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 Post subject: NFL Stuff
PostPosted: Mon Jul 10, 2006 1:54 pm 
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2006 NFL Regular Season Wins
Over/Under

Arizona Cardinals 8
Atlanta Falcons 8
Baltimore Ravens 7.5
Buffalo Bills 6.5
Carolina Panthers 10
Chicago Bears 9
Cincinnati Bengals 9
Cleveland 6.5
Dallas 9.5
Denver 10
Detroit 6.5
Green Bay 6
Houston 5.5
Indianapolis 11.5
Jacksonville 9.5
Kansas City 9.5
Miami 9
Minnesota 8
New England 10.5
New Orleans 7
NY Giants 9
NY Jets 6
Oakland 6
Philadelphia 8.5
San Diego 9
San Francisco 5
seattle 10.5
St. Louis 7
Tampa Bay 8.5
Tennessee 5.5
Washington 9

Opinions invited.


Last edited by Coast2Coast on Sun Jul 16, 2006 9:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 10, 2006 2:17 pm 
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Take the under on Buffalo, Dallas, Indianapolis and Minnesota.

Take the over on KC.

Las Vegas is not following in line with falling in love with Philly.

Put every dime you have on the American League in the All Star Game. The talent level in these two leagues is as dissimilar as in any time I can remember.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 10, 2006 3:00 pm 
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Early looks here are Indy under, San Diego under, Cincinnati under, Minnesota under. May have a few overs before the season kicks.


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 Post subject: overs
PostPosted: Mon Jul 10, 2006 5:48 pm 
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I like the overs for the Saints and Cardinals. A low number, but I would say the under for the Texans.


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 Post subject: under
PostPosted: Mon Jul 10, 2006 5:49 pm 
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I also like the under with the Chargers.

My picks for the next 2 nights. I like Jermain Dye in the Derby and the National League in an upset tommorow night.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 10, 2006 6:27 pm 
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Wow, I love the under on Indy.


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 Post subject: Re: under
PostPosted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 8:10 am 
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reents wrote:
IMy picks for the next 2 nights. I like Jermain Dye in the Derby and the National League in an upset tommorow night.


Looks like we have a new person to fade this year.

Keep the picks coming.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 12:41 pm 
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I like the over on Tampa, Detroit and Carolina.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 1:29 pm 
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i'D STAY AWA FROM DETROIT.


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 Post subject: wagers
PostPosted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 1:55 pm 
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This is the reason I stick to football.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 2:17 pm 
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Woodridge Ryan wrote:
Wow, I love the under on Indy.


I think they are in trouble at RB. I never liked Addai at LSU (and apparently neither did the coaches as he only started due to injury) and the veterans are all backups. 12 wins is heavy wood even for a great team.

Minnesota is the one that jumped off the page to me. 8 wins? Tell me where they are coming from.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 2:59 pm 
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Quote:
i'D STAY AWA FROM DETROIT.


Why?


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 4:23 pm 
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 4:47 pm 
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Even with the Steelers off the board, there are only 7 wins left for them.

How does 7 for the over/under for the Steelers?

Unders I like:Cleveland, J-ville, Oakland, and St. Louis.

Overs I like:My Bills(yes I'm a sucker for betting with my heart), Tenn., Carolina, and Houston

Pushes I like: Bears, Giants, S.D., and Wash.

Yep, another year of celebrating Christmas Easter weekend(just as long as my NCAA B'ball tourney does me right again...)

