was great, they wouldn’t have drafted Caleb.


Regardless of whether Fields is on the roster or not, Caleb Williams cannot merely be a "good player". #1 Picks aren't drafted simply to be "good". Particularly in a draft considered to be loaded with talent..

"Good" would be a pretty significant upgrade from Fields in Chicago.

I get you want to set the bar as high as possible but going into a game thinking our qb is probably throwing for over 250 yards would be nice.

Wait, if it's true that "#1 picks aren't drafted simply to be 'good'" then why is it such a crying shame that Justin Fields, himself a #1 pick who was an unmitigated disaster in his rookie season and only marginally better in the years that followed, was jettisoned?


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2024 4:37 pm 
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Brick wrote:
The Doctor Of Style wrote:
Hawg Ass wrote:
Didn’t they trade Fields because he wasn’t great then too according to that logic, if he was great, they wouldn’t have drafted Caleb.


Regardless of whether Fields is on the roster or not, Caleb Williams cannot merely be a "good player". #1 Picks aren't drafted simply to be "good". Particularly in a draft considered to be loaded with talent..

"Good" would be a pretty significant upgrade from Fields in Chicago.

I get you want to set the bar as high as possible but going into a game thinking our qb is probably throwing for over 250 yards would be nice.


With the No.1 overall pick the objective isn't to draft the best player overall or a "superstar" player. The objective is simply to "upgraðe" over the person that previously held the position. Who knew? Shakes?

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2024 4:59 pm 
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I don't think it's realistic to expect greatness from any pick. Of course it is the hope but outperforming Fields by a significant margin would justify moving on from him to Williams.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2024 5:27 pm 
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Brick wrote:
I don't think it's realistic to expect greatness from any pick.
You don't but Sports GMs do. That's why Bear fans are still lambasting Pace for taking (Pro Bowl QB) Trubisky over Mahomes in 2017.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2024 5:45 pm 
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The Doctor Of Style wrote:
Brick wrote:
I don't think it's realistic to expect greatness from any pick.
You don't but Sports GMs do. That's why Bear fans are still lambasting Pace for taking (Pro Bowl QB) (Pro Bowl QB) Trubisky over Mahomes in 2017.

(Pro Bowl QB) Trubisky didn't even get an extension. That's why the pick is lambasted.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2024 6:10 pm 
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Brick wrote:
The Doctor Of Style wrote:
Brick wrote:
I don't think it's realistic to expect greatness from any pick.
You don't but Sports GMs do. That's why Bear fans are still lambasting Pace for taking (Pro Bowl QB) (Pro Bowl QB) (Pro Bowl QB) Trubisky over Mahomes in 2017.

(Pro Bowl QB) (Pro Bowl QB) Trubisky didn't even get an extension. That's why the pick is lambasted.

The pick is lambasted much more for passing on Mahomes when you had a chance to draft him.
And again the Bears didn't draft Caleb Williams to be good. They drafted him to be great. If he isn't then it was a wasted pick

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2024 6:34 pm 
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The Doctor Of Style wrote:
And again the Bears didn't draft Caleb Williams to be good. They drafted him to be great. If he isn't then it was a wasted pick

This is just outright silly.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2024 6:39 pm 
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The Doctor Of Style wrote:
Brick wrote:
The Doctor Of Style wrote:
Brick wrote:
I don't think it's realistic to expect greatness from any pick.
You don't but Sports GMs do. That's why Bear fans are still lambasting Pace for taking (Pro Bowl QB) (Pro Bowl QB) (Pro Bowl QB) (Pro Bowl QB) Trubisky over Mahomes in 2017.

(Pro Bowl QB) (Pro Bowl QB) (Pro Bowl QB) Trubisky didn't even get an extension. That's why the pick is lambasted.

The pick is lambasted much more for passing on Mahomes when you had a chance to draft him.
And again the Bears didn't draft Caleb Williams to be good. They drafted him to be great. If he isn't then it was a wasted pick

If (Pro Bowl QB) Trubisky was still here making pro bowls no one would care.

I'll point out once again (Pro Bowl QB) Trubisky as a Bear was better than Fields so you aren't really making a good pro-Fields argument either.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2024 6:48 pm 
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No one selects a player first overall that they don't expect to be great. It's not a wasted pick if that guy is good. Most picks don't reach that level. Yes, I would prefer Caleb to be better than Patrick Mahomes than to be Dak Prescott. I won't cut him if he ends up being Dak Cousins.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2024 7:00 pm 
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The Doctor Of Style wrote:

Bricksonian Logic is never logical. If both are "good" it's still a loss for the Bears. And if Caleb is merely "good" but not "great" it's still a loss for the Bears. You don't draft #1 overall picks to be simply "good". You draft them to be GREAT. The Bears didn't trade Justin Fields because they believed Caleb to be "good". They traded Justin Fields because they believed Caleb Williams would be great. They didn't want to pass on a "Generational Talent". If CW isn't that, or close to that, then it's still a loss for Da Bears


If Caleb is better than Fields, how is that a loss? What the fuck are you talking about?

