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Bucky Chris
PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2011 7:44 pm 
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HOVA wrote:
Everything I've seen and heard from him. Hell they didn't think enough of him to make him a captain. If he is playing at a high level consistently then he can lead by his play. He hasn't done that in Chicago. He's quick to throw everyone under the bus instead of looking in the mirror.


Cutler was a captain. "Did you watch any games?"
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Urlacher's missing neck
PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2011 7:46 pm 
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Cutler is a terrible leader. This should be common knowledge.

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HOVA
PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2011 7:46 pm 
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When he got here

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In the grand SCEME (not scope, Dumbass) pf things

Awesome.
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bigfan
PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2011 7:49 pm 
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$4M 1 year? Seemed a little light on both sides. Maybe $6 Mill 1 year?

I am all for not paying guys as a practice for years past, but it's no that much more for 10 + years of service and would it kill the BEars to have an explayer say something nice?

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Bucky Chris
PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2011 7:50 pm 
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Urlacher's missing neck wrote:
Cutler is a terrible leader. This should be common knowledge.


Other than citing poor body language, what evidence do you have of that?
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Spaulding
PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2011 7:50 pm 
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Who did he throw under the bus?

He has not been what I thought he was or want him to be. I still have hope.
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HOVA
PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2011 7:55 pm 
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Urlacher's missing neck wrote:
Cutler is a terrible leader. This should be common knowledge.


Cutler hasn't shown one thing that would lead anyone to believe he is a leader. That's fine. He doesn't have to be if they're other strong leaders on offense. He has to play well consistently though and I think he will have a better season than Rodgers this year.

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spanky wrote:
Elmhurst Steve wrote:
In the grand SCEME (not scope, Dumbass) pf things

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Urlacher's missing neck
PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2011 7:56 pm 
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Bucky Chris wrote:
Urlacher's missing neck wrote:
Cutler is a terrible leader. This should be common knowledge.


Other than citing poor body language, what evidence do you have of that?


His time in Denver, how he left Denver, never picking his teammates up in the media after a game, not saying a peep after getting trashed and slammed by everyone for his NFC Championship performance and exit.

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HOVA
PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2011 8:04 pm 
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Spaulding wrote:
Who did he throw under the bus?

He has not been what I thought he was or want him to be. I still have hope.


He's done it with WR's and the offensive line. You may believe he had the right to. Problem is he doesn't take the blame when he fucks up. He doesn't need to be the leader IMO. Everyone can't be Brady or Favre. All he has to do is play well consistently.

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spanky wrote:
Elmhurst Steve wrote:
In the grand SCEME (not scope, Dumbass) pf things

Awesome.
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Bucky Chris
PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2011 8:06 pm 
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I'll choose to disagree. Cutler never once threw his WR or O-line under the bus to the media. Typically, if say, Jay were to tell us the O-line was kick-ass after, I dunno, the Giants game... it might not come off so great.

His teammates in Denver liked him, BTW. Management not liking him is different.
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HOVA
PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2011 8:09 pm 
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I'm not going to make this a bash Cutler session because I like the guy but I've heard him do it.

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spanky wrote:
Elmhurst Steve wrote:
In the grand SCEME (not scope, Dumbass) pf things

Awesome.
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Bucky Chris
PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2011 8:11 pm 
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HOVA wrote:
I'm not going to make this a bash Cutler session because I like the guy but I've heard him do it.


Touche, and I don't care about the leadership stuff anyway, so not sure why I engaged.


Still a good move, though.
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Spaulding
PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2011 8:16 pm 
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I never felt like he threw them under the bus but I have blue & orange glasses on.

And I think he needs to become that leader.
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Chris_in_joliet
PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2011 8:20 pm 
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HOVA wrote:
Chris_in_joliet wrote:
Hova is the same guy that said Sydney Rice is or would be the best WR in the NFC north so how much football do you actually watch? Loyalty is great and so is having leadership, but I would say its time to make a change. Kreutz isn't getting younger and the O line was one of.the worst in the league last year. Our leader led us to our Qb completely getting his ass kicked last year. I dont see how it can get much worse then that.


When healthy what WR looked better than Rice in the NFC? I would think Favre knows a thing or two about WR's and he talked about how great Rice was and will be. He's still only 24 too. This is a team trying to win now. Getting younger and better is fine. Roy Williams wasn't my first choice at WR but fact is he is their best receiver in a decade so I'm cool with that. With Spencer they didn't get better. Getting rid of the best guy on a shitty O-line doesn't make you a better team or get you closer to a championship. It just means Tice will have to call in a few more favors this season to keep Cutler upright. I think Tice is a great enough coach to get the job done but it would have been a lot easier with Kruetz for at least 1 more season.



What wide receiver in the NFC? Really I was just going to limit your comment to the NFC north(Calvin Johnson and Greg Jennings off the top of my head). In the NFC I would say about 10 guys at least.

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What the hell, I would. Post op is OK right? Right?!?!?!
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Hank Scorpio
PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2011 8:22 pm 
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Angelo sucks, but I feel like people want to find reasons to bash him regardless of what happens. They offered Kreutz a contract and he rejected it. They found a younger, bigger center to fill his position. That is all that happened here.

Also, you cant blame the whole line being bad as the reason that Kreutz was bad. Even if they were all bums around him he should still be making the plays on his own guys. That didnt happen the last couple of years. Stop pretending that it is 2005, Kreutz is a shell of his former self.

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Hank Scorpio
PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2011 8:24 pm 
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Chris_in_joliet wrote:
HOVA wrote:
Chris_in_joliet wrote:
Hova is the same guy that said Sydney Rice is or would be the best WR in the NFC north so how much football do you actually watch? Loyalty is great and so is having leadership, but I would say its time to make a change. Kreutz isn't getting younger and the O line was one of.the worst in the league last year. Our leader led us to our Qb completely getting his ass kicked last year. I dont see how it can get much worse then that.


When healthy what WR looked better than Rice in the NFC? I would think Favre knows a thing or two about WR's and he talked about how great Rice was and will be. He's still only 24 too. This is a team trying to win now. Getting younger and better is fine. Roy Williams wasn't my first choice at WR but fact is he is their best receiver in a decade so I'm cool with that. With Spencer they didn't get better. Getting rid of the best guy on a shitty O-line doesn't make you a better team or get you closer to a championship. It just means Tice will have to call in a few more favors this season to keep Cutler upright. I think Tice is a great enough coach to get the job done but it would have been a lot easier with Kruetz for at least 1 more season.



What wide receiver in the NFC? Really I was just going to limit your comment to the NFC north(Calvin Johnson and Greg Jennings off the top of my head). In the NFC I would say about 10 guys at least.


Roddy White
Larry Fitzgerald
Calvin Johnson
Greg Jennings
DeSean Jackson
Hakeem Nicks
Miles Austin


That is just off the top of my head...

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Urlacher's missing neck
PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2011 8:24 pm 
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They did offer him 4 mil for 1 year. What the hell did he want? That is alot for a center imo.

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Chris_in_joliet
PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2011 8:25 pm 
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HOVA wrote:
Brain dead analysis is when you believe 1 player can do everything when it comes to blocking. That pretty much speaks for itself. At 4 I believe my son knows better than that.




Maybe you should let your 4 year old filter your football thoughts from now on. I don't believe 1 guy does all the blocking. When your biggest arguement for a guy staying is his leadership, then you might want to think twice about arguing in his favor. Please tell me now Hova you watched alot of O line play out of Seattle and can truely judge how good of a player Spencer can really be.

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HOVA
PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2011 8:26 pm 
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Chris_in_joliet wrote:
HOVA wrote:
Chris_in_joliet wrote:
Hova is the same guy that said Sydney Rice is or would be the best WR in the NFC north so how much football do you actually watch? Loyalty is great and so is having leadership, but I would say its time to make a change. Kreutz isn't getting younger and the O line was one of.the worst in the league last year. Our leader led us to our Qb completely getting his ass kicked last year. I dont see how it can get much worse then that.


When healthy what WR looked better than Rice in the NFC? I would think Favre knows a thing or two about WR's and he talked about how great Rice was and will be. He's still only 24 too. This is a team trying to win now. Getting younger and better is fine. Roy Williams wasn't my first choice at WR but fact is he is their best receiver in a decade so I'm cool with that. With Spencer they didn't get better. Getting rid of the best guy on a shitty O-line doesn't make you a better team or get you closer to a championship. It just means Tice will have to call in a few more favors this season to keep Cutler upright. I think Tice is a great enough coach to get the job done but it would have been a lot easier with Kruetz for at least 1 more season.



What wide receiver in the NFC? Really I was just going to limit your comment to the NFC north(Calvin Johnson and Greg Jennings off the top of my head). In the NFC I would say about 10 guys at least.


I meant the North. There aren't 10 better in the NFC. It's subjective but neither Johnson or Jennings looked better to me when Rice was healthy.

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spanky wrote:
Elmhurst Steve wrote:
In the grand SCEME (not scope, Dumbass) pf things

Awesome.
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HOVA
PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2011 8:27 pm 
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Chris_in_joliet wrote:
HOVA wrote:
Brain dead analysis is when you believe 1 player can do everything when it comes to blocking. That pretty much speaks for itself. At 4 I believe my son knows better than that.




Maybe you should let your 4 year old filter your football thoughts from now on. I don't believe 1 guy does all the blocking. When your biggest arguement for a guy staying is his leadership, then you might want to think twice about arguing in his favor. Please tell me now Hova you watched alot of O line play out of Seattle and can truely judge how good of a player Spencer can really be.


It has to be football season when I can start using the John Kirk Rule.

