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 Post subject: Lebron
PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2007 11:05 pm 
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Good luck to the Bulls the next few years. I think this is the start of King James taking over the East. By himself, he is leading the series 3-2. If he had anyone making plays with him, they would of swept the Pistons.


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PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2007 11:13 pm 
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Yeah. This game goes up there with MJ's greatest playoff games. Lebron scored 29 of their last 30. 25 straight.

Plus about 6 or 7 were fade away jumpers.

I have no idea why the Pistons didsn't double him at the top of the key for that game winning shot. He got all the way to the rim. You have to make somebody else beat you. Even if its an open jumper.


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PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2007 11:14 pm 
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This game might make a good case for the Bulls to get Kobe. The Cavs are terrible. The Pistons apparently aren't very good. I guess all it takes is one star playing at the top of his game to go to the finals. If the Bulls could find a way to keep Deng and get Kobe, they're the team to beat.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 12:19 am 
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Lebron James is not the next MJ. He will be a completely different and special talent that will not be compared with MJ, but simply put in the same level. With a win in game 6, he vaults himself to the next great superstar in the NBA. He leapfrogs Kobe, Dwayne Wade, and every other player who isn't Tim Duncan.

He may not win a championship this year but he'll win multiple by the time he's through. This was the most dominant performance I have seen on a basketball floor since MJ took of the Bulls jersey for the last time. Detroit is a great defensive team and they looked absolutely silly out there. Tayshaun Prince looked like a below average defender and when he got to the basket, no one was stopping him. His teammates played the worst 4th quarter and overtime I have ever seen.

We saw the start of the Lebron James era tonight. He won't be the next MJ. He'll be the first Lebron. There will never be another MJ. If Lebron gets the right tools around him and keeps the killer instinct he has started to show, he will win a ton of titles. He may have to leave Cleveland to do it, but he's going to go down as a top 10 all time player.

This game will be Lebron's version of the 63 points against the Celtics that Jordan had. You get the feeling with Lebron that you got with Jordan. Give him the ball and get the f%$@ out of the way, but be ready to catch an assist.

I know it is only one game but you could see the potential in Lebron for a while. He did things on a basketball court that showed amazing promise. He put it all together on the biggest stage he has ever had. I've jumped on the Lebron James bandwagon and he is going to be the next in the line of Dr. J, Bird/Magic, and Jordan. Tim Duncan and Shaq are in a different category in my classification.

If he can punctuate game 5 with a win in game 6, even with a good performance, he will cement his place as the second best player in the league and the biggest superstar. He also is going to give the Spurs a great series. If Ilgauskas, Varejo, and Gooden can somewhat control the Spurs, they have a great shot at winning. Lebron is going to make Bruce Bowen look worse than Prince is now. Ginobili has no shot against him either.

Lebron James is not the next MJ, but he is next in line of the greatest players in NBA history.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 12:25 am 
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Wow. I'm glad you came to this revelation. So you came to the conclusion that James will be one of the greatest ever. Everybody knew this about James before this game. LOL.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 12:32 am 
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Beardown wrote:
Wow. I'm glad you came to this revelation. So you came to the conclusion that James will be one of the greatest ever. Everybody knew this about James before this game. LOL.


Most people call Kobe the best player in the NBA. This was the first game(and series) that Lebron James truly lived up to his hype. I'm glad you already had Lebron marked down as the best player for the next ten years instead of Kobe, or Wade but it was far from unanimous.

Just wait, someone is going to argue with me that Kobe is still a better player.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 12:37 am 
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No. I just knew he was gonna be one of the greatest ever. Everybody did. Ya know. You can say that Kobe and Lebron both great. There is no law against that. As far as who is better. I'd take Lebron. But Kobe is right there. If somebody liked Kobe better they are not stupid. You can't go wrong really.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 12:47 am 
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Beardown,
Congratulation's for you for knowing that Lebron was going to be able to dominate without ever seeing it in a big game. There are tons of players who come out of high school/college as the next great player that will go down as an all-time great. I'm pretty sure Kerry Wood was the next Nolan Ryan.

The point of my post is that for the first time, Lebron showed how great he truly can be. Beating up on high schoolers and putting up top 10 numbers in the league doesn't put you in the level of the all-time greats. This performance was the first time you could see it all come together.

I always thought Lebron would be a great player, but I had a hard time seeing what was going to make him an all-time great. I saw for the first time tonight a performance from him that will go down in history.

I guess I'm not a basketball expert like you so I'll apologize. In order to help me out from making another post like this, please let me know if Greg Oden will be an all-time great center. I don't want to make such an obvious post that he will be as good as any center who ever played the game.

