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PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2011 10:04 am 
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Keyser Soze wrote:
Danks is only going to make around $8M this year so it won't affect the retooling. I still think Quentin and Thornton will be moved. I'd like to see them go into the season with Gavin and if they are out of it at the deadline they can trade him then.


Agreed, except I would like to see them sign Floyd to an extension towards the end of the year. Peavy is off the books after this season and hopefully Molina can then take over his spot leaving them with two big earners in Danks and Floyd and three small contracts in Sale, Humber and Molina.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2011 10:10 am 
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Terry's Peeps wrote:
312player wrote:
Peoria Matt wrote:
Wow.

So much for the rebuilding.





no doubt..this is surprising..i like danks and think he can earn that money but the move is puzzling.


What's puzzling about it?




two things strike me..1 the sox are known for not wanting to give long term deals to starters like that..and the sox are at least 3 years away from even contending again and it looked like they were cleaning house until this .

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2011 10:11 am 
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Like I said, having him under contract at a decent price wouldn't preclude them from trading Danks.

It may in fact make it easier.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2011 10:13 am 
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and i think humber comes back to his career numbers this season, looking forward to hearing coopers excuses....and wouldn't that make danks a 5/10 guy and pretty much have a no trade clause?

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2011 10:14 am 
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Terry's Peeps wrote:
It gets a 26 year old left handed SP under control for 5 years at a decent price. That would seem to increase his value in a trade.


ding ding ding, we have a winner


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2011 10:14 am 
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The key is no trade protection or the lack thereof. If Danks did not get that, or only minimal protection, the Sox have options. If Danks negotiated a list of only a handful of teams he can be dealt to, then not as good for the Sox.

We shall see.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2011 10:16 am 
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Obviously.

Just based on the numbers though, its not a hinderance to rebuilding.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2011 10:31 am 
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Frank Coztansa wrote:
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If you are going to extend Danks then why trade your closer?


Because he didn't have the right mental make-up to be a top closer. He came unglued far too easily.

I think mentally is was and will be fine. When he didn't have that sinker working, guys would sit on his fastball. Can't do that in the bigleagues, especially in the 8th and 9th inning.


I agree with you about the sinker. But Santos is a guy with at least three- and maybe four- nasty pitches. We've all seen him dominate batters when everything was working. It's when he's at less than his best that his mental make-up is a factor. We saw it more and more toward the end of last season. At times he looked positively frightened out there. Everyone in the park knew he couldn't get anyone out. Say what you will about a guy like Bobby Jenks, but I don't think he was ever afraid on the mound.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2011 10:34 am 
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I am not sure Jenks was/is smart enough to be afraid on the mound. Which is probably a great thing for a closer.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2011 11:16 am 
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John Danks would have brought the most back in terms of younger players, but he's also at an age where signing him to an extension for a team that is not (and can't be because of the contracts on the team) in full blown rebuilding mode does make sense, and I think they did so without the intention of moving him. You could make the argument that this contract was a bit overpriced though.

I do think this puts Gavin Floyd even closer to the chopping block. The White Sox aren't in true rebuilding mode, but they are somewhat in transition mode.

Next season, Chris Sale will probably have some growing pains in the starting rotation, but there's little doubt of his potential upside and really came on as the season progressed. Jake Peavy will be in his final season in a White Sox uniform and that will clear a lot of money off this payroll. Phillip Humber gets another year to show what kind of starter he is - he was very good in the first half, and poor in the 2nd half, perhaps he wore down some, and maybe the league figured him out, but I think next year will be a great measuring stick of whether he can be counted on in the future. For the 5th role, many think Stewart is a better bullpen arm, but Kenny Williams seems to be in the other camp. In either case, let them battle it out, and the loser could either go to the bullpen or start the season in the minors. It's also possible the White Sox go back to their 6 man rotation although doing so in April with off-days more often doesn't make much sense - although the White Sox have at least 2 guys (Sale and Peavy) whose innings will be watched closely and 2 others (Humber and the #5 spot) that may need to be watched closely as well.

Next season, the rotation will have (pick the order) 1) John Danks 2) Jake Peavy 3) Chris Sale 4) Phillip Humber 5) Competition between Axerlrod and Stewart....

Molina will be a guy that the team is hopeful can step into the rotation either late next season or for 2013 and they may be able to add another pitcher with upside from a Floyd trade.

In any case, the White Sox rotation is a young one outside of Peavy and he'll be gone after this season, most likely replaced with Molina if he continues to show progress, and most of these guys will be either higher draft picks or young guys Williams got through trades of veteran players. Is this a full blown rebuild? No, but it is a rotation in transition.

Looking at the offense, Adam Dunn, Alex Rios and Paul Konerko are going to be here for the next 2-3 seasons (and it may be 4 in Rios' case). Alexi Ramirez is signed for 4 more years as well, and their top minor league talent is here (Morel at 3B, Beckham at 2B, Flowers at C, and Viceido in LF). It looks, like the pitching staff, as a team in transition with A.J probably passing the torch to Flowers (although Flowers has to show me a lot more) after 2012, Beckham at 2B (and probably challenged to keep his job from one of the players acquired from the Ozzie Guillen trade), Morel at 3B, and Carlos Quentin most likely moved this off-season for a minor league prospect - The Sox have to play Rios next season, and if they combine him with De Aza, Viceido and Lillibridge, it at least allows for a rotation of sorts.

