Biggest issue I had with KDiddits post was that people who don;t drink often come across as "Oh, I'm better than you because you drink," and thats exactly how is initial post of, "as someone who doesn't drink..." came across.

I never said Charles Manson, but drinking and driving is wrong....plain and simple. The only thing wrong with knocking a few back and driving home is that when you do that, you put others in harms way. It is not a victimless crime. Joe, I guess I am glad you live down where you do. The less drunks on the road up here the better.

And the issue I have is the numerous posts that make in seem like drunk driving is something that everybody does and it's just unlucky if you get caught. I guarantee I've done far dumber things than driving drunk but I don't rationalize it like it's no big deal or it's just so damn hard not to drink becuase society and my friends are pressuring me to do something stupid.

It's more fun to be a victim

There will never be an effective vaccine. I'll never get one anyway.

Drunk driving is not .08, thats just a number that the lawmakers say is drunk driving. Fuck, I've probably woken up with a hangover thats had me nears .08 back in my early 20s

Again, I stop at a remote for 60-90 minutes, hang out with friends and radio personalities, have 2 beers, then drive home. I'm fine, but might be over .08. Think what you want, but I don't think that is a big deal. I don't think going out to dinner with my girlfriend and having a drink or 2, or the husbands and wives that go out for a couple glasses of wine is a big deal. You still come across as very condescending even if you aren't or don't mean to be.

But the morality of it does matter. You said it yourself in your post: if you get caught, you are fucked.

How do you take morality from that?

Its the exact opposite

It doesnt matter

If Guy A thinks he's ok to drive after having two or three beers, but he's not and he gets caught he's fucked

If Guy B knows he shouldnt be driving after drinking heavily and gets caught he's fucked


Fucked, regardless of morality.

Because if you get a DUI, you are in for a heap of trouble that extends beyond legal issues. You have a felony on your record, and thus your resume. If you get fired because your employer finds out about your DUI, you are extremely "fucked". Sure; this may be because law requires you to report felonies to a prospective employer. However, if you think for a second that a hiring manager doesn't hold a moral or ethical "opinion" on an applicant with a felony on his/her record, you are mistaken.

Our hotel smelled like dead hooker vagina (before you ask I had gotten a detailed description from beardown)

First offense is a misdemeanor.

I'm not positive about it, but I think they may have made the first one a felony now.

Driving Under the Influence (DUI)
Penalties for DUI in Illinois vary depending on the circumstances of the arrest
and conviction. These circumstances may include the driver’s age, the driver’s
BAC level, whether the driver was transporting a child under age 16, and whether
the driver has previous DUI convictions. Any DUI offense resulting in felony
charges is classified as Aggravated DUI.
First Conviction
Class A misdemeanor (possible imprisonment of up to 1 year; fines of up to
$2,500); minimum revocation of driving privileges for 1 year (2 years if driver is
under age 21); suspension of vehicle registration.
• If committed with a BAC of .16 or more — In addition to any penalties or
fines, mandatory minimum fine of $500 and mandatory minimum 100 hours of
community service.
• If committed while transporting a child under age 16 — In addition to any
penalties or fines, possible imprisonment of up to 6 months, mandatory minimum
fine of $1,000 and 25 days of community service in a program benefiting
children.
• If committed while transporting a child under age 16 and involved in a crash
that resulted in bodily harm to the child (Aggravated DUI); Class 4 felony (possible
imprisonment of 1-3 years, fines of up to $25,000) — In addition to any
other criminal or administrative sanctions, mandatory fine of $2,500 and 25
days of community service in a program benefiting children.

Our hotel smelled like dead hooker vagina (before you ask I had gotten a detailed description from beardown)

"Hey blow machine.....Harry here."

See, to me it comes down to what's dangerous on the road. If it's some old man who is stone cold sober but obviously lack the reflexes to safely operate a vehicle, I don't differentiate between him and a guy who has knocked a few back or smoked a fattie or whatever. You may say one is willful, but isn't the potential danger what should really matter?

Boyd,

Good find. I was sure it was a felony no matter what; not sure why I thought that. With that being said, would you agree or disagree that people who have been convicted of a DUI are looked at differently from a moral standpoint?

Our hotel smelled like dead hooker vagina (before you ask I had gotten a detailed description from beardown)

IMO a DUI has pretty much no stigma associated with it at this point


There just too common.

Drunk driving is not .08, thats just a number that the lawmakers say is drunk driving. Fuck, I've probably woken up with a hangover thats had me nears .08 back in my early 20s

Again, I stop at a remote for 60-90 minutes, hang out with friends and radio personalities, have 2 beers, then drive home. I'm fine, but might be over .08. Think what you want, but I don't think that is a big deal. I don't think going out to dinner with my girlfriend and having a drink or 2, or the husbands and wives that go out for a couple glasses of wine is a big deal. You still come across as very condescending even if you aren't or don't mean to be.

Disagree. People do get passed over for jobs because of it.

I think it should depend on the situation.

The new drunk driving BAC levels are an effort to make social drinking and driving a crime. Has anyone seen the billboards? Buzzed driving, indeed. Nothing more than the modern incarnation of the temperance movement. All that's missing is an old prude with an ax.

I do find it ironic the former President of MADD just recently got a DUI.

US is pretty leinent with the BAC, most European countries are .05 and lower. I don't think eliminating booze is a good idea nor would it work. I wish our society would change it's views and uses of alcohol though.

US is pretty leinent with the BAC, most European countries are .05 and lower. I don't think eliminating booze is a good idea nor would it work. I wish our society would change it's views and uses of alcohol though.

We've already tried eliminating booze once and it didn't work out so great. I guess that's where I see the hypocrisy. Americans love their booze and they love their cars. I think expecting them (as a whole, not one of you who might jump in and insist you have never driven dunk. In that case, good for you.) not to ever combine the two activities is unrealistic.

So let's say that my two loves were hunting and going to football games. Would it be unrealistic to not ever combine those? What about drinking and hunting?

People often find ways to rationalize drunk driving just like they rationalize other dangerous and/or immoral actions. The fact is that this wasn't even a DUI checkpoint. He was pulled over for driving erratically and had a reading that put him at a minimum at least 3 or 4 beers over the legal limit. Depending on how long he was driving, and how long it took for the test he may have been significantly higher.

So JORR, do you believe that drunk driving laws should not exist?

I just mean socially. If you hear a friend or an acquaintence got one do you really think less of them? or think of them as the DUI guy?

It's more fun to be a victim

There will never be an effective vaccine. I'll never get one anyway.