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 Post subject: Colts
PostPosted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 6:19 pm 
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On the Colts, with the way they lost last year, they could go bad after a great season turned bad. Some times teams that lose after a great season, have a miserable season next year. I think this will be the last year we can say the Colts will win the Super Bowl no matter what happens.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 16, 2006 9:17 pm 
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I see we have a few different opinions on Detroit. I think I'd lean OVER with TM on the Lions. Part of the reason is that I believe Minny and the Pack will be BAD. And I don't think da Bears will match their almost dream season of last year. But the main reason is I expect this to be a somewhat different Lions team. New head coach Marinelli is a tough guy brought in to instill discipline in his team. Despite his troubles in St. Louis, offensive coordinator Mike Martz can design a potent offense. Defensive coordinator Donnie Henderson was nothing short of outstanding during his tenure with the Jets. So, even though Marinelli has no previous head coaching experience, he hired a savvy, veteran staff around him. I consider that a very positive move. The new staff has made their message very clear from the beginning - buy into the new program or find a new job. Eight starters, including quarterbacks Joey Harrington and Jeff Garcia, left town in the offseason. Last year's No. 1 draft choice, receiver Mike Williams, found himself dropped to third stringer on the depth chart. Marinelli and GM Matt Millen brought in one character guy after the next, inking more than a dozen free agents who should compete for playing time. For a team desperately searching for some type of a spark, the Lions’ turbulent offseason has the potential to pay immediate dividends.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 16, 2006 9:30 pm 
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New England Under
No bet is official for me yet, but here's another lean. I'm not a guy that is in the habit of fading a proven winner, but in the middle of last year, some of you guys might remember I started fading New England because they had lost so many guys to injury. I think this team took an even greater hit during the offseason and this team really appears to be a shell of its former self. Winning three Super Bowls in four years is no easy task. But it's even harder to get back to the Super Bowl after the salary cap constraints necessitated by that type of success start to kick in like they did this past offseason. The Patriots have now lost three coordinators (Charlie Weis, Romeo Crennel and Eric Mangini) to head coaching positions in the last two years. They also lost an inordinate amount of veteran talent during free agency. The Patriots were also without the salary cap flexibility to make many free-agent moves of their own. No kicker in the history of the league has been as clutch in the postseason as Adam Vinatieri, but he'll be suiting up for the Colts this year. New England lost most of Tom Brady's most potent receiving weapons with David Givens, Tim Dwight, Andre Davis and Bethel Johnson all leaving the fold. The Patriots’ defense took a tremendous hit with the losses of Willie McGinest, Chad Brown, Duane Starks and Tyrone Poole. We've gotten used to seeing New England as an elite level team this decade, but this tumultuous off-season was not a positive one for the Patriots. The Patriots have had too much success in the past to be written off for an entire season. However, it would not shock me to see this team struggle, especially early in the season. And thus, winning 11 games doesn't seem likely to me.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2006 12:04 am 
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I see a few guys looking at the Vikings UNDER. The Vikings have more question marks at the skill positions than they’ve had in at least a decade. Their QB problem is huge. Brad Johnson has survived an entire 16 game season just three times since he was drafted 14 years ago. Behind him on the depth chart is Mike McMahon, who failed miserably as Donovan McNabb’s backup in Philadelphia last year. The Vikings QB situation is an accident waiting to happen.

Minnesota has all kinds of question marks on defense as well. Napoleon Harris has struggled with injuries throughout his career, and he has never played middle linebacker for any extended period in the NFL. Nevertheless, the Vikings have him penciled as their MLB starter for 2006. E.J. Henderson, newly acquired Ben Leber and 2006 first-round pick Chad Greenway are fighting for the other starting positions.

But the worst problem of all may be their coaching and front office situation. Mike Tice may have been the dunce of the NFL, but head coach may be an even weaker position for the Vikes this year. The Vikes have a first-year head coach in Brad Childress, and this is his first head-coaching gig on any level. Childress did not call the plays in Philadelphia, a rarity among NFL offensive coordinators, leaving that duty to head coach Andy Reid. He might be the least prepared head coach in years in the NFL. That is too much inexperience for any team to overcome.

Owner Zigy Wilf is a new kid on the block too, left to pick up the pieces of the failed Mike Tice era. The sudden dismissal of personnel executive Fran Foley following a subpar draft is only the latest mini-drama to engulf the Vikings, a team that seems to be embroiled in controversy more often than not.

Minnesota came on strong during the second half of the season last year, in large part due to an exceptionally easy schedule and the team's ability to rally around the dunce. The Vikes also got the benefit of numerous bounces in their direction, losing the turnover battle only once in their final 10 games. The Vikes would have to go 9-7 to lose this bet. I don't see it. This team simply has too many questions and gaping holes to expect a winning record.


