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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 8:07 am 
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So Oz, what you're saying is that even though this lump of worthless shit is costing your pedestrian offense run upon run you just can't bench him because of his salary? So instead of putting someone more qualified in to play, you're going to run this fuckstick out there hoping he'll learn how to swing a bat? Maybe you assholes should have made this tub o' goo train in the off-season and not wait until Spring Training to begin his regiment.

KW has been allowed to spend like a drunken sailor and has not seen any return on investment from these players he just had to have.

Let's face it, it's July and the Sox still remain under .500 and aren't making any ground on the Tigers. The reason they are 4.5 games back is due to the Indians fading and the Tigers not making things easy on themselves. IMO, this is most likely how the season will end:

1. Tigers
2. Minnesota
3. Indians/Sox

Maybe this year will show Uncle Jerry he needs to go in a different direction. I doubt it though because this Sox team is a hobby for him and it shows.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 8:11 am 
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I wonder if any of this Dunn stuff is Oney's fault.

I mean, if something is bothering Dunn, maybe his wife is steppin or maybe he's got an issue of some kind, but he knows he cannot go to management with it because he knows Ozzie and Oney would be laughing about him behind his back like they did with Jenks or that they'll make it public later on.

Just a meatbally thought, but we had suspected that there would be player v coach issues as backlash to that story. Is this a symptom?

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 8:15 am 
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I can't blame Ozzie for playing Dunn as much as he does. The salary issue is just the reality of baseball.

Now Ozzie's continued reliance on Juan Pierre instead of Viciedo reeks of arrogance.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 8:16 am 
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Dunn has been all kinds of awful, but the real problem now is Pierre. He does nothing positive for the team anymore. He is the guy that needs to be sent packing. Dunn could strike out 210 times, but he also may end up with 30 HRs when its all said and done. The upside for Dunn is light years ahead of the absolute best you could get out of Pierre at this point in his career.

Ozzie has benched Dunn, moved him down, all sorts of things and nothing seems to work. Yesterday he was swinging and missing just regular fastballs. That's not on Ozzie, that's on Dunn.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 8:19 am 
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You can't do anything about Dunn. You have to play him and hope he does better. You aren't going to leave $15 million on the bench. That's an economic reality. Pierre is a different story. You could cut him loose and eat his salary. Maybe some team would even take him from you if you wanted to ease his embarrassment.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 8:23 am 
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Frank Coztansa wrote:
Dunn has been all kinds of awful, but the real problem now is Pierre. He does nothing positive for the team anymore. He is the guy that needs to be sent packing. Dunn could strike out 210 times, but he also may end up with 30 HRs when its all said and done. The upside for Dunn is light years ahead of the absolute best you could get out of Pierre at this point in his career.

Ozzie has benched Dunn, moved him down, all sorts of things and nothing seems to work. Yesterday he was swinging and missing just regular fastballs. That's not on Ozzie, that's on Dunn.

You really think that Dunn is going to hit 25 or so HR's in the next 66 games?

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 8:27 am 
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Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
You can't do anything about Dunn. You have to play him and hope he does better. You aren't going to leave $15 million on the bench. That's an economic reality. Pierre is a different story. You could cut him loose and eat his salary. Maybe some team would even take him from you if you wanted to ease his embarrassment.


Pretty much dead-on, in my opinion. Dunn is the Carlos Boozer of the White Sox. You have to play him because you paid for him.

Pierre is more like Rasual Butler at this point.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 8:30 am 
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Darkside wrote:
You really think that Dunn is going to hit 25 or so HR's in the next 66 games?

I'm trying to be optimistic about him as much as I can be. I guess it wouldn't surprise me if his slump continues at this point. But it wouldn't surprise me if he ended up with 30 HRs on the year either. There's 3 months of baseball left, he hits 8 HRs each month, plus the 7 he has now, thats 31. 8 HRs in a month isn't all that much for Adam Dunn, but of course this kind of slump is a different animal alltogether.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 8:45 am 
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Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
You can't do anything about Dunn. You have to play him and hope he does better. You aren't going to leave $15 million on the bench. That's an economic reality. Pierre is a different story. You could cut him loose and eat his salary. Maybe some team would even take him from you if you wanted to ease his embarrassment.


