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 Post subject: Re: Cubbie Kool Aid
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 9:54 am 
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Kirkwood wrote:
good dolphin wrote:
but the douchebag is specifically for Cubbie Kool Aid and I think I backed the douchebagging of it well with three sources.

If you are not in that group, why do you defend them?

No they are not well backed. You're using Bernstein (irrational love of Theo), Holmes (irrational love of Bernstein) and WGN (radio broadcast partner of the Cubs). I don't defend any of these guys. Unfortunately, all three of those sources have a lot of influence being on the two biggest sports stations in Chicago.

But, whatevs, trolls gotta troll. :D

If only the Cub rotation was rock solid 1-4 like the White Sox. Then the cubs would be in the thick of the race like the Sox are!


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 Post subject: Re: Cubbie Kool Aid
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:00 am 
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Boilermaker Rick wrote:
bigfan wrote:
The Cubbie Kool Aid Sox fan hate so much is something the Sox lack. It is called expectations and hope.
I predict the Sox win a division title before the Cubs do.

We've seen the Sox have bad years before and bounce back. Now, they've got a lot of work to do but so do a majority of teams in MLB.

Certainly possible given the AL Central has been the shortbus division for the past 10 years.


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 Post subject: Re: Cubbie Kool Aid
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:01 am 
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rogers park bryan wrote:
good dolphin wrote:
Joe Orr may know that you know that he knows but I'm not so sure after this statement.

If a Cub fan made the statement that the rotation was "producing for the second year in a row" while their team was in last place, you would mock them for years


Quintana is still on a tight rope and Santiago has been up and down.

To call that rotation "set at 1-4" is doing a KegStand of White Sox Kool-Aid


The Sox are in last place in hitting and defense in the American League. Look no further for your culprit in a losing season.

I'm happy with Sale, Santiago Danks and Quintana right now going into the future and I think many teams would be.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubbie Kool Aid
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:03 am 
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Kirkwood wrote:
Certainly possible given the AL Central has been the shortbus division for the past 10 years.
Please do not become one of those "MLB division smack talk" people.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubbie Kool Aid
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:06 am 
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Kirkwood wrote:
good dolphin wrote:
but the douchebag is specifically for Cubbie Kool Aid and I think I backed the douchebagging of it well with three sources.

If you are not in that group, why do you defend them?

No they are not well backed. You're using Bernstein (irrational love of Theo), Holmes (irrational love of Bernstein) and WGN (radio broadcast partner of the Cubs). I don't defend any of these guys. Unfortunately, all three of those sources have a lot of influence being on the two biggest sports stations in Chicago.

But, whatevs, trolls gotta troll. :D


Then tell me, just a wayward Sox fan looking for some Cub expertise, where am I supposed to turn for my Cubs expertise. Joe Sheehan would seem to be an unbiased source and he drank the kool aid most deeply....remember, "not just good, a top MLB team".

Anyway, my douchebagging made know judgement about the quality of the presenters, only that Cubbie Kool Aid was certainly out there in popular media yesterday.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubbie Kool Aid
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:06 am 
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rogers park bryan wrote:
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
rogers park bryan wrote:
So, its the honesty you have an issue with?


No, it's that it's not honesty at all. Ricketts is pocketing the money that could go into making the big league product watchable for the fans who get their ticket prices raised every season. It's not like they had to lose 100 games in order to win some ambiguous future World Series. The fact that you believe that to be the case illustrates exactly how great a con man he really is.


Dont tell me what I believe or that Ive been conned. That's fucking insulting. I know as much about baseball as you do, so dont try your superiority shit on me

I know they could have made you happy by signing a few FA's and winning 83 games and that would have been super awesome for the season ticket holder.

I understand that. That is not a difficult concept to understand. You know I know baseball and know this.


This is evidence that your Anti Cub bias has completely taken over the part of your brain that rationally discusses baseball so you're just saying stupid things that make no sense.


No, Ive not been conned. Im realistic about this teams chances of winning anything in 2012 or 2013. I also think Theo Epstein has been a pretty good Gm and Im willing to give him some time to figure it out (like any rationally thinking fan would)


I know you're dying for that to somehow translate into "WooHoo Soler and Bryant Rule! and Theo is God" for your arguments here, but it never will, no matter how many times you try.


You're obviously not too upset about the atrocious big league club. And if you don't think all these prospects are so great, why so bullish on the future?

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 Post subject: Re: Cubbie Kool Aid
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:13 am 
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bigfan wrote:
When your mantra to start a season is 'I'll show you we dont suck"...not exactly a great marketing slogan
"Baseball is better here"

Better than Miami and Houston, I guess.




