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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 12:21 pm 
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immessedup17 wrote:
Troy Murphy and Johan Petro were mentioned going to Detroit.

Expiring contracts, I presume...


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 12:23 pm 
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Krazy Ivan wrote:
COF 1
IMU 0


continue...

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 12:24 pm 
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immessedup17 wrote:
City of Fools wrote:
immessedup17 wrote:
Luol Deng: 39 MPG, 2.4 APG

Carmelo Anthony: 34 MPG 2.9 APG

you forgot a stat.


Which proves my point more, thank you.

Carmelo Anthony touches the ball way more than Deng, in less minutes...and still has a worse shots to assists ratio...if Anthony was hitting these shots it wouldn't matter. But he isn't.

Krazy Ivan...explain how you scored it that way. Deng has a 6:1 shots to assists ratio. That is BETTER than Carmelo's...and Deng also makes a higher percentage of his shots.

Where is the negative? I can't find one.


"touches the ball?" Where's your stat for that?

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 12:31 pm 
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RFDC wrote:
City of Fools wrote:
I would take Harrington if it meant keeping Noah.


:shock: What have you done with our cof?

I like Harrington...I think he'd fit in decently if Tibs regulated him with minutes based on performance...

Noah is a better center than anyone else currently on the Bulls. I'd still pack his bags if it meant getting Melo.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 12:33 pm 
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What part of "NO DEAL" don't you understand? Carmelo Anthony's not coming to Chicago! End of story.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 12:33 pm 
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CoF 1
IMU 1


continue.....



Sorry I borrowed your bit Ivan.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 12:34 pm 
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immessedup17 wrote:
City of Fools wrote:
"touches the ball?" Where's your stat for that?


It's one of those things you don't know about because you don't watch the games like I do.

ah. So you started your line of argumentation by relying on stats and not on the "eyeball" test, and now it is about the "eyeball" test.

See, sometimes stats are meaningless. Like when comparing Deng to Carmelo.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 12:35 pm 
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Terry's Peeps wrote:
CoF 1
IMU 1


continue.....



Sorry I borrowed your bit Ivan.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 12:36 pm 
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immessedup17 wrote:
City of Fools wrote:
"touches the ball?" Where's your stat for that?


It's one of those things you don't know about because you don't watch the games like I do.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 12:43 pm 
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immessedup17 wrote:
I guess you're right on that count. Stats don't show that Deng fits into the flow of the offense, while Anthony would ruin that flow. The eyetest does.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 12:44 pm 
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:lol:

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 12:45 pm 
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Krazy Ivan wrote:
:lol:

Doc and Thibs reaction is priceless in that gif.

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Last edited by Douchebag on Thu Jan 20, 2011 12:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 12:50 pm 
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immessedup17 wrote:
I guess you're right on that count. Stats don't show that Deng fits into the flow of the offense, while Anthony would ruin that flow. The eyetest does.

ruin the flow? Have you ever seen Deng draw a double team? Ever? Did you see Deng ruin the Bulls' chances against the Bobcats last week by bringing his man with him and effectively double teaming Rose, which resulted in Rose losing the ball and the Bulls losing the game?

You do admit that if the money were equal, you'd take Anthony. So at the surface you do think Anthony is a superior player. I'll take that much. I assume you're just constructing an argument for the sake of it. You don't really believe that the Bulls would be a worse team in a straight up Deng for Anthony trade.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 12:51 pm 
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City of Fools wrote:
immessedup17 wrote:
I guess you're right on that count. Stats don't show that Deng fits into the flow of the offense, while Anthony would ruin that flow. The eyetest does.

ruin the flow? Have you ever seen Deng draw a double team? Ever? Did you see Deng ruin the Bulls' chances against the Bobcats last week by bringing his man with him and effectively double teaming Rose, which resulted in Rose losing the ball and the Bulls losing the game?

You do admit that if the money were equal, you'd take Anthony. So at the surface you do think Anthony is a superior player. I'll take that much. I assume you're just constructing an argument for the sake of it. You don't really believe that the Bulls would be a worse team in a straight up Deng for Anthony trade.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 12:52 pm 
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When does Immessedup claim to not really believe his position and he is just messing with everyone?

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 1:05 pm 
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immessedup17 wrote:
You didn't provide me that scenario. You said without Deng, Taj, and the fill-ins for salary matching purposes. I answered what you gave me. If you wanted to ask something else, then ask something else.

Anthony is better than Deng. However, to say that they aren't comparable is wrong. Anthony can drive a little better, and rebounds better. Deng doesn't take as many bad shots and shoots a higher percentage because of it...and can play 3 positions instead of just 2. He also gives you the 3-point threat...Anthony just shoots them poorly...by necessity. Anthony is NOT two times better than Deng, and that is what he is making. He is also NOT worth thinning the talent on the bench.

Rose, Boozer and Noah...besides those three, anyone else on the team is very replaceable. And I am a big Taj Gibson fan.

What's your opinion of the way the Heat have built their team? Are they better than the Bulls currently?

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 1:16 pm 
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immessedup17 wrote:
The Heat are only 1.5 games ahead of the Bulls in the standings. The Heat are also an older team, and much more susceptible to injuries. Also, as they've shown, they are a severely limited team when missing even one of their Big 3. Because the Bulls talent is more spread out, they aren't as impacted by an injury...as shown by the Bulls winning without Boozer and Noah. They've been missing one or the other for the majority of the season...and are still good for third in the standings.

so you're saying the Bulls will have a better season?

