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 Post subject: Re: 2013 Dunn-O-Meter
PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 10:21 am 
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rogers park bryan wrote:
SomeGuy wrote:
rogers park bryan wrote:
He's not Done


Well, yeah, he's Dunn.

I think he has another nice homerun binge in him.


Don't do this to yourself.


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 Post subject: Re: 2013 Dunn-O-Meter
PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 10:25 am 
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SomeGuy wrote:
rogers park bryan wrote:
SomeGuy wrote:
rogers park bryan wrote:
He's not Done


Well, yeah, he's Dunn.

I think he has another nice homerun binge in him.


Don't do this to yourself.

Im not a Sox fan, so it doesnt matter to me.


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 Post subject: Re: 2013 Dunn-O-Meter
PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 10:39 am 
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http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/adam-dun ... xperiment/

Adam Dunn’s Failed Experiment
by Dave Cameron - April 15, 2013

Adam Dunn arrived in the Major Leagues in 2001. Since then, he has led the major leagues in both walks (1,172) and strikeouts (2,046) and is third in home runs (408), and his career stands as something of the perfect example of the Three True Outcomes. Of the 7,256 times he’s walked up to the plate, 3,702 of those PAs (51%) have ended without defensive involvement. Dunn has perfected the slow pitch softball style of baseball and turned that skillset into a pretty effective big league career.

And now, at age 33, Dunn is participating in an experiment to become an entirely new kind of hitter. Two weeks in, and it’s hard to call the experiment anything other than a total failure.


Back in spring training, Dunn told the world that this change was coming:

“I’m fighting myself over this,” Dunn said, “because I don’t want to give up something that I do very well, like walks and get deep in counts, to something in the past I haven’t done very well, and that’s being more aggressive early on.”

Dunn is correct that he hasn’t historically been an aggressive hitter. He’s swung at just 41.1% of the pitches he’s been thrown since 2002 — the first year BIS recorded plate discipline data — and has only swung at the first pitch of an at-bat 27% of the time. Both of those marks are below the league average, and support what we already knew; Dunn has been a selective hitter whose strategy has been to get himself into hitter’s counts and then swing for the moon.

The 2013 version of Adam Dunn doesn’t resemble that guy at all. Not only has Dunn swung at 50% of the pitches he’s been thrown — a career high by a mile — he’s also swung at the first pitch in 46% of his plate appearances, the seventh highest first-pitch swing rate in all of baseball. For context, Pablo Sandoval is swinging at 48% of first pitches, and Josh Hamilton is swinging at 49%. On the first pitch, Adam Dunn has essentially become an undisciplined hack.

Of the 22 times Dunn has swung at the first pitch this year, he’s put the ball in play 10 times, resulting in one double, one home run, and eight outs. The other 12 swings have either been whiffs or fouls, putting him in an 0-1 count for the at-bat. Combining the outs with the strikes, Dunn’s early aggressiveness has resulted in a poor outcome 91% of the time.

This shift in approach has had a pretty significant effect on the types of counts where Dunn’s at-bats end. Here’s a breakdown of the counts in which he has either walked, struck out, or put the ball in play this year, compared to his career averages.


2013 PA % Career PA %
First Pitch 10 22% First Pitch 663 9%
1-0 Count 1-0 Count 359 5%
2-0 Count 2-0 Count 159 2%
3-0 Count 3-0 Count 341 5%
0-1 Count 4 9% 0-1 Count 372 5%
1-1 Count 2 4% 1-1 Count 452 6%
2-1 Count 3 7% 2-1 Count 353 5%
3-1 Count 6 13% 3-1 Count 503 7%
0-2 Count 4 9% 0-2 Count 451 6%
1-2 Count 5 11% 1-2 Count 936 13%
2-2 Count 7 15% 2-2 Count 1148 16%
Full Count 5 11% Full Count 1519 21%
Since there’s a lot of small sample noise there, maybe a summary chart will do a better job of showing the shift here.


2013 PA % Career PA %
Batter Ahead 14 30% Batter Ahead 3234 45%
Even Count 19 41% Even Count 2263 31%
Pitcher Ahead 13 28% Pitcher Ahead 1759 24%
Finally, one more table, showing not just the counts that at-bats ended on, but the percentage of hitter’s counts that Dunn has gotten into in the first place, per Baseball Reference.


Year 3-0% 2-0%
2013 4% 7%
Career 8% 19%
Adam Dunn used to get into a lot of good hitter’s counts. 2013 Adam Dunn no longer does that.