So, with the Danks signing, basically replacing Buerhle's contract, the Sox do need to shed payroll and still add a few more pieces to the minor league's - it looks likely that Quentin and Floyd will be moved. I also would guess that either Frasor or Thornton is also moved, and if they are successful in doing this can still save around $20 million off of last year's payroll.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2011 3:14 pm 
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I'm puzzled that people are puzzled.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2011 3:17 pm 
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How long do you think the Sox are planning on rebuilding? The White Sox aren't the Royals who can plan to be bad for a decade so maybe one day they can be a threat for second in the division. My guess is that the Sox don't plan to be down for more than two years. This means that keeping him is the correct move.

It still doesn't matter. I think the Sox are conveniently using "rebuilding" as an excuse if they aren't good. For the first time, they seem to be embracing lowered expectations instead of acting like the think they will repeat 2005.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2011 3:19 pm 
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2012: All Out.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2011 3:26 pm 
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Boilermaker Rick wrote:
.

It still doesn't matter. I think the Sox are conveniently using "rebuilding" as an excuse if they aren't good. For the first time, they seem to be embracing lowered expectations instead of acting like the think they will repeat 2005.

As usual I agree with Rick on matters of White Sox GMing and Kenny Williams in general.

They are probably planning a half rebuild half go for it but dont want to be questioned at every level for not TOTALLY going for it or TOTALLY rebulding.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2011 3:27 pm 
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rogers park bryan wrote:
They are probably planning a half rebuild half go for it but dont want to be questioned at every level for not TOTALLY going for it or TOTALLY rebulding.


And they will end up getting questioned on both ends instead of just one.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2011 3:28 pm 
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RFDC wrote:
rogers park bryan wrote:
They are probably planning a half rebuild half go for it but dont want to be questioned at every level for not TOTALLY going for it or TOTALLY rebulding.


And they will end up getting questioned on both ends instead of just one.

Well, as you've written many times, people will always bitch.

I think it was the right move.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2011 3:28 pm 
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RFDC wrote:
rogers park bryan wrote:
They are probably planning a half rebuild half go for it but dont want to be questioned at every level for not TOTALLY going for it or TOTALLY rebulding.


And they will end up getting questioned on both ends instead of just one.
I'll be happy with anything from 60-110 wins.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2011 3:31 pm 
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Boilermaker Rick wrote:
I'll be happy with anything from 60-110 wins.


I could easily see this being the White Sox team slogan for 2012.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2011 3:32 pm 
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rogers park bryan wrote:
RFDC wrote:
rogers park bryan wrote:
They are probably planning a half rebuild half go for it but dont want to be questioned at every level for not TOTALLY going for it or TOTALLY rebulding.


And they will end up getting questioned on both ends instead of just one.

Well, as you've written many times, people will always bitch.

I think it was the right move.


True. Maybe it will work out in the long run, just seems to me that trying to ride the fence between a full rebuild and fully going for a championship is going to lead to several more mediocre years. It seems more like how the Cubs have went about business for so many years.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2011 3:34 pm 
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He's also coming off his worst year....so his value is low.


Maybe they hope he bounces back and gets an even better package next year.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2011 3:35 pm 
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WestmontMike wrote:
Boilermaker Rick wrote:
I'll be happy with anything from 60-110 wins.


I could easily see this being the White Sox team slogan for 2012.

All Meh.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2011 3:46 pm 
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RFDC wrote:
2012: All Out.


2012: Drawing dead.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2011 3:46 pm 
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2012: It Can't Get Worse

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2011 4:09 pm 
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2011 7:10 pm 
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SomeGuy wrote:
BigFan wrote:
Uh, Kenny is really dumb because Jerry R is a really big poopy head and he smells bad....MUST ALL be part of Jerry and Kennys master plan!!!Jerry will rue the day he ignored me at a board function! The voices in my HEAD TELL ME THAT THE SOX ARE ALL AGAISNT ME!!!! WELL SOX FANS WHAT DO YOU THINK OF YOUR GOD KENNY NOW?@?? I am also totally not a Sox fan but I post like I am!!! Kenny stole my lunch money in grade school! I will single handily tear down the White Sox Empire!!! The Sox will pay their fair share of the rent!!!



See ya next week!


Are you kidding me? I would never for ban you for this solid display of your thought level.

The only thing you really could have added, as many Sox fans have, "I will wait to see what Kenny's next move is, maybe this is part of another deal Kenny is working on." This is the new phrase for saying "That trade/signing sucks, but I am a Sox fan, so I can't say it sucks, so I can swing it that kenny is like a mad scientist who is working on something bigger and I will also say I am not going to the games, until they get better!"

that works

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2011 9:23 pm 
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Except that this signing doesn't suck. In fact its awesome. Its the best player move made so far in Chicago this baseball offseason.

Too bad Kenny didn't trade for a failed prospect. You certainly would be all over him if he traded one of the best lefty relievers in the league for another team's garbage :lol: :lol: :lol:

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2011 9:24 pm 
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Frank Coztansa wrote:
Except that this signing doesn't suck. In fact its awesome. Its the best player move made so far in Chicago this baseball offseason.

Too bad Kenny didn't trade for a failed prospect. You certainly would be all over him if he traded one of the best lefty relievers in the league for another team's garbage :lol: :lol: :lol:


Ahem.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2011 9:25 pm 
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:lol: :lol: I stand corrected. Well played.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2011 9:32 pm 
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IF Reed Johnson played on the South Side at anytime in his career, his name would be Aaron Rowand and he would be beloved. He would be all Grindy and "The kind of guys Kenny gets" Blah blah blha

And FACT, the Sox have tried to acquire him in the past when he was available.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2011 9:35 pm 
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FACT the cubs traded away a great left handed reliever for a failed prospect. FACT you would be all over Kenny if he did the same.

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