If there was ANY professional sport that needs a LOCKOUT and a Salary Cap......Baseball is it....

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 8:55 am 
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The thing for me is whether he plays great or he plays poorly you are still paying his horrendous salary. If he is hurting the team I don't see why he should see the field until he rights himself.

Ozzie and Kenny have let their arrogance destroy this team in not playing the right players and getting the wrong players just to show his machismo.

I don't expect this team to win the WS every year, but I do expect them to be in the playoffs every year.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 8:59 am 
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Country Bumpkin wrote:
I don't expect this team to win the WS every year, but I do expect them to be in the playoffs every year.

Those are very lofty expectations. That is not going to happen every year. This year, it should, but it just can't and won't happen every year.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 9:00 am 
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Country Bumpkin wrote:
The thing for me is whether he plays great or he plays poorly you are still paying his horrendous salary. If he is hurting the team I don't see why he should see the field until he rights himself.

Ozzie and Kenny have let their arrogance destroy this team in not playing the right players and getting the wrong players just to show his machismo.

I don't expect this team to win the WS every year, but I do expect them to be in the playoffs every year.


Josh Lewin of FOX commented on Saturday that it is incredulous that for all the money this organization has spent over the last decade that they have only won the A.L. Central Division twice.
Yet, Jerry Reinsdorf must be amused by the antics of Kenny and Ozzie.......his Loyalty schtick trumps all.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 9:01 am 
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And most of that money was spent after the WS title in '05

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 9:07 am 
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It is amazing that they are this close to .500 with 4-5 guys not hitting .230

Or pathetic really.

You can see the stubborness of Ozzie trotting out Dunn and Rios every day seemingly to show Kenny up. Plus whan asked about Pierre hitting leadoff, Ozzies says what else can I do? He has a point.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 10:07 am 
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He can play Lillibridge or call up Viciedo. There are 2 options right there.

Pierre is killing this team in 3 facets of the game. Offensively, defensively and the running game (when he actually gets on base). Just because there are other guys playing poorly that's not a reason to keep playing Pierre. Those two are clear upgrades over Pierre.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 10:10 am 
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Keyser Soze wrote:
He can play Lillibridge or call up Viciedo. There are 2 options right there.

Calling up Viciedo is Kenny's move.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 10:11 am 
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Kenny claimed it was Ozzie's. He pretty much said last week that if Ozzie wants Viceido, Kenny will get him up here.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 10:12 am 
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Frank Coztansa wrote:
8 HRs in a month isn't all that much for Adam Dunn, but of course this kind of slump is a different animal alltogether.


CSFMB as a whole in unison wrote:
This kind of slump is a different animal

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 10:13 am 
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Frank Coztansa wrote:
Kenny claimed it was Ozzie's. He pretty much said last week that if Ozzie wants Viceido, Kenny will get him up here.

Its Kenny's call, regardless of his wussing out and putting it on Ozzie.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 10:16 am 
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Viceido needs to play everyday. If he isn't going to do that up here (which is stupid, he should be) then Kenny is doing the right thing by keeping him in AAA.

Who knows why Pierre is being marched out there every day, but he does not belong on this roster right now that's for sure.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 10:16 am 
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No, it's not. Kenny never has nad never will tell Ozzie who to play. If kenny puts him on the team and Ozzie sits him on the bench it does Viciedo no good. Ozzie has to want to play him and he said he would rather play Pierre everyday.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 10:19 am 
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Keyser Soze wrote:
No, it's not. Kenny never has nad never will tell Ozzie who to play. If kenny puts him on the team and Ozzie sits him on the bench it does Viciedo no good. Ozzie has to want to play him and he said he would rather play Pierre everyday.

Then sounds like its time to replace the manager.

Either way, Kenny's call.