Moving at-bats from hitter’s counts to even counts is simply a net loss, but this change isn’t solely about swinging at different times during an at-bat. In the piece linked above, Dunn notes that he’s also changing the trigger that tells him to swing or take.

“We’re going to focus on an area and not a pitch,” Dunn said. “Normally I focus on a pitch, like I know a guy’s tendencies. So early in the count, I’ll try to get to a certain count because I know 70 percent of the time he throws a changeup in 1-0 counts, stuff like that.

“Instead of looking for a specific pitch in a specific location, I’m going to try this spring to look at a location early and let it fly.”



“What it really will require is practice,” he said, “like literally telling myself, ‘I’m swinging at this pitch until my eyes tell me otherwise,’ as opposed to saying, ‘If I don’t see fastball, shut it down.’

“It’s going to be hard. I’m not going to lie to you. But we’ve got a long spring, so it will be good.”

While previously Dunn would select based on pitch type, now he’s keying off location. Or, at least, that’s what he said the plan was. Thanks to the wonderful PITCHF/x tool from TexasLeaguers, we can actually see that he’s following through with this plan. Here’s a plot of every pitch he’s taken this year.

Image

You can probably spot the giant hole there. Middle-in and slightly elevated, Dunn has swung at every pitch he’s been thrown this year. Dunn said he wanted to look at a location at let it fly; it seems pretty clear what location he’s looking for. From BaseballHeatMaps, here’s Dunn’s swing rates against RHPs compared the league average for that part of the zone.

Image

And here’s that same heat map, just for 2008-2012.

Image

Dunn has basically adapted his approach to swing at anything on the inner half as long as it isn’t at the knees. Instead of studying pitcher tendencies and trying to get into counts where he can guess what’s coming, he’s now just looking for a ball middle in at any point in the at-bat.

And the results have been disastrous. He’s hitting .136/.174/.295, good for just a .206 wOBA. Because he’s falling behind more often than he used to, the more aggressive approach hasn’t really trimmed his strikeout rate, but it’s basically eliminated his ability to draw walks; he has just two bases on balls so far. Sacrificing walks for more hits and more home runs could be a worthy trade-off if that was the result, but what Dunn has really accomplished so far is trading walks for outs.

At some point in the near future, Dunn is going to have to make a choice. He’s had a solid 11 year career as a selective hitter who got into hitter’s counts and keyed off a specific pitch, and now he’s had a pretty terrible two weeks as an aggressive hitter who swings at anything middle-in and elevated. Perhaps with more work at it, Dunn will make the necessary adjustments and get back to being a productive hitter. But, realistically, he was already a productive hitter. There isn’t a lot of evidence to suggest that Aggressive Dunn will be significantly more productive than Patient Dunn, and given the cost the team is paying while he attempts to make this shift, it’s hard to see how Dunn’s transformation is actually going to be a net positive for the White Sox.

If he was a 21-year-old kid with a bright future ahead of him, I think you could make a pretty decent case for adapting his approach at the plate. Dunn, though, is a 33-year-old with a long history of Major League success doing things the way he was doing them, and he’s only under contract with the White Sox for 2013 and 2014, so the White Sox are making a short-term-for-long-term trade-off with a player that they may not even retain beyond next season. It might have been an experiment with good intentions, but even though 46 plate appearances is an awfully small sample, it’s probably getting close to time for everyone involved to consider the exercise a failure and let Dunn get back to what he has always been good at.

If the White Sox wanted an aggressive power hitter, they shouldn’t have signed Adam Dunn to begin with. That’s just not what he’s ever been, and trying to make him an aggressive power hitter at age-33 is looking like a pretty big mistake.

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 Post subject: Re: 2013 Dunn-O-Meter
PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 10:52 am 
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dude is cooked to 165 degrees. well done.

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 Post subject: Re: 2013 Dunn-O-Meter
PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 10:57 am 
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Chus wrote:
Darkside wrote:
Dunn was light years behind a 92 MPH fastball for his second out of the day. 0-2 and looking real bad.


He looks like a fat guy in a rec softball league, who has had a few too many beers.




He has ALWAYS looked like THAT!

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 Post subject: Re: 2013 Dunn-O-Meter
PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 10:58 am 
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Aggravated Sox Fan Bob wrote:
Chus wrote:
Darkside wrote:
Dunn was light years behind a 92 MPH fastball for his second out of the day. 0-2 and looking real bad.


He looks like a fat guy in a rec softball league, who has had a few too many beers.




He has ALWAYS looked like THAT!

THE RETURN!!!!!!!!


