Absolutely right. The Patriots won those Super Bowls mainly because of their defenses. Tom Brady was always good and the offensive gameplanning seemed to be efficiency based and pretty solid. But the offense took a big step forward, not surprisingly, when Corey Dillon joined the team in 2004 and Tom Brady was asked to do less. And they regressed, not surprisingly, slightly in 2005 when Dillon wasn't healthy and the defense didn't perform up to standards. Then, of course, exploded in 2007 with the additions of Moss, Welker and Stallworth. Put a talented quarterback in a good situation and they'll thrive as long as they don't try to do more then they're supposed to do.
That said, I can't see a valid comparison being drawn between the career paths of Cutler and Brady...apple...orange.

Remember in OTB there was a report that he heard a pop and left the field. He didn't return for OTB. I have to hope that maybe there was something wrong that hasn't been disclosed. Otherwise, we may have another Anthony Thomas situation on our hands.

I want the Bears to draft Legarette Blount in the 6th round next year. Keep him under lock and key 6 days a week and then unleash the monster on Sundays.

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O judgment! Thou art fled to brutish beasts,
And men have lost their reason.

I think he's just Anthony Thomas. Without looking it up, I think he averaged < 4 yards a carry last year. He's never been a visually impressive back. He won't run you over or go around you. And for all the complaints about the line, my biggest concern is that he very rarely makes anyone miss in the open field. If you can't do that, you're not a legitimate NFL running back.

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Fire Phil Emery

Well. I guess Troy Brown was a pro bowler in 2001. I guess that technically makes him a pro bowl WR but then he wasn't in 2003.
The running game was decent I guess.
Who is this great coordinator? Charlie Weis?

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Brady passed for 18 TDs, 12 INTs and 2,800 yards. Not really legendary....unless 2008 Kyle Orton is now legend too. Although it might be if Cutler sucks for the next couple of years.

It was a response in regards to this quote:

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

I know.
It certainly doesn't meet the 3500 yard, 25 TD and 1.9 TD - INT ratio standard for success.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

heh...not really. antowain smith was a marginal back. he had a good year in 2001 but their offense ranked 6th in the league and most of that was passing.

He didn't just not average 5 yards a carry. He didn't even rush for 4 yards a carry. 3.9 is pretty pedestrian. I would excuse that if it was just from constantly getting clogged at the line. But even when he gets isolated against defenders, he can't do anything about it.

He touched the ball a lot last year, but not a supernatural amount for a young running back. If he really has worn down that quickly, that's a bad sign as well.

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Fire Phil Emery

He was. Maybe there's no tread left on the tires. Or maybe he's the type of back that is pretty much entirely dependent on the quality of his line. I don't think 3.4 ypc Matt Forte is exactly the real deal either -- he's probably better than that, and some of it is certainly the line. But I think that, even at his best, he might just be a guy.

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Fire Phil Emery

Forte's stardom is a product of fantasy football and points per reception. Nas who did he run over? I must have missed that game. Even last year he wasnt a WOW guy. If he is A Train part 2...that sucks cuz itll be an even quicker decline. I cant believe after watching the 22 or whatever INTs people are still absolving Cutler, except his Dad ironically. Some of the throwa are so ridiculous. Most of them have been on Cutler. Even if the WR are at fault, then he should adjust the way he plays to the talent he has. If ANY other qb played this bad for the Bears, fans would be ready to dump him as usual. But Jay has been to the Ultra selective Pro Bowl, so its all good.

you think that robert meachem, devery henderson, marques colston, reggie wayne, dallas clark, and jeremy shockey are *similar* to what the bears have?

uber facepalm...

They're similar in the sense that they cash NFL paychecks and wear helmets.

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Read my discussion with Rick. I'd essentially be making the same argument with this statement. I may not be a smart man but I am smart enough not to get in two arguments regarding the same point with the two most solicitous arguers on this board.

I have a great idea, why don't you and Rick argue over whether San Francisco and Washington have better players than Indianapolis and New Orleans.

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O judgment! Thou art fled to brutish beasts,
And men have lost their reason.

For as much as people loved Forte last year, he's still roughly the same guy this year. He's just getting less chances. He didn't forget to play football in the offseason.

In 2008, he only had three 100 yard games. Game 1 vs. the Colts. The other two came against Detroit and St. Louis. He had 3 games where he had 15 carries or under for the game and none under 10.
In 2009, he has 1. That's against Detroit. He also has 3 games where he has under 10 carries for the game. He has another 5 games where he had 15 or under for the game.

Isn't it possible that Forte is just as good as he was last year but he just simply isn't featured any more? Wouldn't that then make it hard to make the excuse that Cutler has no running game when it's clear that Ron Turner has been calling a much more pass happy game? I don't know what Forte would have done with more carries in those games but I've seen plenty of games where a running back starts slow and then as the carries get into the 15-20 range that the production goes way up.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

The worst thing about Forte is that if somebody sticks an arm out at him, he's down. I think the next tackle he breaks this year will be his first.

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Get real. They are nothing alike. Indy and NO are better in pretty much all ways. You wouldn't have to selectively ignore points to attempt to convince yourself that you proved him wrong.

Face it, you thought my thought was "ignorant" and you had to eventually break it down to "Fred Davis is better than Greg Olsen and Ladell Betts is better than Matt Forte". Don't try and convince yourself now that your post was some great feat in football analysis.

The smartest thing you did in our discussion was to completely ignore my points on how the Bears have a superior offensive line and coaching staff.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

am i the only one that realized nas was being sarcastic?

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

Nobody said to dump him Nas. He has NOT been good. That is fact. You cant put 22 ints on everybody else. Most have been his fault. I know you dont believe most of what youre saying, but cmon. Farve fan, Nas is too deep in this character he's playing. He doesnt even know what hes arguing anymore

I thought he was trying to be Boilermaker Rick

Keep proving my point.

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O judgment! Thou art fled to brutish beasts,
And men have lost their reason.

Keep ignoring mine.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Look at me daddy. Look at me, daddy. Daddy, Daddy, Daddy, please look at me.

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O judgment! Thou art fled to brutish beasts,
And men have lost their reason.

No maybe half of alittle more than half of them belong to him.

That's not up to you to decide. That's up to Elmhurst Steve and his penny.

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Second City Saint

But every other interception of every other QB in the league is entirely their own fault, right?

Not all of Grossman's interceptions were his fault either. Doesn't mean that he didn't play suckily.

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Fire Phil Emery

You could probably chalk up all 6 red zone INT on him. I believe 5 of them were easy passes (SF at the end of the game was a little more difficult). Unacceptable shit.

He seems to have joined the Rex Grossman "Fuck It I'm Throwing The Ball" Club. At least Rex looked to go deep with his passes.

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O judgment! Thou art fled to brutish beasts,
And men have lost their reason.

Cutler needs a shrink. Maybe he can help.

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"I honestly don't see a good bet on the board here."

Rex Grossman had 35 interceptions as a Chicago bear. Jay Cutler has 25.

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Fire Phil Emery