Last edited by Coast2Coast on Tue Aug 01, 2006 9:57 am, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2006 12:27 am 
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I agreed with TM on Detroit, but have to part company with the tall one on his love for the Bucs over. I lean UNDER on the Bucs. It seems to me that the Bucs got every break imaginable last year. They won five games by a field goal or less while playing one of the easiest schedules. They finished 11-5 and won one of the toughest divisions in the league. But let's not forget they got bounced in the playoffs against the Skins in one of the most pathetic offensive displays. And let's not forget that the Bucs averaged less than 17 points/game last year. So why should we believe the offense will be any better this year? And can we expect the D to be as good?

This year the Buccaneers won’t have the benefit of a ridiculously easy schedule after facing only four playoff teams in 2005. Most of the Buccaneers offseason moves, including their draft, were spent upgrading the offensive line, a perennial area of weakness the last few years. Rookie offensive linemen generally take time to develop into quality players. So, expect the top two picks, Davin Joseph out of Oklahoma and Jeremy Trueblood from Boston College , to have more than their fair share of rookie woes. Nominal free-agent signings Torrin Tucker (who was absolutely horrible for the Cowboys last year) and Toniu Fonoti from Minnesota are not likely to turn this subpar offensive line into a dominant unit. The Cadillac is a nice back, but he's going to need a solid OL to again post the kind of numbers he did early last season. I don't see it with this group.

But the key question is whether Chris Simms can quarterback this team into the playoffs without a single productive receiver outside of the injury-prone Joey Galloway. Last year, Michael Clayton was unable to live up to the promise he showed as a rookie. There’s no quality depth behind those two. Simms threw only 10 touchdown passes in 11 games last year. Behind him is Luke McCown, who is not an acceptable backup. This is a passing game likely to struggle once again.

Can this D do it again? It's aging quickly. Questions began popping up in the secondary last year, as teams starting making big plays against them. It’s hard to picture the Buccaneers winning five times again this year while scoring 20 points or less. And with the Panthers, Falcons and Saints all poised for improvement, Tampa Bay has nowhere to go except down. I have a lot of respect for Gruden. If he can get this team to .500, I'll have even more respect for him. But even if he does that, the under 8.5 will still cash.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2006 12:49 am 
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Quote:
Even with the Steelers off the board, there are only 7 wins left for them. How does 7 for the over/under for the Steelers?


Well donspiracy, if you believe that, then you should love the under. The Stillers are now on the board at 10.5.


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 Post subject: Odds to Win
PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2006 12:58 am 
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Ok Bears fans. Here you go. 8.6/1 to win the NFC and 17.7/1 to win the Super Bowl. (Current odds at Pinnacle).

Dallas is the favorite to win the NFC and the 2nd favorite for the Super Bowl behind Indy. A little too much public love for the Parcells IMO. I'll have to find a place to bet with the House and take the "don't" on those.

Odds to win 2007 NFC Championship
201 Arizona Cardinals +1300
202 Atlanta Falcons +1600
203 Carolina Panthers +578
204 Chicago Bears +865
205 Dallas Cowboys +487
206 Detroit Lions +5000
207 Green Bay Packers +4188
208 Minnesota Vikings +2217
209 New Orleans Saints +3201
210 New York Giants +838
211 Philadelphia Eagles +1280
212 San Francisco 49ers +8000
213 Seattle Seahawks +513
214 St. Louis Rams +3240
215 Tampa Bay Buccaneers +1678
216 Washington Redskins +1057

Odds to win 2007 AFC Championship
101 Baltimore Ravens +1461
102 Buffalo Bills +5000
103 Cincinnati Bengals +1129
104 Cleveland Browns +5000
105 Denver Broncos +884
106 Houston Texans +7500
107 Indianapolis Colts +316
108 Jacksonville Jaguars +1515
109 Kansas City Chiefs +1383
110 Miami Dolphins +1129
111 New England Patriots +520
112 New York Jets +6000
113 Oakland Raiders +5000
115 Pittsburgh Steelers +649
116 San Diego Chargers +1255
117 Tennessee Titans +7000

