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PostPosted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 4:18 pm 
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many people dislike the pumpkins or think billy is an ass just b/c they've read it somewhere. i never understood why this band is so misunderstood. people react to them like they are a personality instead of a band.

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 9:03 pm 
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doug - evergreen park wrote:
many people dislike the pumpkins or think billy is an ass just b/c they've read it somewhere. i never understood why this band is so misunderstood. people react to them like they are a personality instead of a band.


After seeing that youtube video, I would have to disagree with that statement. Is there something that preceeded the video that we don't know about?

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 9:04 pm 
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yeah... 2.5 hours of them rocking.

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 9:43 pm 
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I'm not into music like some of you guys so maybe I don't understand. 20 years ago he was a sad pretentious misunderstood ass clown. Now he is a sad pretentious arrogant rich still misunderstood ass clown.

It's more of a type than anything. He is a broody musician/artist that thinks he is smarter than everyone else & deeper than everyone else. No time for joy or fun when you could be showing the world what a smug little shit you can be. At this point he feels his success validates him. Keep it and screw him.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 10:18 pm 
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+1 :thumleft:
I think you hit the nail on the head Spaulding.

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 10:20 pm 
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she hates all self-loathing mid-90's music. haven't you heard her rant on nirvana?


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 10:54 pm 
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Nirvana was just the final nail in the coffin. The writing had been on the wall for a while regarding the death of 80s hair bands.

And I don't care if that video was preceeded by 72 hours of them rocking. The stage is not the place for that kind of rant. Nor it is the place to tell me who I should vote for, why burritos can or can't marry, or why my girlfriend should go to hell for getting an abortion. If its a benefit or politcal fundraiser, have at it. If its just a run of the mill concert, play your songs, say thanks and goodnite, and do your ranting elsewhere.

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 11:46 pm 
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doug - evergreen park wrote:
many people dislike the pumpkins or think billy is an ass just b/c they've read it somewhere. i never understood why this band is so misunderstood. people react to them like they are a personality instead of a band.

First, I'll preface my comments by saying that I am a fan of the Pumpkins, have been for a long time. In my mind, they make great music, especially when Chamberlain is providing the thunder on the drums. I disliked the era when he was kicked out of the band - basically for getting caught doing what everybody else in the band was also doing. But, then again, that's just another example of how Corgan has to be in control. I've seen them live quite a few times, in large and small venues, but have never seen anything like what I just saw on the youtube clip. That being said:

1. DEP - people aren't allowed to like/dislike the personality of a band or the members there within? That makes no sense to me. In fact, there are many bands whose music I like that I know I couldn't stand having a conversation with - knowing they are raging assholes offstage. I think Corgan definitely fits that type. Spaulding definitely nailed a couple of thoughts - there is no doubt Billy thinks he is superior/deeper/better than the rest of us "common folk". Not that he is the only celebrity that thinks that way....but let's not deny him his due. Similarly, I'm sure somebody like, oh, Jack Johnson is a fine guy in real life. That doesn't change the fact that his music makes me ill.

2. It was not so much of a "rant", but more of a "now that you've paid big bucks to see me, and I'm done doing what you want, I'm going to make you sit there and listen to my lecture". A rant to me = yelling and screaming. This was a calm begging for attention and a real need to be stroked by people he fully expected to do the stroking.

3. His background that you provided doesn't sound ideal, but honestly just sounds as messed up as many as the rest of us had. That doesn't change my original statement that he is not from a "struggling", neglected, or low-income upbringing. He is a child of dysfunctional privilege. Welcome to suburbia, kid..... get over it. You're a man! You're 40!

4. Whether it's the Flaming Lips, New Duncan Imperials, or even the mighty Smashing Pumpkins - please, never refer to a group of men standing on the stage playing kazoos as "rocking". :wink:

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 11:47 pm 
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Frank Coztansa wrote:
Nirvana was just the final nail in the coffin. The writing had been on the wall for a while regarding the death of 80s hair bands.

And I don't care if that video was preceeded by 72 hours of them rocking. The stage is not the place for that kind of rant. Nor it is the place to tell me who I should vote for, why burritos can or can't marry, or why my girlfriend should go to hell for getting an abortion. If its a benefit or politcal fundraiser, have at it. If its just a run of the mill concert, play your songs, say thanks and goodnite, and do your ranting elsewhere.



Isn't Frank one of the bigger Pearl Jam fans on this board? Physician, heal thyself.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 12:02 am 
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Just because my opinion is biased doesn't make it untrue.

I like some of the Pumpkins music, I find it catchy. He would hate that. He is and always has been an egotistical jerk. I don't get musicians and maybe that is part of the reason I'm not into music.


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 12:24 am 
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shirtless driver wrote:
Isn't Frank one of the bigger Pearl Jam fans on this board? Physician, heal thyself.


Your point? Doesn't matter if its Corgan, Bruce Springsteen, or Eddie Vedder. The stage is not the place for politics. Hats off to them for trying to get people involved, but just because I've sat thur many a political rant, doesn't mean I like it or agree with it.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 12:59 am 
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[quote="spanky"]

1. never said that. fyi: i have a few friends that have worked closely with BC "offstage" and he is far from an asshole.
I'm not going to get into band-drug politics. It's a sore subject.
2. bullshit. he had the same smirk on his face that i had on mine. he knows what he is doing. this wasn't a show at the allstate arena. it was a show for 1410 people.
3. sure...i suspect it is impossible to measure the amount of fuckedupness that we may or may not have had growing up. shall we debate how "bad" our childhoods were?
4. never did. they rocked prior to the kazoos.

spaulding, please tell me when in 1988 you found Billy to be a sad pretentious misunderstood ass clown. I'd like to know, since you were what...11 at the time? or even when you where in high school. was it then you discovered his assclowniness?

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 1:40 am 
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My brother-in-law used to hang with James & Billy when they were working at a used record store by Lawrence & Austin. They were both cool but they were both angry young men - I guess success didn't change them! They eventually hooked up with Pravda Records & the guys in The Service (later NDI) to record one single before they made it big. The brother-in-law still has a test pressing but refuses to eBay it - even though he's broke! WTF? SOB

20 EXPLOSIVE DYNAMIC SUPER SMASH HIT EXPLOSIONS!
The original Earth-shaking K-Tel tribute compilation! 20 bands pick their favorite 70s smash, and the results range from breath-taking to side-splitting. Artists include Smashing Pumpkins, Young Fresh Fellows, Material Issue, Mojo Nixon, The Sneetches, and many more!
http://www.pravdamusic.com/compilations.php?compID=1

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 8:58 am 
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Spaulding wrote:
I don't get musicians and maybe that is part of the reason I'm not into music.


you sound like my sister. she actually had to work with bands back when she was running stuff on the dew tour. she had some horror stories, including one jared leto fantasy RUINED because the guy was such a pretentious jerk who was also painfully aloof.

i separate the person from the music, the way i do with athletes and the game and actors/writers/directors from the movies they make. sure sometimes the personality CAN get in the way of everything, but artists are very disturbed people. the best way they convey what they're feeling is through their art.


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 10:56 am 
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Wednesdays show was ok. First half rocked. Second half was weird and not impressive.

He talked Cubs Sox for about 10 mins at one point it was kinda funny. He actually sounded normal.


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 11:20 am 
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doug - evergreen park wrote:
spanky wrote:

1. never said that. fyi: i have a few friends that have worked closely with BC "offstage" and he is far from an asshole.
I'm not going to get into band-drug politics. It's a sore subject.
2. bullshit. he had the same smirk on his face that i had on mine. he knows what he is doing. this wasn't a show at the allstate arena. it was a show for 1410 people.
3. sure...i suspect it is impossible to measure the amount of fuckedupness that we may or may not have had growing up. shall we debate how "bad" our childhoods were?
4. never did. they rocked prior to the kazoos.

spaulding, please tell me when in 1988 you found Billy to be a sad pretentious misunderstood ass clown. I'd like to know, since you were what...11 at the time? or even when you where in high school. was it then you discovered his assclowniness?

3 - no, I wasn't trying to have a contest to see has the worst upbringing, I'm just saying that we all have our issues growing up, most of us just choose to overcome them or move on at some point. And I wouldn't to jump to conclusions, but it's probably a little better to have some adolescent issues in the posh north suburbs than many other locales. I'm just sayin'....

4 - so, we agree that kazoos can not possibly "rock"? Whew - I was worried if we failed to connect on that one. :wink:

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 5:21 pm 
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Look Doug, I don't know Billy boy personally all I can go on is what I hear in interviews and when he does stuff like this. In some I've heard he has been logical and makes sense.