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 Post subject: Re: 2013 Dunn-O-Meter
PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 10:59 am 
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OAF!

OAF!

OAF!

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 Post subject: Re: 2013 Dunn-O-Meter
PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 10:59 am 
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Apologist wrote:
Now I realize not everyone is on the WAR train, however I found this interesting.

Dunn now has 3 of the 4 worst 40 Homer seasons in MLB History.

Year Player..............HR...WAR

2008 Adam Dunn.......40...0.9
1998 Jose Canseco....46...1.6
2006 Adam Dunn.......40...1.6
2012 Adam Dunn.......41...1.7
1977 Jeff Burroughs...41...1.7


That's because he was a DH playing in the OF. I bet his defense was like -100.

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 Post subject: Re: 2013 Dunn-O-Meter
PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 11:05 am 
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rogers park bryan wrote:
SomeGuy wrote:
rogers park bryan wrote:
He's not Done


Well, yeah, he's Dunn.

I think he has another nice homerun binge in him.


Yea but unless you're Elmhurst Steve and love counting stats, that doesn't do a lot of good. He needs to go yard and get on base to be effective. The lack of walks is killing him.

None of this is even, SHARK-level analysis. Everyone is regurgitating what is painfully obvious here.

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 Post subject: Re: 2013 Dunn-O-Meter
PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 11:10 am 
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Apologist wrote:
rogers park bryan wrote:
SomeGuy wrote:
rogers park bryan wrote:
He's not Done


Well, yeah, he's Dunn.

I think he has another nice homerun binge in him.


Yea but unless you're Elmhurst Steve and love counting stats, that doesn't do a lot of good. He needs to go yard and get on base to be effective. The lack of walks is killing him.

None of this is even, SHARK-level analysis. Everyone is regurgitating what is painfully obvious here.

Its painfully obvious that he is going to come back?

Mine was not analysis. It was a prediction.

I think he has a good run of HR AND getting on base (thought that was assumed)


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 Post subject: Re: 2013 Dunn-O-Meter
PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 11:13 am 
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Ahh. Let me clarify: The lack of homers and walks are the symptoms.

The not taking pitches and driving ones he is comfortable with is the disease.

I was speaking in generalities, not singling out your prediction.

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 Post subject: Re: 2013 Dunn-O-Meter
PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 11:15 am 
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Apologist wrote:
Ahh. Let me clarify: The lack of homers and walks are the symptoms.

The not taking pitches and driving ones he is comfortable with is the disease.

I was speaking in generalities, not singling out your prediction.

So he hit 400 homeruns and THEN decided to change his approach?

Not a great idea.


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 Post subject: Re: 2013 Dunn-O-Meter
PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 11:19 am 
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i think I saw liverworts growing on his bat.

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 Post subject: Re: 2013 Dunn-O-Meter
PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 11:29 am 
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rogers park bryan wrote:
Apologist wrote:
Ahh. Let me clarify: The lack of homers and walks are the symptoms.

The not taking pitches and driving ones he is comfortable with is the disease.

I was speaking in generalities, not singling out your prediction.

So he hit 400 homeruns and THEN decided to change his approach?

Not a great idea.

I'm not big on the signifigance of hitting coaches, but the Jeff Manto Era isn't exactly off to a flying start..

Image

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 Post subject: Re: 2013 Dunn-O-Meter
PostPosted: Sun Apr 21, 2013 10:34 am 
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Batting average at .098. Damn, this was thread meant to be fun not his eulogy. :|


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 Post subject: Re: 2013 Dunn-O-Meter
PostPosted: Sun Apr 21, 2013 10:50 am 
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Kirkwood wrote:
Batting average at .098. Damn, this was thread meant to be fun not his eulogy. :|


Can't it be both?

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 Post subject: Re: 2013 Dunn-O-Meter
PostPosted: Sun Apr 21, 2013 1:18 pm 
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.154 OBP and .213 SLG. :shock:

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 Post subject: Re: 2013 Dunn-O-Meter
PostPosted: Sun Apr 21, 2013 1:37 pm 
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I think there's something wrong with him.
Bat is SO MUCH slower than last year.
He just got wiffed on a 89 mph fastball at the letters and he couldn't catch up at all.

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 Post subject: Re: 2013 Dunn-O-Meter
PostPosted: Sun Apr 21, 2013 1:44 pm 
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Darkside wrote:
I think there's something wrong with him.
Bat is SO MUCH slower than last year.
He just got wiffed on a 89 mph fastball at the letters and he couldn't catch up at all.