Do Santiago or Quintana have a winning record? If not, how can they be producing? ;)

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Last edited by Frank Coztansa on Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:15 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubbie Kool Aid
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:15 am 
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Frank Coztansa wrote:
bigfan wrote:
When your mantra to start a season is 'I'll show you we dont suck"...not exactly a great marketing slogan
"Baseball is better here"

Better than Miami and Houston, I guess.


And The Cell. :(

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 Post subject: Re: Cubbie Kool Aid
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:15 am 
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Boilermaker Rick wrote:
Kirkwood wrote:
Certainly possible given the AL Central has been the shortbus division for the past 10 years.
Please do not become one of those "MLB division smack talk" people.

No, do not want to start that. Just saying, currently, Sox have a nicer path versus the Cubs given where their divisional opponents are.

good dolphin wrote:
Then tell me, just a wayward Sox fan looking for some Cub expertise, where am I supposed to turn for my Cubs expertise.

I honestly don't know. I just read the board. Drop In, NSD, RPB, UMN are pretty realistic fans and post good articles. And, as much as JORR and you like picking on the Cubs your guys' insight does offer reality checks that have affected my outlook on Cubs things.


Last edited by Kirkwood on Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:17 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubbie Kool Aid
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:16 am 
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:( point taken, but I was referring to that dy-no-mite Cubs slogan from last year.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubbie Kool Aid
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:19 am 
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Kirkwood wrote:
No, do not want to start that. Just saying, currently, Sox have a nicer path versus the Cubs given where their divisional opponents are.
I agree with that. My point was in regards to the idea that the Sox have "no hope".

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 Post subject: Re: Cubbie Kool Aid
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:21 am 
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Boilermaker Rick wrote:
Kirkwood wrote:
No, do not want to start that. Just saying, currently, Sox have a nicer path versus the Cubs given where their divisional opponents are.
I agree with that. My point was in regards to the idea that the Sox have "no hope".


Yea, we had Steve Jobs,Bob Hope & Johnny Cash now look where we are at

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 Post subject: Re: Cubbie Kool Aid
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:28 am 
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Hendry was a fucking bum, any asshole could spend huge n make the playoffs n get worked. Hiring Lou was a huge mistake. Madden had to come in n clean up Lou mess after he retired on the job just like here.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubbie Kool Aid
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:29 am 
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Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:

You're obviously not too upset about the atrocious big league club. And if you don't think all these prospects are so great, why so bullish on the future?

Bullish?

Far from it.

Im hopeful things will work out. I think what they're attempting to do is the right approach long term, but I am not bullish in anyway.


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 Post subject: Re: Cubbie Kool Aid
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:29 am 
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Boilermaker Rick wrote:
Kirkwood wrote:
No, do not want to start that. Just saying, currently, Sox have a nicer path versus the Cubs given where their divisional opponents are.
I agree with that. My point was in regards to the idea that the Sox have "no hope".

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 Post subject: Re: Cubbie Kool Aid
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:34 am 
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How could ya not be optimistic about the cubs future? They are restocking the farm system n have the ability to spend as much or more than any team on payroll when they need to.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubbie Kool Aid
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:35 am 
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312player wrote:
How could ya not be optimistic about the cubs future? They are restocking the farm system n have the ability to spend as much or more on payroll when they need to.



Then why aren't they?

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 Post subject: Re: Cubbie Kool Aid
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:36 am 
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312player wrote:
Hendry was a fucking bum, any asshole could spend huge n make the playoffs n get worked. Hiring Lou was a huge mistake. Madden had to come in n clean up Lou mess after he retired on the job just like here.


Hendry pulled off some absolute steal trades that positioned the team as contenders for half a decade. That's some good general managing. There was bad as well.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubbie Kool Aid
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:37 am 
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312player wrote:
How could ya not be optimistic about the cubs future? They are restocking the farm system n have the ability to spend as much or more on payroll when they need to.


312player wrote:
Hendry was a fucking bum, any asshole could spend huge n make the playoffs...


:?

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 Post subject: Re: Cubbie Kool Aid
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:37 am 
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Good ? , I think ricketts wants to save $ while he has this 2-3 year grace period.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubbie Kool Aid
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:42 am 
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rogers park bryan wrote:
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:

You're obviously not too upset about the atrocious big league club. And if you don't think all these prospects are so great, why so bullish on the future?

Bullish?

Far from it.

Im hopeful things will work out. I think what they're attempting to do is the right approach long term, but I am not bullish in anyway.



Okay. There's no need for you to feel insulted. I know you know baseball. I don't think jimmypasta knows more baseball than you, but I do think you're a much younger guy who hasn't heard the same bullshit about rebuilding and five-year plans for as long as guys who are twice your age. Assuming the Cubs don't win between now and 2040, I don't think the 60 year old RPB will know more about baseball than the current one, but I do think he may look at yet another rebuilding effort in a different way.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubbie Kool Aid
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:44 am 
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312player wrote:
Good ? , I think ricketts wants to save $ while he has this 2-3 year grace period.