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2024 7:03 pm 
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TriColoredPastas wrote:
The Doctor Of Style wrote:

Bricksonian Logic is never logical. If both are "good" it's still a loss for the Bears. And if Caleb is merely "good" but not "great" it's still a loss for the Bears. You don't draft #1 overall picks to be simply "good". You draft them to be GREAT. The Bears didn't trade Justin Fields because they believed Caleb to be "good". They traded Justin Fields because they believed Caleb Williams would be great. They didn't want to pass on a "Generational Talent". If CW isn't that, or close to that, then it's still a loss for Da Bears


If Caleb is better than Fields, how is that a loss? What the fuck are you talking about?


Who knows actually.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2024 7:06 pm 
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The Doctor Of Style wrote:
TriColoredPastas wrote:
The Doctor Of Style wrote:

Bricksonian Logic is never logical. If both are "good" it's still a loss for the Bears. And if Caleb is merely "good" but not "great" it's still a loss for the Bears. You don't draft #1 overall picks to be simply "good". You draft them to be GREAT. The Bears didn't trade Justin Fields because they believed Caleb to be "good". They traded Justin Fields because they believed Caleb Williams would be great. They didn't want to pass on a "Generational Talent". If CW isn't that, or close to that, then it's still a loss for Da Bears


If Caleb is better than Fields, how is that a loss? What the fuck are you talking about?


Who knows actually.

What about shakes?

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2024 7:06 pm 
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The Doctor Of Style wrote:
TriColoredPastas wrote:
The Doctor Of Style wrote:

Bricksonian Logic is never logical. If both are "good" it's still a loss for the Bears. And if Caleb is merely "good" but not "great" it's still a loss for the Bears. You don't draft #1 overall picks to be simply "good". You draft them to be GREAT. The Bears didn't trade Justin Fields because they believed Caleb to be "good". They traded Justin Fields because they believed Caleb Williams would be great. They didn't want to pass on a "Generational Talent". If CW isn't that, or close to that, then it's still a loss for Da Bears


If Caleb is better than Fields, how is that a loss? What the fuck are you talking about?


Who knows actually.

No one. Is your premise that if Caleb equates Fields' production, which was shit, that the bears should have traded the 2024 first overall pick?

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2024 7:06 pm 
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Nas wrote:
No one selects a player first overall that they don't expect to be great. It's not a wasted pick if that guy is good. Most picks don't reach that level. Yes, I would prefer Caleb to be better than Patrick Mahomes than to be Dak Prescott. I won't cut him if he ends up being Dak Cousins.


Nah. If he is merely good then it is a wasted pick because they will have missed on guys taken later who will turn out to be great. That's why it is important not to miss on guys when you have the No. 1 pick. You can find "good" qbs without having to waste a No. 1 overall pick on one.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2024 7:08 pm 
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Brick wrote:
The Doctor Of Style wrote:
TriColoredPastas wrote:
The Doctor Of Style wrote:

Bricksonian Logic is never logical. If both are "good" it's still a loss for the Bears. And if Caleb is merely "good" but not "great" it's still a loss for the Bears. You don't draft #1 overall picks to be simply "good". You draft them to be GREAT. The Bears didn't trade Justin Fields because they believed Caleb to be "good". They traded Justin Fields because they believed Caleb Williams would be great. They didn't want to pass on a "Generational Talent". If CW isn't that, or close to that, then it's still a loss for Da Bears


If Caleb is better than Fields, how is that a loss? What the fuck are you talking about?


Who knows actually.

What about shakes?


Last I heard he still advocates for the annihilation of Palestinians.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2024 7:12 pm 
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Fuck it I'm with Nas now, I hope Caleb assrapes this entire league and we all get to shit on your face.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2024 7:19 pm 
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The Doctor Of Style wrote:
Nas wrote:
No one selects a player first overall that they don't expect to be great. It's not a wasted pick if that guy is good. Most picks don't reach that level. Yes, I would prefer Caleb to be better than Patrick Mahomes than to be Dak Prescott. I won't cut him if he ends up being Dak Cousins.


Nah. If he is merely good then it is a wasted pick because they will have missed on guys taken later who will turn out to be great. That's why it is important not to miss on guys when you have the No. 1 pick. You can find "good" qbs without having to waste a No. 1 overall pick on one.


If he's Dak Cousins and Rome is great, why would it be a wasted pick? If he's JaMarcus Russell and Daniels, Maye, and McCarthy are great, that's a different story.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2024 7:52 pm 
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I want to know who is on this "good, but not great" list of QBs available to the Bears whom they should have brought in that would make selecting Williams a waste if he is just to be "good" in the NFL. And for a franchise that has been so inept at acquiring QB talent over decades, you definitely take guys who have "good in the NFL" as their floor.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2024 9:39 pm 
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Nas wrote:
No one selects a player first overall that they don't expect to be great. It's not a wasted pick if that guy is good. Most picks don't reach that level. Yes, I would prefer Caleb to be better than Patrick Mahomes than to be Dak Prescott. I won't cut him if he ends up being Dak Cousins.

Didn’t you expect Fields to be great drafting at11?

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2024 9:41 pm 
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Pasta is crushing LTG and dude won’t even respond.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2024 9:42 pm 
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Hawg Ass wrote:
Pasta is crushing LTG and dude won’t even respond.

jimmymeatball is back???

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2024 10:03 pm 
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Hawg Ass wrote:
Pasta is "Just Asking Questions" and LTG won’t even respond.

FTFY

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2024 10:16 pm 
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Hawg Ass wrote:
Nas wrote:
No one selects a player first overall that they don't expect to be great. It's not a wasted pick if that guy is good. Most picks don't reach that level. Yes, I would prefer Caleb to be better than Patrick Mahomes than to be Dak Prescott. I won't cut him if he ends up being Dak Cousins.

Didn’t you expect Fields to be great drafting at11?


I didn't know Fields wad balck until after he was drafted. I knew nothing about him.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2024 10:21 pm 
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Nas wrote:
Hawg Ass wrote:
Nas wrote:
No one selects a player first overall that they don't expect to be great. It's not a wasted pick if that guy is good. Most picks don't reach that level. Yes, I would prefer Caleb to be better than Patrick Mahomes than to be Dak Prescott. I won't cut him if he ends up being Dak Cousins.

Didn’t you expect Fields to be great drafting at11?


I didn't know Fields wad balck until after he was drafted. I knew nothing about him.


I don't know if you're joking. Because I didn't know he was black either. Until we drafted him. I don't watch or follow college football. I heard of his name around draft day. Didn't know if he was black or white.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2024 10:35 pm 
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Beardown wrote:
Nas wrote:
Hawg Ass wrote:
Nas wrote:
No one selects a player first overall that they don't expect to be great. It's not a wasted pick if that guy is good. Most picks don't reach that level. Yes, I would prefer Caleb to be better than Patrick Mahomes than to be Dak Prescott. I won't cut him if he ends up being Dak Cousins.

Didn’t you expect Fields to be great drafting at11?


I didn't know Fields wad balck until after he was drafted. I knew nothing about him.


I don't know if you're joking. Because I didn't know he was black either. Until we drafted him. I don't watch or follow college football. I heard of his name around draft day. Didn't know if he was black or white.


I'm dead serious. I heard the name and assumed he was white. I knew Lance was balck because someone posted his picture here.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 07, 2024 8:30 am 
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Brick wrote:
I don't think it's realistic to expect greatness from any pick. Of course it is the hope but outperforming Fields by a significant margin would justify moving on from him to Williams.

Caleb is on the very short list of best QB prospects in the history of the sport. He's going to a situation that's better than any situation for a number 1 pick in recent memory, maybe ever. If Odunze lives up to the caliber of prospect he is, Caleb has arguably the best WR group in the NFL. Stroud and Herbert are very recent examples of QBs who were great as rookies, Caleb is a better prospect than both with a better supporting cast than either had.

It's realistic and fair to expect Caleb to be great.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 07, 2024 8:38 am 
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FavreFan wrote:
Brick wrote:
I don't think it's realistic to expect greatness from any pick. Of course it is the hope but outperforming Fields by a significant margin would justify moving on from him to Williams.

Caleb is on the very short list of best QB prospects in the history of the sport. He's going to a situation that's better than any situation for a number 1 pick in recent memory, maybe ever. If Odunze lives up to the caliber of prospect he is, Caleb has arguably the best WR group in the NFL. Stroud and Herbert are very recent examples of QBs who were great as rookies, Caleb is a better prospect than both with a better supporting cast than either had.

It's realistic and fair to expect Caleb to be great.

You’re right about all of that…but don’t forget Eberflus.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 07, 2024 9:05 am 
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Line is hurt so caleb may not play this week?

https://dawindycity.com/posts/injuries-likely-to-force-bears-to-change-caleb-williams-plan-01j4h2atv7sc


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 07, 2024 9:07 am 
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FavreFan wrote:
Brick wrote:
I don't think it's realistic to expect greatness from any pick. Of course it is the hope but outperforming Fields by a significant margin would justify moving on from him to Williams.

Caleb is on the very short list of best QB prospects in the history of the sport. He's going to a situation that's better than any situation for a number 1 pick in recent memory, maybe ever. If Odunze lives up to the caliber of prospect he is, Caleb has arguably the best WR group in the NFL. Stroud and Herbert are very recent examples of QBs who were great as rookies, Caleb is a better prospect than both with a better supporting cast than either had.

It's realistic and fair to expect Caleb to be great.

You are cherry picking players here. Herbert and Stroud weren't even the first qbs taken in their draft. We can look at them in hindsight and say they were great.

It's pretty random how a QB performs in year 1 and how it projects to being an elite QB. Lots of HOF QBs either didn't play or didn't play well in their rookie year. Other QBs were great as rookies and fell off.

In the context of "Should the Bears have moved on from Fields" then Williams even being a good quarterback would make it the right choice.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 07, 2024 9:08 am 
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He's playing.

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