You picked your offensive lineman and you call the plays.

You would have to raise your game by miles just to reach the suck level.

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Yeah,but the beat guys love his quotes.

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favrefan said:"Chris Coghlan isn't gonna pay your rent, Jimmy."

Can't believe Martz was better.

Just don't say he's a bad O Line coach. Folks around here get defensive about that.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

Yeah, I'd have to say, at this point, probably media members shouldn't call him a offensive line whiz anymore. Whatever you might think of what he has to work with, it's hard to believe this is the very best that could be gotten from them.

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You can't see me because of internet.

The landowner effectively owns part shares in millions of part-time slaves called, "taxpayers." -Roy L
A Personal Relationship with Jesus?

Said that to my brother last night, literal brother, that it's possible he really sucks.

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Team Cutler.

I'm confused how he got this "guru" title in the first place. When he was OL coach in Minnesota they had two possible HOF on the line. He didn't make them HOF, they already were that good.

The fact is that until further notice he has to be considered one of the worst positional coaches in the NFL, based on the production of his unit(giggity) the past few years.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

I hate when fans qualify the success of positional coaches. How can you possibly grade them? Are you even 100% sure he has the guys he wants?

I know for a fact, when Jerry was the GM, the coaches would work with Jerry up until the draft, but when it came down to picking players... it was Jerry's decision. Period.

And now, how do you know Tice isn't coaching them UP from the talent they have? This could be the absolute best they can possibly play. Or not. But how do fans know?

Is there a chance that the 49ers defense was really fucking good? I know the Bears may have
helped but my buddy and I couldn't believe their speed. They looked like a younger Bears D
and could tackle really well.

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Flew too close to the sun on wings of pastrami

Because nobody is showing improvement. Maybe Chris Williams sucked, but he never got less sucky. Same with Carimi. That's two first round picks. I'll give him a pass on Webb because you don't draft 7th rounders as starters usually. Who has shown any type of improvement on the line since Tice has been here?

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

How do you know they aren't just bad players? Webb being a starter and actually playing alright is a huge win for Tice... you're not giving him due credit then, if we are to follow your logic. Otherwise, who was Lance Louis before becoming a starter? What about Chilo? Niners didn't want him.


More often than not, good players are what matters.


It's too bad we can't get Jeremy Bates! He made Cutler a Pro Bowler!!

Tice has vouched for these bad players multiple times. He's partially responsible for picking the crap ingredients in the shit stew.

FF how can you give him a pass on Webb but not Williams and Carimi? Its seems to be very possible that they all are just flat out terrible and will continue to be terrible regardless of who is coaching them.

Tice does not seem to be as good as I thought, but he does not have much to work with. He is also having to be the OCoord on top of being the line coach, and he certainly has not done even a decent job with the former.

With the OLine though, its as if Tice is being told to build a house and has been given just some lumber and a couple of nails. No saws, no hammers, no concrete. Kinda tough to do.

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They are really good.

Having said that, the footwork of the Bears O-line is fuckin pathetic.

Their ability to pick up line stunts, pathetic.

They got speed rushed, bull rushed and just plain run over.

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Vouched? Of course he has, it's all he has to work with! He's not going to throw them under the bus. What good would that do?

Could Tice block anyone as a tight end? I can't recall.

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Reality is your friend, not your enemy. -- Seacrest

Good coaches make the most out of their talent, however bad it is. The Bears O-line is laughable. Looks like a bunch of fat guys picked up at a local bar who never played football before. If that is the best his coaching can do, than he sucks.

If you are a good coach, you can make poor talent look at least mediocre. Anyone can make bad look bad. I might as well coach the O-line.

Agreed, I really had high hopes for Carimi but he got pancaked 4 or 5 times. Just run over by a truck.

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Flew too close to the sun on wings of pastrami

I just wholeheartedly disagree with this. Bad is bad. Individually, each player is bad. They might actually be better as a group than they should be.


Very rarely do good coaches make a name on bad players.


Ben McAdoo must be a hall of fame QB coach.

After a terrible 2011 season for the Bears offensive linemen they draft 0 offensive linemen and sign Chilo Richal. I take that as a vote of confidence for his players.

By your logic, good coaches then are only due to good players. So coaching has no affect on sports at all. It just depends on your talent and players and that is it.

So, you are saying that Coach K couldn't win more games at say DePaul with the same players than the current coach at DePaul? Good coaches find a way to make their players compete. Tice does not.

He is not the GM! Positional coaches don't sign players, and they don't draft players.


And further, I'm not sure what other options there were. There were not many, if any, big name linemen available.

Only an All-Pro guard was a free agent.

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Reality is your friend, not your enemy. -- Seacrest

Webb isnt playing alright. Youre one of the only Bears fans I've heard say that. He sucks. Im just not gonna criticize Tice too much for him because he wasn't supposed to suck. Louis and Chilo suck too. Have they gotten better under Tice? I havent seen it. Niners probably didn't want Chilo because they have the best offensive line in the league.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

My premise is more how ridiculous it is for a fan to think they have a grasp on the quality of a positional coach. They aren't calling plays, they aren't making personell decisions, and most of what they do is overshadowed by the coordinator.


I at least understand and can put some value in fans criticizing coordinators. You have actual tangible evidence of what they are doing (play calls, formations, personell, coverages, etc). You don't have any of that with positional coaches. You don't know if Tice is telling them exactly what to do, and they just aren't doing it, or physically can't. You don't know if these guys are actually 10 times better than they should be. You just can't tell from the couch how well a positional coach is doing. You don't get enough evidence.

And anything you COULD possibly say about the value of a position coach, really should be an indictment on the coordinator/head coach. They make the real decisions. They are in charge.

We have no way of knowing that though. Carimi, Webb, and Williams have never been coached by a different coach at the NFL level.

I get that his players aren't good. If he was an offensive line guru he would at least make them watchable, at least make them slightly better than they were. He hasn't. He has done a really poor job by any type of results-oriented criteria.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

I get your point, but I really don't think those guys are 10 times better than they should be

The vast majority of this is on the GM for giving Tice this crap to work with. Some of it is probably on the players. We've had evidence of Webb not working hard enough to get better. A small part of it is probably on Tice.

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JaMarcus is playing WAY better than a 7th round LT should. Victory for Tice!!

Niners didn't want Chilo because he is bad. He has been in the league 5 years and ee is getting paid $700k. He is not a good player. If he was, he would have gotten more money and more interest from other teams.

No, Webb is playing how a 7th rounder is expected to. He has 1 OK game and then 4 awful games. Sounds about right.

Chilo is not good. I agree. He hasn't gotten any better. Just like every single other offensive lineman coached by Tice with Chicago.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul