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PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 9:48 am 
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I have been away and hadn't heard much about this until this morning. ESPN was on the prowl. I mean, seriously?? The feigned outrage??

Is this offensive? Absolutely.

Is it likely uncommon? Absolutely not.

Can we stop pretending that this shit is that uncommon and that everyone is so shocked it happened? He is likely an idiot, yes, but he is a 20-something NFL wide receiver, not a rocket scientist. I would attribute it more to stupidity and ignorance than actual racism. And I'm NOT defending what he said, but the disingenuous outrage hurts the cause more than it helps, IMO. Work on educating people about the history of this word, not giving a spotlight to some stupid jock wasted at a Kenny Chesney concert.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 9:53 am 
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leashyourkids wrote:
And I'm NOT defending what he said, but the disingenuous outrage hurts the cause more than it helps, IMO. Work on educating people about the history of this word, not giving a spotlight to some stupid jock wasted at a Kenny Chesney concert.

The disingenuous outrage offends me more than the offensive comment itself. I felt the same with the Paula Deen deal. Let's stop pretending like non-blacks don't say this word.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 10:13 am 
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The Original Kid Cairo wrote:
leashyourkids wrote:
And I'm NOT defending what he said, but the disingenuous outrage hurts the cause more than it helps, IMO. Work on educating people about the history of this word, not giving a spotlight to some stupid jock wasted at a Kenny Chesney concert.

The disingenuous outrage offends me more than the offensive comment itself. I felt the same with the Paula Deen deal. Let's stop pretending like non-blacks don't say this word.


That was exactly my thought when dan and Terry were discussing how he could face his teammates. I'm sure they just figured he had said that many times and they didn't really need to consult Deadspin.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 10:19 am 
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I agree with the last few comments. The other thing I find pretty plausible is that the NFL locker room and likely college has an assortment of different types of people under a common cause that is a bit outside of reality. There are two things that would not surprise me. One that black players are used to red neck or farm boy nebraska/iowa/texas linemen types that drink a lot of beer and do crazy shit. Two, it is possible that some white guys are in the circle so to speak with the black players and they say stuff to each other all the time out of the norm. None of this is acceptable in normal society but even with media etc. there is shit in those locker rooms we have no idea about.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 10:58 am 
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The Original Kid Cairo wrote:
Let's stop pretending like non-blacks don't say this word.



Let's stop pretending that ALL races don't do the same stupid shit. Everyone "hates" everyone...

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 11:03 am 
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Here's how I think it went down on the B&B show.

Dan scowering his twitter for the news of the day. RILEY COOPER SAYS THE "N-WORD" comes across. Dan, Terry and Drinky all see it at the same time.

Dan: :shock:

Terry: :shock:

Drinky: :lol:

Dan: Matty, WTF is so funny.

Drinky: Oh sorry, I mean I'm outraged!!!!!

Dan: Oy.


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 11:28 am 
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The N-word is used colloquially quite a bit in popular music, movies, etc., isn't it? I would imagine that a professional athlete is going to even hear it used on occasion by teammates both on and off the field. I think it's unrealistic to expect everyone to know you're not supposed to say it if you're white when it can be heard in that way and in those situations.

I heard Stephen A. Smith with some interesting comments about it this morning.


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 11:29 am 
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Saying the N-word: bad

Saying, once again, that blacks are genetically superior natural athletes: good

Hey, it's a compliment!

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 12:09 pm 
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Q.Bovifs wrote:
They are all just words, but the real reason that word causes such a ruckus is because, when the word is spoken by someone outside the target persuasion, there is no available counter-equivalent to volley with that evokes the same hurtful and humiliating memories.

The words "Cracker" and "Honkey" just aren't that insulting to most white people.

There has to be some sort of semi-recent hurtful and unforgettable history behind it that causes the target to flash back to that pain.

I think the closest thing would be some of the derogatory terms used to slur Jewish people, but even then, most of them would likely just laugh it off because, as a whole, they aren't really considered to be an underprivileged class of people.



The "N" word (feels stupid even typing that) shouldn't carry the same "gravity" as it once did. I know there's a dark history to the word, but the people getting offended by it now really don't have a reference point for the real terrible actions associated with it. I'm not ignoring that history, in any way.

There's more power projected onto the word, by people who aren't really being "oppressed" than it really deserves, in my opinion...

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 12:12 pm 
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Makalu G wrote:
The "N" word (feels stupid even typing that) shouldn't carry the same "gravity" as it once did. I know there's a dark history to the word, but the people getting offended by it now really don't have a reference point for the real terrible actions associated with it. I'm not ignoring that history, in any way.

There's more power projected onto the word, by people who aren't really being "oppressed" than it really deserves, in my opinion...

You're entitled, but that's a shortsighted and very wrong viewpoint. Personally, as a black man I don't like being told what shouldn't offend me and why it shouldn't.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 12:15 pm 
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Q.Bovifs wrote:
They are all just words, but the real reason that word causes such a ruckus is because, when the word is spoken by someone outside the target persuasion, there is no available counter-equivalent to volley with that evokes the same hurtful and humiliating memories.

The words "Cracker" and "Honkey" just aren't that insulting to most white people.

There has to be some sort of semi-recent hurtful and unforgettable history behind it that causes the target to flash back to that pain.

I think the closest thing would be some of the derogatory terms used to slur Jewish people, but even then, most of them would likely just laugh it off because, as a whole, they aren't really considered to be an underprivileged class of people.


Agreed.


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 12:17 pm 
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The Original Kid Cairo wrote:

You're entitled, but that's a shortsighted and very wrong viewpoint. Personally, as a black man I don't like being told what shouldn't offend me and why it shouldn't.



Of course. As a man, period, no one can tell you what you should be offended by. But the fact that even during a rational, frank conversation, adults having to resort to saying ridiculous PC terminology is a huge stumbling block for honest dialog on this subject...

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 12:21 pm 
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All I'm saying is that I know what it's like to be called a nigger by a white person ("er" and not "a"), and while it occurred in the mid-90s and not the mid-30s, I can still tell you that it fucking sucked, especially considering that I was simply walking to the store and not doing anything supposedly niggerish other than being in my own skin. So yeah, it's hard to hear someone telling me I don't have a reference point for it simply because Jim Crow is over. I believe I do, and anyone else here who's experienced that also has.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 12:24 pm 
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Makalu G wrote:
The Original Kid Cairo wrote:

You're entitled, but that's a shortsighted and very wrong viewpoint. Personally, as a black man I don't like being told what shouldn't offend me and why it shouldn't.



Of course. As a man, period, no one can tell you what you should be offended by. But the fact that even during a rational, frank conversation, adults having to resort to saying ridiculous PC terminology is a huge stumbling block for honest dialog on this subject...
Makalu G wrote:
The Original Kid Cairo wrote:

You're entitled, but that's a shortsighted and very wrong viewpoint. Personally, as a black man I don't like being told what shouldn't offend me and why it shouldn't.



Of course. As a man, period, no one can tell you what you should be offended by. But the fact that even during a rational, frank conversation, adults having to resort to saying ridiculous PC terminology is a huge stumbling block for honest dialog on this subject...


To me, if your interlocutor is offended by whatever term, then refraining from using it is not "PC," it's being civil toward one another.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 12:27 pm 
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The Original Kid Cairo wrote:
All I'm saying is that I know what it's like to be called a nigger by a white person ("er" and not "a"), and while it occurred in the mid-90s and not the mid-30s, I can still tell you that it fucking sucked, especially considering that I was simply walking to the store and not doing anything supposedly niggerish other than being in my own skin. So yeah, it's hard to hear someone telling me I don't have a reference point for it simply because Jim Crow is over. I believe I do, and anyone else here who's experienced that also has.