In others he is a smug little crap which is how he came off here. He made is little speech for who knows what reason? Attention, so he can be disliked, so he can be himself, to show how much smarter he is, because he had a power or control freak episode? In any of those cases why bother to make his little self aggrandizing speech? It doesn't make him a horrible person but it does make him somebody I'd roll my eyes at. He is not nearly as cute as he believes he is and he makes himself look like a tool.

Yeah, I formed my opinion that he was a tool in high school, I would like their music more if he weren't. What of it?

WZ I find it hard to seperate people like that. Some of the reasons I don't like a lot of artists is I find them too intense and taking themselves too seriously.


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 11:46 pm 
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Spaulding wrote:
Look Doug, I don't know Billy boy personally all I can go on is what I hear in interviews and when he does stuff like this. In some I've heard he has been logical and makes sense.

In others he is a smug little crap which is how he came off here. He made is little speech for who knows what reason? Attention, so he can be disliked, so he can be himself, to show how much smarter he is, because he had a power or control freak episode? In any of those cases why bother to make his little self aggrandizing speech? It doesn't make him a horrible person but it does make him somebody I'd roll my eyes at. He is not nearly as cute as he believes he is and he makes himself look like a tool.

Yeah, I formed my opinion that he was a tool in high school, I would like their music more if he weren't. What of it?

WZ I find it hard to seperate people like that. Some of the reasons I don't like a lot of artists is I find them too intense and taking themselves too seriously.


Stick to Josh Groban or Jonas Brothers.
They don't challenge anything except your hearing.
BTW, I hear Nickelback has a new tape out.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 11:48 pm 
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I don't know who they are and I don't like Nickleback.


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 11:55 pm 
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Tape?

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 22, 2008 12:02 am 
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Spaulding wrote:
I don't know who they are and I don't like Nickleback.

What a revelation.

And yes, Frank, TAPE.

It's amusing because the same sort of folks who don't know shit about music
are also the same sort of folks who still think there is a Musicland at the mall
and want to get the new Nickleback (sic) tape.
You know, it must be good, it's on the radio 40 times a day.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 25, 2008 2:40 pm 
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This is one of the funniest threads ever. Oddly enough, I agree with a lot of the stuff ALL of you are saying.

1. I think Doug and I are the only people in the world who actually like the Adore disc, although it should have never been released credited as "Smashing Pumpkins".
2. Obviously Billy did not have an overly priviliged childhood. Congrats to him for working past it and becoming successful.... on the other hand, so did many of us and many others have had it way worse.
3. I'm sure there's a lot more to it, but I don't think Spaulding is very far off from her impression of BC. I have met him once and thought he was very unapproachable. That being said, my Mom has met him in a retail setting numerous times and while quiet and shy, has found him to be very friendly and polite.
4. The man has opinions and obviously wants to share them. I agree with Frank in that I hate it when musicians and athletes feel the need to become preachers and/or political activists.

All that bieng said, Gish is still a top 5 favorite CD of mine and it completely changed the way I look at music. Outside of a few other bits and pieces here and there, I haven't cared for a lot of Pumpkins releases since. I saw them live twice back in the day and I've seen enough, but I'm sure Doug is right in that they kicked ass for 2 hours prior to the Kazoo bit... nothing wrong with that.

And yes, Jimmy Chamberlain is the most amazing Rock drummer to surface since Neal Peart... he is absolutely amazing.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 25, 2008 11:16 pm 
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wdelaney72 wrote:

And yes, Jimmy Chamberlain is the most amazing Rock drummer to surface since Neal Peart... he is absolutely amazing.


whooaa...and where's mike portnoy?!


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 26, 2008 10:24 am 
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is mike a "rock" drummer? DT is more progressive...I suppose Rush is as well. Anyway, Mike is certainly up there.

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 26, 2008 5:46 pm 
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I take nothing away from Mike Portney... he's an amazing talent. Jimmy has the combination of amazing talent and totally unique sound and style.

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 26, 2008 6:14 pm 
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i bought tickets for the pumpkins aragon show...and i'm seeing the rescheduled show the next night...

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 02, 2008 11:11 pm 
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 08, 2008 3:16 pm 
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Image

that's how you close a show!

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 08, 2008 3:19 pm 
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The Great Pumpkin Homecoming - Night 4 (12/08)
By Michael Roffman on December 8th, 2008



If they fell on night one, dusted themselves off for night two, and started running again on night three, the Smashing Pumpkins soared three weeks later on night four of what has become The Great Pumpkin Homecoming. Maybe it was the intimate backdrop of the Aragon Ballroom, but the Pumpkins certainly felt like the Pumpkins again. The packed though not sold out crowd flooded the floor and terraces, clapping and cheering endlessly for their hometown heroes throughout the two and a half hour set.