Said woman take it slow, and it'll work itself out fine
All we need is just a little patience
Said sugar take it slow and we'll come together fine
All we need is just a little patience

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 Post subject: Re: 2013 Dunn-O-Meter
PostPosted: Sun Apr 21, 2013 4:00 pm 
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If getting to .200 is the mendoza line then what is getting to .100?? because the big man has gotten to .109!!!

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 Post subject: Re: 2013 Dunn-O-Meter
PostPosted: Sun Apr 21, 2013 4:01 pm 
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Urlacher's missing neck wrote:
If getting to .200 is the mendoza line then what is getting to .100?? because the big man has gotten to .109!!!

If he didn't hit that pitch out of the park there IS something wrong with him.
It was a 93 MPH fastball an inch inside of the middle of the plate and 5 inches above his knees. It was as close to a perfect pitch for Adam Dunn as it could be.

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 Post subject: Re: 2013 Dunn-O-Meter
PostPosted: Sun Apr 21, 2013 4:20 pm 
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They owe him 14M this year plus 15M next year.

Ouch.


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 Post subject: Re: 2013 Dunn-O-Meter
PostPosted: Sun Apr 21, 2013 5:32 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: 2013 Dunn-O-Meter
PostPosted: Sun Apr 21, 2013 5:33 pm 
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cpguy wrote:
They owe him 14M this year plus 15M next year.

Ouch.

Kenny Williams' Win Now legacy lives on...and on and on.

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 Post subject: Re: 2013 Dunn-O-Meter
PostPosted: Sun Apr 21, 2013 5:55 pm 
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It's a travesty... last year, his "back" year is starting to look like the outlier. Actually, last year wasn't all that great either, unless you're Elmhurst Steve and overly enamored of counting stats. Wow!! 41 Homers!!

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 Post subject: Re: 2013 Dunn-O-Meter
PostPosted: Sun Apr 21, 2013 6:01 pm 
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Apologist wrote:
It's a travesty... last year, his "back" year is starting to look like the outlier. Actually, last year wasn't all that great either, unless you're Elmhurst Steve and overly enamored of counting stats. Wow!! 41 Homers!!

Basically all of Oaf's RBIs last year were generated by his Oafshot HRs. Home Run or Nothing for THE OAF!!!

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 Post subject: Re: 2013 Dunn-O-Meter
PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 9:55 pm 
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Down to .101

That's great!

Oh, its all very technical...

Quote:
Adam Dunn believes he's pinpointed the source of his 1-for-31 slump.

Correcting it, however, is annother matter.

"It's boring," Dunn said before the Chicago White Sox faced Cleveland. "It's two little mechanical things. It's technical.

"I can feel it, what it is. I'm just trying to figure out a way to stop it, and that's the thing. I don't want it to obviously snowball, and one thing leads to another and then you have 13 things to worry about. It's not a huge issue, but it is to me.'

Dunn said hasn't felt defensive at the plate.

"I feel good, like I can still do some damage," Dunn said.

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 Post subject: Re: 2013 Dunn-O-Meter
PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 11:35 pm 
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I've never seen an all star level player play this horribly when in a slump.


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 Post subject: Re: 2013 Dunn-O-Meter
PostPosted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 12:31 pm 
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Adam Dunn has 27 K's this season to go along with only 7 hits & 3 walks. If this keeps up, RV will have the same dilemma that Ozzie had 2 years ago when Dunn arrived on the South side. Just like 2 years ago, does RV move Dunn down in the batting order? Does RV bench Dunn completely? Those are a couple of things that Ozzie did, but nothing seemed to work.

Right now, as much as Dunn needs a day off to clear his mind, this White Sox team on the whole is offensively challenged as is. The Sox are stuck between a rock & a hard place in regards to Dunn.


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 Post subject: Re: 2013 Dunn-O-Meter
PostPosted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 2:17 pm 
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SHARK wrote:
Adam Dunn has 27 K's this season to go along with only 7 hits & 3 walks. If this keeps up, RV will have the same dilemma that Ozzie had 2 years ago when Dunn arrived on the South side. Just like 2 years ago, does RV move Dunn down in the batting order? Does RV bench Dunn completely? Those are a couple of things that Ozzie did, but nothing seemed to work.

Right now, as much as Dunn needs a day off to clear his mind
, this White Sox team on the whole is offensively challenged as is. The Sox are stuck between a rock & a hard place in regards to Dunn.

Large Fan wrote:
It's below 50. Uncle Jerry is calling this game off.

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