I guess my point is, you know what it's like to be called a shitty name by an asshole, but to me, that's not "oppression"... which is how the "N-word" is seemingly interpreted in this day and age...

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 12:28 pm 
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veganfan21 wrote:


To me, if your interlocutor is offended by whatever term, then refraining from using it is not "PC," it's being civil toward one another.



Absolutely, but that term shouldn't be stricken from the language or carry the gravity projected onto it. Just my opinion...

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 12:29 pm 
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Makalu G wrote:
The Original Kid Cairo wrote:
All I'm saying is that I know what it's like to be called a nigger by a white person ("er" and not "a"), and while it occurred in the mid-90s and not the mid-30s, I can still tell you that it fucking sucked, especially considering that I was simply walking to the store and not doing anything supposedly niggerish other than being in my own skin. So yeah, it's hard to hear someone telling me I don't have a reference point for it simply because Jim Crow is over. I believe I do, and anyone else here who's experienced that also has.



I guess my point is, you know what it's like to be called a shitty name by an asshole, but to me, that's not "oppression"... which is how the "N-word" is seemingly interpreted in this day and age...

I didn't use the word "oppression", nor have I heard anyone else use that word in reference to this Riley Cooper incident. You're projecting and I don't think you should do that.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 12:35 pm 
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The Original Kid Cairo wrote:


I didn't use the word "oppression", nor have I heard anyone else use that word in reference to this Riley Cooper incident. You're projecting and I don't think you should do that.



Honest question. Why is it so bad that this dumbass football player used that word? What is the actual negative significance of that particular word in this day and age?

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 12:35 pm 
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Q.Bovifs wrote:
When a white person says it to a black person, the image of the black race being subservient to teh whites is conjured, thus embroiling emotions and powerful feelings of inequality.

The user of the word knows this prior to saying it, which is why it's used. However, what I'm hearing in this thread is, "It's your fault for letting it bother you so much." Fuck that shit.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 12:36 pm 
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I grew up in the rural part of Illinois that was, as I used to call it, the "wannabe South". I won't lie - I worked blue collar jobs where I heard the word CONSTANTLY. When I was a teenager, I used it myself - not toward black people but in general, just to be "cool" around older adults who were using it. I was young, naive, and ignorant. I remember using the word once in the presence of my dad, and he admonished me appropriately.

Is any of that right? Nope. Is it the culture? Yep. I wish it weren't, but it is. The problem is that, in my estimation, the GREAT majority of people under the age of 50 or so who use it do it because it's culturally accepted and makes them feel "tough." They don't actually hate black people; however, the continued ignorance and culture of being "tough" by using such a derogatory term is difficult to overcome. My dad was a guy who actually had balls, and I admire him more the older I get because he would forbid the use of the word even in casual conversation or over drinks; he was very rare in a culture like that.

That may all seem irrelevant, but my experience growing up shows me how disingenuous the media is. If it was like that where I grew up, it's like that in a lot of places. So don't act surprised that it's thrown around. Have the bravery to admonish its use even in casual conversation and educate those who use such hateful speech. As QBo said, there is no equivalent word in the English language. He is absolutely correct. But giving it media coverage by people who probably use it themselves does nothing to further the discussion. It creates a fabricated world in which everyone is nice and there is no hate. It doesn't exist. It is furthering ignorance with even more ignorance.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 12:38 pm 
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Makalu G wrote:
The Original Kid Cairo wrote:


I didn't use the word "oppression", nor have I heard anyone else use that word in reference to this Riley Cooper incident. You're projecting and I don't think you should do that.



Honest question. Why is it so bad that this dumbass football player used that word? What is the actual negative significance of that particular word in this day and age?

I said earlier in the thread that I'm more offended by the feigned outrage in the media than the comments from Riley himself.

What bothered me was your attempt at arguing that the word isn't or shouldn't be offensive when uttered in 2013. I don't think you have the perspective to make such a statement.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 12:38 pm 
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Hey Kid Cairo, you once told a story about Bernstein playing basketball with a bunch of black people where he said something racist afterwards to his white friends. I don't want to get it wrong so I'll let you tell it. But I'm pretty sure I remember it correctly.