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spanky wrote:
Elmhurst Steve wrote:
In the grand SCEME (not scope, Dumbass) pf things

Awesome.
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HOVA
PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2011 8:28 pm 
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Bucky Chris wrote:
HOVA wrote:
I'm not going to make this a bash Cutler session because I like the guy but I've heard him do it.


Touche, and I don't care about the leadership stuff anyway, so not sure why I engaged.


Still a good move, though.


In order for me to make my point I'll have to continually bash a guy who I believe will have the best season of any QB in the division this season. I don't want to do that.

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spanky wrote:
Elmhurst Steve wrote:
In the grand SCEME (not scope, Dumbass) pf things

Awesome.
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Chris_in_joliet
PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2011 8:31 pm 
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Its not subjective. You are the only person that thinks Rice is better then Johnson or Jennings.


And Cutler will probably have a good season this year, but its going to be way behind Rodgers.

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HOVA
PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2011 8:34 pm 
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Chris_in_joliet wrote:
Its not subjective. You are the only person that thinks Rice is better then Johnson or Jennings.


And Cutler will probably have a good season this year, but its going to be way behind Rodgers.


This is one that deep down inside I know you're probably right about but I want my statement to be right.

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spanky wrote:
Elmhurst Steve wrote:
In the grand SCEME (not scope, Dumbass) pf things

Awesome.
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cpguy
PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2011 9:29 pm 
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Assuming Spencer is an upgrade, and I'm not an expert, good riddance to Kreutz. He was blown back plenty the last couple years and is well past his prime. I just hope they know what they are doing with Spencer. Given all the cap cuts, there is no reason they can't upgrade this OL substantially.
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HOVA
PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2011 9:39 pm 
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Angelo and Lovie pretty much said the guy isn't an upgrade. They had the leverage and used it. Kruetz took a stand that he didn't believe in. He wanted to be a Bear and will probably retire because he isn't one. The Bears got a younger guy who isn't better but they feel he is good enough and Tice will likely make him better. They still have a lot of money to spend. Tice should be given a raise immediately.

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spanky wrote:
Elmhurst Steve wrote:
In the grand SCEME (not scope, Dumbass) pf things

Awesome.
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FIRST TIME CALLER
PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2011 10:11 pm 
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good bye :D ,the fans and players are making this non - resigning seem like they didn't resign peyton manning.he was way long in the tooth, not worth more than 4 million a year. team leader in the locker room talk is crap. Walter retired did the team fall apart? i think he held more sway in the locker room than Kruetz ever could. these are PAID professionals, do your job quit twittering and bitching about what he meant to the locker room and play football
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Mr. Reason
PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2011 10:26 pm 
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HOVA wrote:
Angelo and Lovie pretty much said the guy isn't an upgrade. They had the leverage and used it. Kruetz took a stand that he didn't believe in. He wanted to be a Bear and will probably retire because he isn't one. The Bears got a younger guy who isn't better but they feel he is good enough and Tice will likely make him better. They still have a lot of money to spend. Tice should be given a raise immediately.

I am inclined to agree with Nas on this. We may see a classic case of you don't know what you had until it's gone.

Also agree with the Tice angle. He may be the moist valuable coach they have.

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Bucky Chris
PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2011 10:30 pm 
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Mr. Reason wrote:
HOVA wrote:
Angelo and Lovie pretty much said the guy isn't an upgrade. They had the leverage and used it. Kruetz took a stand that he didn't believe in. He wanted to be a Bear and will probably retire because he isn't one. The Bears got a younger guy who isn't better but they feel he is good enough and Tice will likely make him better. They still have a lot of money to spend. Tice should be given a raise immediately.

I am inclined to agree with Nas on this. We may see a classic case of you don't know what you had until it's gone.

Also agree with the Tice angle. He may be the moist valuable coach they have.



Mmmhhhhhmmmm. Moist.
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Mr. Reason
PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2011 10:33 pm 
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Bucky Chris wrote:
Mr. Reason wrote:
HOVA wrote:
Angelo and Lovie pretty much said the guy isn't an upgrade. They had the leverage and used it. Kruetz took a stand that he didn't believe in. He wanted to be a Bear and will probably retire because he isn't one. The Bears got a younger guy who isn't better but they feel he is good enough and Tice will likely make him better. They still have a lot of money to spend. Tice should be given a raise immediately.

I am inclined to agree with Nas on this. We may see a classic case of you don't know what you had until it's gone.

Also agree with the Tice angle. He may be the moist valuable coach they have.



Mmmhhhhhmmmm. Moist.

What you getting at, Fuckhead?

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Irish Boy
PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2011 10:34 pm 
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I'm somewhere in between on this one. Kreutz wasn't the turnstyle some are making him out to be, but he wasn't anything more than a league average center last year either. You'll get one more year of reasonable play out of him, two at most. I can't really get my dander up one way or another.

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