Also, by saying that Kobe is right there you contradict yourself. In my opinion, the gap is widening and is pretty wide right now between the two. It sounds as if you don't agree with my post.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 12:54 am 
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By the way, I don't think Greg Oden will be an all-time great center. I just want to make sure that if he puts up Shaq like numbers, I won't be called out for another obvious conclusion.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 5:33 am 
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Nas wrote:
1. Does one game vault you into the best player in the game?

2. LeBron has the potential to be better than MJ but he lacks the killer instinct and that's something you can't teach.

3. Kobe has had a ton of great games where he single handily led his team to big wins.

4. While I think LeBron is better than Wade I would rather have Wade on my team in a big game before LeBron.

5. A lot of you guys tend to overreact to any and everything.


1. No
2. He looked like a cold blodded killer last night
3. Great, at not once has that mattered since Shaq left. They both have horrible role players around them and neither has a good #2 option
4. Fair enough, but LeBron hit 2 game winners in last years playoffs and if LeBron had a dominate Center last year the Cavs would have won it all.
5. True, but seeing the Boo Ya's flip flop over this will be great. Many, just last week were acting like LeBron was the biggest bust of all time. And as great as it is to watch him you can probably pencil in the Cavs for one spot in the next 8 Eastern Confrence Finals. And the Bulls have to go up against Wade, Bosh, Howard. Fuck getting Kobe, I really think a guy like Randolph is what you need


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 6:38 am 
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If the Cavs make the finals they will lose in five games.
Duncan and his team are better than Lebron and his.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 7:45 am 
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Quote:
Lebron James is not the next MJ.

Quote:
He will be a completely different and special talent that will not be compared with MJ,

Quote:
He won't be the next MJ.

Quote:
There will never be another MJ.

Quote:
Lebron James is not the next MJ,


Rick, I'm trying to read thought the lines in your comments. Are you taking the position that you don't believe Lebron James is "the next MJ"?


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 9:19 am 
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NSJ,
Nicely done. I guess I am still defensive about it.

It's not overreacting to one game Nas. It has been there with Lebron before but never like this. He's had a good game 3 and 4 but in the biggest game of his career to this point he was unstoppable.

I also never said he was the best player in the game. Tim Duncan is, just like Shaq was when he was in LA. Lebron will be the best player in the game as soon as he wins his first title.

Lebron answered the critics, of which I was one of them, about how he doesn't come up in big games. You realize that he scored 29 of the last 30 points of a game 5 in Detroit against one of the best defensive teams in the country? The team he has now is as good as Kobe's and he is taking a championship team to the ropes. If he can knock them out in game 6, it's a great accomplishment.

You can call it an overreaction if you want but I see it as Lebron finally showing his true potential.

Anyways, it may be a little early to anoint him as the biggest superstar in the league, but it will happen, and it will happen soon. I think the Cavs are going to give the Spurs a good series, but Tim Duncan is too good this year.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 9:57 am 
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Wow, I found someone who bought into the Lebron James wave more than I did. Sadly, it is a columnist who I think most of the time is nothing more than someone trying to stir the pot but it's still interesting.

http://cbs.sportsline.com/nba/story/10205255/2

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 10:15 am 
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Do you guys remember some of those playoff games Kobe had in their 3-peat run? I know Nas remembers. I mean Lebron had a great game but I'm hearing people say they've never seen something like that. Cmon.

Even Wade had a game like that in last years finals. People have no memory.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 10:22 am 
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Beardown wrote:
Do you guys remember some of those playoff games Kobe had in their 3-peat run? I know Nas remembers. I mean Lebron had a great game but I'm hearing people say they've never seen something like that. Cmon.

Even Wade had a game like that in last years finals. People have no memory.


Didn't Wade have 2 or 3 games like that last year? And after a guy scores the final 25 points for his team in Game 5, on the road, 2-2, I think people have the right to overreact. When LeBron is hoisting trophy after trophy for years to come, this will be the game people always mention. It was special and I think NBA fans should enjoy it. And it also should make you upset because the Bulls will have to go through him.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 10:26 am 
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Beardown,
The difference is that Kobe and Wade had another player who did something. The Pistons were running 2 or 3 players at Lebron because they knew no one else could do anything. Unless you count Drew Gooden's free throw, the biggest impact another Cav player had was Eric Snow with a few defensive stops.

If the Pistons had played the same defense they did against Lebron against a team with Shaq, they would have gotten blown out. Shaq required double teams himself. I can't imagine how easy it would have been to get him the ball in the paint with 3 guys standing around Lebron.

Given the importance of the game, the defensive quality of the Pistons, and the play of his teammates, this was one of the best individual performances ever.