It all began with a tongue in cheek performance of Milwaukee’s own The Frogs. No one can attest to the cult following these three boys carry; however, their sound was lost on most of the crowd. With lead singer Jimmy Flemion looking more like Vulture out of the Spider-man comics and instrumentalist/percussionist Dennis Flemion going for an aging, lost Andy Warhol image, it was hard to take the band seriously, though why should anyone? When the band’s responsible for EPs such as Here Comes Santa’s Pussy and Now You Know You’re Black, should anyone really hold them accountable for anything? That was rhetorical, by the way. Still, despite some members of the crowd passing time by reading The Onion or declaring the Milwaukee duo, “The Led Zeppelin of stupid rock”, they still turned over an amicable set.



No time was wasted and within ten minutes Corgan and co. were on stage. The gloomy carnival music resonated in the dark ballroom, where there was little to be seen, save for the teasing jack o’ lantern on stage. Fans roared and stomped, ready for some Pumpkins action, and that’s exactly what happened seconds after when the band ripped right into Mellon Collie’s classic single, “Tonight, Tonight”. Immediately, any hardcore Pumpkins fan knew that something was different, considering the band hasn’t typically been opening with this tune. This assumption was confirmed when Corgan continued without a moment to reflect, diving head on into hit after hit: “Tarantula” into “Stand Inside Your Love” into “Mayonaise” and immediately into “Today”.

Fans were brilliantly confused. After having been forewarned by every media outlet that this was a band who forgot about their hits, who neglected their audience, and who did their own thing, hearing a greatest hits medley was like a surprising left hook punch. Throughout every song, even during last year’s “Tarantula”, the Chicago audience reached high for the ceiling’s painted night sky, singing word for word, to which Corgan gave appreciation for following “Today.” Then came what most might have been dreading and few were salivating for: “Gossamer.”



The sustained jam adventure, which at one time lasted nearly forty minutes, was pretty tight and short this time around. However, Corgan still remained jovial, visibly enjoying the many riff riots at the end as he laughed about with rhythm guitarist Jeff Schroeder. Before anyone knew it, the distortion crawled away and Corgan was behind the acoustic, where he churned up residency favorite “99 Floors” and up and coming “Owata”, both of which had the audience in a daze. That hardly lasted, however, as the striped frontman slung on the ol’ electric and slunk into a hair raising performance of “Soma”, which inevitably brought up a new string of hits: “Cherub Rock”, “Zero”, and “Bodies.”

Finally, after almost two hours, drummer Jimmy Chamberlin broke his shell and came to life. That’s not to say he wasn’t “on” beforehand, he most certainly was, though it he felt more subdued, so to speak. “United States”, the only other cut off Zeitgeist for the night, brought him into the foreground, where he kicked up a storm. Then came some more acoustic additions: the new crowd favorite “A Song for a Son”, Mellon Collie b-side “Medellia of the Gray Skies” and the newly penned “Communion”. As if to please those “angry bearded bloggers” as he stated, Corgan threw out an extra angsty rendition of “Bullet With Butterfly Wings”, basically a prologue for “Superchrist” and the spacey-still unnecessary cover of Pink Floyd’s “Set the Controls to the Heart of the Sun.”

What was most endearing about the entire concert was the inclusion of Corgan’s half brother, Jesse Corgan. His half-brother, who has battled with mild cerebral palsy and Tourette’s syndrome, came on during “Set The Controls”, playing the tambourine and the tribal drums. It was a heart warming moment seeing the two Corgans having fun with the half a dozen instruments available to them, and this continued in what was quite possibly the best encore of the band’s recent career. A stormy “Ava Adore” subsided into a dead on cut of “1979″, all finishing with a tear jerking performance of “Disarm”, which Corgan played next to Jesse. When the band finished, everyone remained standing, applauding ’til their cold hands dried up and their coarse throats were itching for water. If anyone was still a “hater”, they might need to find a new band to admonish. The Pumpkins delivered ten fold and yet still remained true to their convictions… how quaint, huh?

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 08, 2008 3:26 pm 
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I doesn't sound like they did this performance for themselves. What a bunch of sellouts.


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