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 1:21 pm 
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immessedup17 wrote:
City of Fools wrote:
immessedup17 wrote:
The Heat are only 1.5 games ahead of the Bulls in the standings. The Heat are also an older team, and much more susceptible to injuries. Also, as they've shown, they are a severely limited team when missing even one of their Big 3. Because the Bulls talent is more spread out, they aren't as impacted by an injury...as shown by the Bulls winning without Boozer and Noah. They've been missing one or the other for the majority of the season...and are still good for third in the standings.

so you're saying the Bulls will have a better season?


I see them finishing with extremely comparable records...and I see them both as championship contenders.

who's going farther in the playoffs?

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 1:32 pm 
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immessedup17 wrote:
City of Fools wrote:
who's going farther in the playoffs?


Who's to say? Injuries...seeding...factors that all come into play. I could see either one winning the championship...I could see either one of them beating the other in a seven game series. How do you expect me to answer that?

I asked for your opinion. You have chose to sit on the fence. I believe the Heat will go farther. Why? Becuase despite the fact that they have crap (and I mean utter crap) beyond their 3 amigos, star players win in the NBA, more than any other sport. So I see the Heat going farther in the playoffs, becuase they have built around three of the best players in the NBA. The only reason they would lose is becuase Chris Bosh is not at the same level as Wade and Bron. Which is why I am for trading anyone but Rose, Boozer and Noah to get Anthony.

And be careful when you say the Heat could be more injury riddled. The Bulls have some major injury risks on their team, like the guy that's down for the count right now and Boozer. They'd better monitor Rose's minutes carefully too.

I think I've carried on long enough.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 1:59 pm 
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Douchebag wrote:
Basically there are 3 scenarios to this trade:

Deng + package FOR Melo w/no extension (Im on the fence with this. Giving up a bunch for a rent-a-player is a big gamble, especially for such a young team)

Deng + Package FOR Melo w/extension (I make this deal in a heartbeat)

Noah + Package FOR Melo w/extension (I still wouldn't make this deal, You could pickup a decent shooter to fill that hole and not have to give up as much as this)


So you wouldn't trade Noah for LeBron or Kobe. We're not talking about Shaq. We're talking about Tyson Chandler with better hands. Melo is a top 5 player.

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In the grand SCEME (not scope, Dumbass) pf things

Awesome.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 2:14 pm 
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HOVA wrote:
Douchebag wrote:
Basically there are 3 scenarios to this trade:

Deng + package FOR Melo w/no extension (Im on the fence with this. Giving up a bunch for a rent-a-player is a big gamble, especially for such a young team)

Deng + Package FOR Melo w/extension (I make this deal in a heartbeat)

Noah + Package FOR Melo w/extension (I still wouldn't make this deal, You could pickup a decent shooter to fill that hole and not have to give up as much as this)


So you wouldn't trade Noah for LeBron or Kobe. We're not talking about Shaq. We're talking about Tyson Chandler with better hands. Melo is a top 5 player.

I would trade him for Lebron instantly.

For Kobe though, it's a little different. If we're living in a bubble and only this year mattered, then sure. But Kobe might have 1-2 good seasons left in him after this year. It's not as easy of a call. I would probably do it though. Rose + Boozer + Kobe + Deng would be a real solid nucleaus for the next 2 seasons.

But Melo is not on the same level as a Kobe or Lebron anyway, so I don't think this argument is really important anyway. Lebron singlehandedly took a team to the Finals, and Kobe has won 5 rings, 2 of which were teams led by him. Melo has one trip to the Conference Finals, and a slew of first round exits.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 2:45 pm 
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He's a better scorer than both and percentage wise he is also clutcher than both. He doesn't disappear when you need him like LeBron. With 1 game to win I would rather have Melo or Wade than LeBron. Obviously talent wise LeBron is superior to both. Melo would also instantly be the Bulls best player. Not wanting to trade Noah has more to do with being a crowd favorite. The fact that Melo is a top 5 player makes that deal easy.

On another note I would look to try to trade Boozer if I could get Melo. With Melo there wouldn't be enough balls to go around for all of them. Also the last couple years of that deal would be bad. Taj would fit nicely in the starting 5.

Noah
Taj
Deng
Melo
Rose

CHAMPIONSHIP

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spanky wrote:
Elmhurst Steve wrote:
In the grand SCEME (not scope, Dumbass) pf things

Awesome.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 4:02 pm 
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This is a down year for Melo for obvious reasons. Even with those things going on 24 and 8 is pretty good. He is a career 46% shooter. As MJ and guys like Kobe have proven when you have a scoring wing that can post up you don't really need a big that can post up. Can you imagine that nightmare many teams would have trying to guard Rose and Melo? Unlike LeBron and Wade Melo doesn't dominate the ball. That would work better in the Bulls offense.

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spanky wrote:
Elmhurst Steve wrote:
In the grand SCEME (not scope, Dumbass) pf things

Awesome.


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 22, 2011 12:31 pm 
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to me Melo has 2 things that are immensely valuable: ability to create his own shot and ability to get to the line

i basically agree with douchebag's reasoning, although i'm kind of on the fence thinking about it more as far as giving up Noah. It would depend on who else you got back from Denver, maybe if they throw in a Ty Lawson or something or maybe Birdman.

If you were left with Rose, ____, Anthony, Boozer, Gibson as your starting lineup that would still be pretty formidable but they'd be thin off the bench

I do have to think if the Bulls wanted to make that trade they could...I think it's better than the Nets offer.


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 22, 2011 2:14 pm 
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immessedup17 wrote:
His ability to take his own shot is fantastic...except for the fact that it takes the ball out of Rose's hands more often...and when he is able to get his own shot...he'll still miss it.


so you feel one player can win a championship by themselves and you think that player is Rose?


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