Every time I hear Bernstein blast racists like Cooper and Dean I think of that story about him.


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 12:42 pm 
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I get offended by the fake outrage directed at this show.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 12:43 pm 
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Beardown wrote:
Hey Kid Cairo, you once told a story about Bernstein playing basketball with a bunch of black people where he said something racist afterwards to his white friends. I don't want to get it wrong so I'll let you tell it. But I'm pretty sure I remember it correctly.

Every time I hear Bernstein blast racists like Cooper and Dean I think of that story about him. I always am aware of the fact that he's one of them.

He was courtside at a pickup game at some mini-camp and someone commented on the skills of one of the players. Bernstein (as it was told to me) said, "He's just gonna wind up in jail anyway."

And you're correct. I take it with a grain of salt when Bernstein decries bigotry. He is either dismissive or legitimately unaware of how bigoted he himself is.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 12:44 pm 
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Danny says it's okee doke to use the "a" ,but the hard "er" is a no no! :shock:
Except he didn't say that. In fact he said neither is acceptable. Other than that, great post. :roll:

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 12:47 pm 
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The Original Kid Cairo wrote:

I said earlier in the thread that I'm more offended by the feigned outrage in the media than the comments from Riley himself.

What bothered me was your attempt at arguing that the word isn't or shouldn't be offensive when uttered in 2013. I don't think you have the perspective to make such a statement.


I never said it shouldn't be considered offensive. The words "cocksucker" or "motherfucker" are offensive in the correct context.

My opinion is that there is too much import projected onto the "N-word". It seems to me, marginalizing the word might lessen the impact, giving us more time to focus on "real" issues...

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 12:49 pm 
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I understand Makalu. And I don't want you to think I was trying to be combative. Sometimes it's a sore subject with me.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 1:05 pm 
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The Original Kid Cairo wrote:
Beardown wrote:
Hey Kid Cairo, you once told a story about Bernstein playing basketball with a bunch of black people where he said something racist afterwards to his white friends. I don't want to get it wrong so I'll let you tell it. But I'm pretty sure I remember it correctly.

Every time I hear Bernstein blast racists like Cooper and Dean I think of that story about him. I always am aware of the fact that he's one of them.

He was courtside at a pickup game at some mini-camp and someone commented on the skills of one of the players. Bernstein (as it was told to me) said, "He's just gonna wind up in jail anyway."

And you're correct. I take it with a grain of salt when Bernstein decries bigotry. He is either dismissive or legitimately unaware of how bigoted he himself is.


That's how I remembered it. And if some white athlete or actor had this very same scenerio caught on camera, Bernstein would hit the siron after catching it on his twitter field and go medieval on his ass.

CSFMB: We gotcha, Dan.

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Terry: Eeeee eeee eeee

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 1:09 pm 
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The Original Kid Cairo wrote:
Beardown wrote:
Hey Kid Cairo, you once told a story about Bernstein playing basketball with a bunch of black people where he said something racist afterwards to his white friends. I don't want to get it wrong so I'll let you tell it. But I'm pretty sure I remember it correctly.

Every time I hear Bernstein blast racists like Cooper and Dean I think of that story about him. I always am aware of the fact that he's one of them.

He was courtside at a pickup game at some mini-camp and someone commented on the skills of one of the players. Bernstein (as it was told to me) said, "He's just gonna wind up in jail anyway."

And you're correct. I take it with a grain of salt when Bernstein decries bigotry. He is either dismissive or legitimately unaware of how bigoted he himself is.


Was this from a legitimate source? If so, that actually does surprise me a bit. I always figured DB had a subconscious prejudice toward others, but I never though it would be so blatant, given his affinity for admonishing others for similar (or not quite as offensive) things.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 1:11 pm 
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I will borrow 1K from Vicks brother and offer a bounty on the Bernstein racist comment video.

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