Odds to win 2007 Superbowl
1 Arizona Cardinals +2690
2 Atlanta Falcons +3046
3 Baltimore Ravens +2637
4 Buffalo Bills +10000
5 Carolina Panthers +1305
6 Chicago Bears +1774
7 Cincinnati Bengals +1997
8 Cleveland Browns +7637
9 Dallas Cowboys +983
10 Denver Broncos +1667
11 Detroit Lions +8557
12 Green Bay Packers +6483
13 Houston Texans +12000
14 Indianapolis Colts +587
15 Jacksonville Jaguars +2972
16 Kansas City Chiefs +2414
17 Miami Dolphins +2129
18 Minnesota Vikings +5828
19 New England Patriots +994
20 New Orleans Saints +7046
21 New York Giants +1706
22 New York Jets +10983
23 Oakland Raiders +10000
24 Philadelphia Eagles +3056
25 Pittsburgh Steelers +1347
26 San Diego Chargers +3017
27 San Francisco 49ers +15000
28 Seattle Seahawks +1229
29 St. Louis Rams +9599
30 Tampa Bay Buccaneers +5513
31 Tennessee Titans +10545
32 Washington Redskins +2407


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 31, 2006 11:02 pm 
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So far, I've made my case for Detroit Over, Tampa Bay under, New England under and Minnesota under. Let's add Cincinnati under 9 to the list.

Questions for the class: Will the Bengals return to being the Bungles again? Will the Bungles give up their orange and black unis for prison-issued orange? Looks like half the team will be wearing the prison jump suits anyway.

Last year was a "miracle" 11-5 year for the Bungles due in part to an easy schedule and a lot of luck. The schedule this year is much tougher. We'll see if luck revisits Cincy two years in a row. Last year, Cleveland and Baltimore were way down in the AFC North and Cincy took advantage, going 5-1 in the division. That included an upset win over eventual champ Pittsburgh in a game in which the BUngles were outgained by over 100 yards. They barely beat a bad Cleveland team by a FG. They also played the weak NFC North, AFC South and had other games vs. Buffalo (lost by 10) and KC (lost by 34).

The Bungles stats last year shows they gained about the same per rushing and passing plays as their opponents. So how did they go 11-5? They were 4-1 in games decided by 7 points or less and had tremendous turnover advantage at +24. One angle to handicapping that plays out more often than not is that turnover stats tend to get turned over from one year to the next. Teams with a strongly favorable turnover stat one year will be marginally positive or negative the next year. And teams that lose the turnover battle one year often make a remarkable recovery in that stat the next year. Teams and coaches say they love to "coach turnover creation". But more often than not, great turnover seasons are aberrations, not patterns that are repeated the next year. I will lay favorable odds to anyone who thinks Cincy will be even +15 or greater in TOs this year. I expect them to be in single digits. And as we all know, TOs are one of the most direct stats that lead to victories.

Marvin Lewis is a coach who seems to have surrounded himself with bad people. Six Bungles have been involved with off season criminal behavior. Bad people tend to act badly when facing adversity. I would suggest adversity looms with this team. Two reasons: the questionable health of Carson Palmer and a much tougher schedule.

If Palmer isn't ready, Anthony Wright will be the QB. If he wasn't the worst starting QB in the NFL last year, I'd like you to tell me who was. If there's no Palmer in September, this team might go 2-6 out of the gate. Even if Palmer is ready, the schedule brings them improved teams in the division in Baltimore and Cleveland and of course the defending champs, Pitt. They play the NFC South, with Carolina and Atlanta both solid, winning teams. TB won't be an easy game either considering it's at TB. They open at KC and also play at Denver, which is a terrible situation considering those teams have the greatest home field advantages in the AFC. San Diego will be in the hunt for a playoff spot. It's really hard to see ten wins in this schedule.

How hard is this schedule? Bengals opponents have an average season wins line of 8.6. That is about as hard a schedule as you ever will see. I see a very different season in Cincinnati with 7-9 the most likely and 8-8 the top end of what I see for this team.


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 06, 2006 2:31 pm 
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Books Staying the Course following NFL Nightmare
The 2005-06 NFL season was one of the worst the sportsbook industry has seen in decades, but oddsmakers have no plans of altering their strategy for the upcoming campaign.

But before discussing why books are staying the course, it’s important to first understand why last year was such a disaster.

According to Andy Iskoe, professional handicapper and founder of TheLogicalApproach.com, pointspread favorites covered at an almost unprecedented rate of 57.72 percent last season. The average bettor has a well-known affinity for teams that are giving points, so when the favorites have such a strong season books take it on the chin.

“Yes, for sure. The public loves favorites, so if they win, it definitely affects our bottom line,” says BetCRIS.com oddsmaker Shane Catford. “Also with things like teaser bets, (the public) usually bets the favorites to get another six or seven points and with the favorites winning, it spells good times for our customers.”

“Last year’s NFL results were definitely a forgettable and depressing one for the books,” adds BetWWTS.com linesman Michael Pierce.

You’d think that would prompt oddsmakers to come up with an entirely new game plan, or at the very least alter their strategies a little. But books insist that it’ll be business as usual when this pigskin season kicks off.

“Not really,” says Pierce, when asked if he’ll have the favorites laying more points than they normally would. “I think the only team that we will shade early are the Colts, despite losing Edgerrin James. I think the new guys in place are decent replacements and now that they have a reliable big-game kicker (in Adam Vinatieri), they will be a very popular choice early this season.”

“It will really depend on our customers and how they bet,” adds Catford. “We just try to open a line where we can get (balanced) action (on the underdog and favorite).”

Although those methods resulted in subpar profits last year, the industry isn’t worried about another weak NFL season and Iskoe’s research justifies that confidence.

His data indicates that 2005-06 was only the second season through the last 10 where favorites did any better than 48.71 percent. Their 57.72 coverage rate was also about four percent better than they did in any of the previous 17 seasons.

“My numbers may differ slightly from other sources depending on lines charted… but any variance would not be great enough to overcome the fact that NFL favorites had a record season in 2005,” says Iskoe. “But (it was) merely a cyclical phenomenon. That is, it appears that every seven or eight years… NFL favorites have banner years.”

So why did 2005-06 happen to be a banner year? Well, although the NFL and its salary cap were designed with parity in mind, a fiscal balance doesn’t always level the playing field. Thirteen teams finished with 13 or more wins, 14 had 10 or more losses while only the five remaining clubs finished anywhere near the .500 mark.

“I think the league was a bit top heavy last year,” suggests Pierce. “You had dominant teams like the Colts who were a legit threat to go undefeated, and other popular teams like Denver went an impressive 13-3. Also, don’t expect any team to win its division by more than four games this year, like Seattle did by a staggering seven games.”

That brings us to the wagering side of the equation and like oddsmakers, the pro bettors have no intention of altering their handicapping methods either. Because last year’s results can be chalked up to an anomaly, they’re sticking with the same strategies that have a long-term history of success in the NFL market.

“No, we will not change anything at all,” says Covers Expert David Malinsky. “It was not really an issue of the oddsmakers coming up short. If you go through the games carefully, especially the games with the bigger favorites, not many were falling close to the line at all.

“So even if the oddsmakers had increased all of the favorites by a point or so, it would not have altered many wagering outcomes.”

The best advice bettors can take into the upcoming season is to simply drop the long-term perspective and to break things down one game at a time.

“Every game is its own unique event, and the fact that certain general patterns have emerged in any season does not alter that,” concludes Malinsky. “That does not help much in terms of finding shortcuts, but shortcuts tend to not cut it at this level.”

“I don’t think it will be easy money this year on the favorites, especially early,” warns Pierce. “I expect there to be a lot more parity this season.”