Grace period? Why does he have a grace period? Because he brought in a con man. They seem to be guaranteeing you a World Series. Do you really believe they have the ability to guarantee you anything?

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 Post subject: Re: Cubbie Kool Aid
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:46 am 
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I can understand the point that a long period of witness failed rebuild attempts can breed cynicism about the latest efforts. What I don't quite understand is the desire for more dollars being spent on the MLB team when it seems to me that the $ saved on the MLB roster is being put back into the system in the Domincan clinic, Amateur/International drafts/signings, Wrigley enhancements etc. Whether Theo/Jed are successful or not, it's hard for me to say they aren't trying to do this in a way that gives the team the best chance a long term continued success which is all I can ask for as a fan.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubbie Kool Aid
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:52 am 
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Northside_Dan wrote:
I can understand the point that a long period of witness failed rebuild attempts can breed cynicism about the latest efforts. What I don't quite understand is the desire for more dollars being spent on the MLB team when it seems to me that the $ saved on the MLB roster is being put back into the system in the Domincan clinic, Amateur/International drafts/signings, Wrigley enhancements etc. Whether Theo/Jed are successful or not, it's hard for me to say they aren't trying to do this in a way that gives the team the best chance a long term continued success which is all I can ask for as a fan.



That might be fair if it were really happening, but I know I read somewhere that they hardly spent any money on the Dominican Academy, certainly nothing close to what they suggested they would.

But I want to point out Bryan scoffing that I think they should have gotten some free agents to win 83 games. Well, if they were on pace to win 83 games maybe they could make a deal for a top pitcher with some of those minor league guys who are perceived- PERCEIVED- to be so great and actually win that elusive World Series instead of talking about it happening at some undefined point in the future. I'll admit that this year probably wasn't the season that could occur as both St. Louis and Pittsburgh appear extraordinarily strong.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubbie Kool Aid
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:55 am 
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I'd like to see the article. I've read that their increased Latin American presence allowed them to sign as strong of an International Class as they did this year.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubbie Kool Aid
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:55 am 
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Northside_Dan wrote:
I can understand the point that a long period of witness failed rebuild attempts can breed cynicism about the latest efforts. What I don't quite understand is the desire for more dollars being spent on the MLB team when it seems to me that the $ saved on the MLB roster is being put back into the system in the Domincan clinic, Amateur/International drafts/signings, Wrigley enhancements etc. Whether Theo/Jed are successful or not, it's hard for me to say they aren't trying to do this in a way that gives the team the best chance a long term continued success which is all I can ask for as a fan.


The team was bought for 800 million. Recent major market MLB team sales are approaching double that amount. I understand that budgets and value are different (but related) items but I don't think they are doing everything they can do as an MLB team

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 Post subject: Re: Cubbie Kool Aid
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:58 am 
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good dolphin wrote:

The team was bought for 800 million. Recent major market MLB team sales are approaching double that amount. I understand that budgets and value are different (but related) items but I don't think they are doing everything they can do as an MLB team


That's fair. I'm sure they might be choosing to pocket an extra 10-20 million as supposed to spending it on the 25 man roster. At this point I don't have an issue with that. Maybe I should? I just don't. If things progress as the 'plan' indicates and it's 2 years down the road and that 20 million isn't used, then I will have a big problem.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubbie Kool Aid
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 11:03 am 
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Northside_Dan wrote:
I'd like to see the article. I've read that their increased Latin American presence allowed them to sign as strong of an International Class as they did this year.


Wittenmyer touches on it here:

http://www.suntimes.com/19200327-573/un ... -debt.html

"Even the state-of-the-art Dominican Academy, scheduled to open next month, cost a modest $7 million."

But I know I've read more detailed stuff about how they haven't really made some of the investments they told fans they would.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubbie Kool Aid
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 11:05 am 
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Boilermaker Rick wrote:
Kirkwood wrote:
Certainly possible given the AL Central has been the shortbus division for the past 10 years.
Please do not become one of those "MLB division smack talk" people.


Especially when the NL Central has been the worst division over the past decade, by far.

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 Post subject: Re: Cubbie Kool Aid
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 11:14 am 
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Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
[
http://www.suntimes.com/19200327-573/un ... -debt.html

"Even the state-of-the-art Dominican Academy, scheduled to open next month, cost a modest $7 million."

But I know I've read more detailed stuff about how they haven't really made some of the investments they told fans they would.



That's interesting. From all I've read is that it's the largest academy in the DR/Surrounding Countries and really has helped the team establish contacts with Int'l FA's evidenced by Elloy Jimenez reportedly signing with the Cubs for less than at least what one other team was offering.

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