I may be early in proclaiming Lebron to start his ascension to greatness because of this game but this game was the start of something special.

Anyways, I guess I don't get why you are arguing that Lebron is going to be an all-time great and everyone knows it and always did, but this wasn't a great performance and Kobe has done it many other times. This was the first time on an NBA floor that they hype met the results. I'm very confused on your stance Beardown.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 10:27 am 
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I was pissed we had Lebron in our division before this game. You said people have a right to overreact. What? The word overreact by definition means you are saying something is bigger then it is. So why do people have that right? LOL.

Lebron's a great player. If he loses this year he'll still be a great player. He will win 3 titles at least. It might not start this year but it will happen.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 11:28 am 
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Nas is right. Lebron and his team would have lost to the Suns in the first round just like Kobe. Lebron beat Washington and New Jersey. Good for him.

Also, those 50 wins Cleveland had would have been 40-42 in the West and an 8 seed just like Kobe. Kobe's Lakers team would have been a 2 seed in the East if he got to switch leagues with the Cavs.

Plus when Kobe was hitting those jumpers in those title runs with a guy in his face how did his teammates help him? They didn't matter for some of those shots.

Lebron is great. But so is Kobe.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 11:39 am 
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Nas,
Do you mean post-Shaq? You must because I'm pretty sure Payton, Malone, and Shaq are better than anyone in that list, even if they were somewhat past their prime.

Every team that Kobe won a championship on was loaded. I really hope you were talking about the last couple of years with Kobe.

I'm going to assume that.

First off, Lamar Odom is far and away better than everyone on that list and is much better than Larry Hughes.
The Cavs probably do have a better group after that, but it's not that much better. Ilgauskas is good and Gooden can be. Varejo brings energy and rebounding. Marshall, Pavlovic,and Gibson are just average players.

As for Shaq not being a factor in the 4th, I guarantee that if 2 or 3 people guarded Kobe on every possession, Shaq would have scored every time down. Rasheed Wallace covered a big area last night while 2 or 3 guards from Detroit ran at Lebron. He still dominated.

If they had done that to the Lakers with Shaq, it would have been pass from Kobe to Gary Payton, a pass from Payton(or whatever guard) to Shaq, and then a dunk.

Cleveland did have an easy path, but they are in a great position to beat the Pistons where the Bulls failed.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 11:41 am 
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The 4 best teams were in the West. Kobe had to play the Suns, Spurs, Mavs, Rockets, and even the Jazz 4 or 5 times this season.

Lebron James only had to play each of those teams twice. Keep that in mind when you compare the Lakers 42 wins to the Cavs 50 wins. Lebron got to chawk up wins against the weak East.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 11:47 am 
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Boilermaker Rick wrote:
Do you mean post-Shaq? You must because I'm pretty sure Payton, Malone, and Shaq are better than anyone in that list, even if they were somewhat past their prime.



Payton and especially Malone were on their last legs. Neither contributed very much.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 12:00 pm 
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This argument is going in too many different directions. I've pretty much made my points. We won't have a solid answer on the West vs. East debate until we see how Lebron plays against the Spurs, if they are able to close out the Pistons.

You wouldn't think that a post about something that everybody already knew would get such a reaction.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 12:07 pm 
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If the Cavs win the title, then they will be the worst team ever to win one. The East is awful, and they are awful.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 12:07 pm 
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You wouldn't think that a post about something that everybody already knew would get such a reaction.


Everyone knew the OG sucked, but that got some traction.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 12:09 pm 
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If the Cavs win the title, then they will be the worst team ever to win one. The East is awful, and they are awful.

Don't worry Sculldog. Ain't gonna happen. If the Cavs win the title, it'll be like 1999 all over again. Notice how no one ever talks about the 1999 NBA Finals?

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 12:10 pm 
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Everybody did know Lebron was great. Even if they lose he's still great. Nobody is arguing with you about that Rick.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 12:11 pm 
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That 99 Finals was Knicks vs Spurs. Spurs won. Yeah it was strike shortened. But that was a pretty good team. Duncan and Robinson.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 12:12 pm 
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The Cavs deserve credit if they can beat the Spurs, but they won't. The Spurs are the best team in the West.

If the Bears had won the Super Bowl, would you have said they would have been the worst team to win one because the NFC sucked?

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2007 12:14 pm 
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That 99 Finals was Knicks vs Spurs. Spurs won. Yeah it was strike shortened. But that was a pretty good team. Duncan and Robinson.

I meant more in terms of interest level. Nobody watched that Spurs vs. Knicks series. Even with a star like Lebron, I don't think many people would watch Cleveland in the NBA Finals.

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