If there is a player in the minors who can help your team the GM cant just hold up his hands and say "Hey, Ozzie wont play him!"


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 10:20 am 
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I agree.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 10:28 am 
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Country Bumpkin wrote:
http://www.suntimes.com/sports/baseball/whitesox/6193211-417/with-adam-dunn-struggling-white-sox-must-have-others-deliver.html

So Oz, what you're saying is that even though this lump of worthless shit is costing your pedestrian offense run upon run you just can't bench him because of his salary? So instead of putting someone more qualified in to play, you're going to run this fuckstick out there hoping he'll learn how to swing a bat? Maybe you assholes should have made this tub o' goo train in the off-season and not wait until Spring Training to begin his regiment.

KW has been allowed to spend like a drunken sailor and has not seen any return on investment from these players he just had to have.

Let's face it, it's July and the Sox still remain under .500 and aren't making any ground on the Tigers. The reason they are 4.5 games back is due to the Indians fading and the Tigers not making things easy on themselves. IMO, this is most likely how the season will end:

1. Tigers
2. Minnesota
3. Indians/Sox

Maybe this year will show Uncle Jerry he needs to go in a different direction. I doubt it though because this Sox team is a hobby for him and it shows.


This season is a recurrance of the White Flag trade year. Sure they are still in it but being under .500 while still being in contention in a bad division isn't exactly a story to inspire the fans.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 10:36 am 
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Keyser Soze wrote:
No, it's not. Kenny never has nad never will tell Ozzie who to play. If kenny puts him on the team and Ozzie sits him on the bench it does Viciedo no good. Ozzie has to want to play him and he said he would rather play Pierre everyday.

If you bench Pierre who bats leadoff in this mess?

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 10:41 am 
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Anyone. There are a lot of teams not using a 'traditional' leadoff hitter and Pierre's not playing like a traditional leadoff hitter anyway because he's not getting on base often enough and not stealing when he actually does get on base. He's completely useless and it shouldn't be difficult to fill the considerable leadoff shoes of Juan Pierre.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 12:31 pm 
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Gloopan Kuratz wrote:
Keyser Soze wrote:
No, it's not. Kenny never has nad never will tell Ozzie who to play. If kenny puts him on the team and Ozzie sits him on the bench it does Viciedo no good. Ozzie has to want to play him and he said he would rather play Pierre everyday.

If you bench Pierre who bats leadoff in this mess?

Question still stands.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 12:32 pm 
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Darkside wrote:
Frank Coztansa wrote:
8 HRs in a month isn't all that much for Adam Dunn, but of course this kind of slump is a different animal alltogether.


CSFMB as a whole in unison wrote:
This kind of slump is a different animal

:lol: :lol: :lol:

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 12:39 pm 
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Gloopan Kuratz wrote:
Keyser Soze wrote:
No, it's not. Kenny never has nad never will tell Ozzie who to play. If kenny puts him on the team and Ozzie sits him on the bench it does Viciedo no good. Ozzie has to want to play him and he said he would rather play Pierre everyday.

If you bench Pierre who bats leadoff in this mess?

Guys, it's not the best move, but I think it's the ONLY definitive answer given the way this White Sox team is structured. His batting average isn't where anyone would like it to be, and his on-base percentage isn't much better. Considering the facts that Brent Lillibridge and Omar Vizquel aren't everyday players and SS Alexei Ramirez is more of an RBI guy that Ozzie prefers to bat lower in the lineup, the answer is 2B Gordon Beckham. In fact, the reasons for leading Beckham off can be found here:

http://www.southsidesox.com/2011/6/16/2 ... e-the-lead


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 12:41 pm 
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Gloopan Kuratz wrote:
Gloopan Kuratz wrote:
Keyser Soze wrote:
No, it's not. Kenny never has nad never will tell Ozzie who to play. If kenny puts him on the team and Ozzie sits him on the bench it does Viciedo no good. Ozzie has to want to play him and he said he would rather play Pierre everyday.

If you bench Pierre who bats leadoff in this mess?

Question still stands.

Lillibridge


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