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 06, 2006 4:14 pm 
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Bears Regular Season Wins Wins Matchups (at Olympic)

1859 Baltimore Ravens +1½ reg season wins -110
1860 Chicago Bears -1½ reg season wins -120

1889 Buffalo Bills +3 reg season wins -105
1890 Chicago Bears -3 reg season wins -125

1941 Cincinnati Bengals +1 reg season wins -115
1942 Chicago Bears -1 reg season wins -115

1967 Chicago Bears -3 reg season wins -135
1968 Cleveland Browns +3 reg season wins +105

1969 Chicago Bears +½ reg season wins -120
1970 Denver Broncos -½ reg season wins-110

1971 Chicago Bears -4 reg season wins -130
1972 Houston Texans +4 reg season wins +100

1973 Chicago Bears +2 reg season wins -120
1974 Indianapolis Colts -2 reg season wins -110

1975 Chicago Bears -½ reg season wins -130
1976 Jacksonville Jaguars +½ reg season wins +100

1977 Chicago Bears -½ reg season wins -130
1978 Kansas City Chiefs +½ reg season wins +100

1979 Chicago Bears -½ reg season wins +100
1980 Miami Dolphins +½ reg season wins -130

1981 Chicago Bears +1 reg season wins -130
1982 New England Patriots -1 reg season wins +100

1983 Chicago Bears -3½ reg season wins -105
1984 New York Jets +3½ reg season wins -125

1985 Chicago Bears -3 reg season wins -130
1986 Oakland Raiders +3 reg season wins +100

1987 Chicago Bears -½ reg season wins -160
1988 San Diego Chargers +½ reg season wins +130

1989 Chicago Bears -4½ reg season wins -105
1990 Tennessee Titans +4½ reg season wins -125


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 Post subject: wagers
PostPosted: Sun Aug 06, 2006 10:44 pm 
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On the favorites covering most of the time, there was one week last NFL season that all the favorites won straight up, I think out of those 14 games(A bye week) , only 2 or 3 didn't cover.


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2006 5:53 pm 
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Coast you seem like the gambling genius here so I have a few questions.

1. Will you give in-depth reports on each game each week like you have in this thread

2. And what is a good free website for gambling, I'm gonna get in a couple confidence pools and i'm pretty good after week 4 or 5, but those first few weeks can be disastorous.

3. And finally, do you know of any really stat heavy websites, where I can find things like 3rd and long conversion rates for the O and D, what kind of offense the team runs and whats the % of teams throwing to recievers and cornerbacks and what not.

Any help would be appreciated, thanks.


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2006 8:04 pm 
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Rocks,
1. I'm not a genius at anything. Just another schmoe eeking out a profit at my hobby. I look at all the games but don't have time to do writeups on every game. I will do writeups each week on certain things that might pop up and will do writeups on my plays that I'm making.

2. Websites for gambling...there are several I check out periodically.

eog.com -- a gambling site with good articles by professional sports bettors giving some of their plays and angles each week. also has a message board forum with some astute gamblers. They also have several contests where you can win weekly prizes. I won a couple college weekly and a couple pro weekly contests totalling about $2k there last year. Go 4-1 or 5-0 in the NFL or college on a weekend and you probably will win something. Trace Fields and Russ Culver are professionals who post on this site and they are worth paying attention to. If they are playing a game, I will look at it again.

therx.com---- The Prescription.com, or rx.com for short, is the largest message board for gamblers. Like any message board, some guys know what they are talking about and some don't. Also some interesting articles, but no professional gamblers of note. The good thing about this site is it has so many people from around the country that they will let you know the important stuff going on with their local teams. I go there for the info, not the tips on picks.

covers.com -- a good site with articles and stats. good matchup stats on every game. Articles and a message board, with alot worth reading, but nothing worth following.

pregame.com -- a website with game matchups from statfox. The statfox matchups are about the best in breaking down every aspect (football stats and gambling trend related stats) in a matchup

sportsmemo.com -- a group of professional gamblers whom I respect who have various levels of quality insights. Tim Trushel and Teddy Sevransky (Teddy Covers) are probably the top professionals on this site worth reading.

These websites all give stats important to gamblers. The best stats website for pure football related stats like you mentioned (third and long conversion rates, etc.) is probably nfl.com.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2006 8:47 pm 
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1000 CLUB
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Joined: Fri May 19, 2006 11:00 am
Posts: 1730
Location: Pappyland
Coast, Thank You Veryt much, if you have a request in the future I'll try to help


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