Ever? Or just in the past 10+ seasons?

Past 10 years, yes, 1983 Best draft class ever. Even with the Sayers and Butkus draft!

1 Jimbo Covert T Pittsburgh
2 1 18 18 Willie Gault WR Tennessee
3 2 5 33 Mike Richardson DB Arizona State
4 3 8 64 Dave Duerson DB Notre Dame
5 4 7 91 Tom Thayer C Notre Dame
6 4 23 107 Pat Dunsmore TE Drake
7 8 7 203 Richard Dent DE Tennessee State
8 8 23 219 Mark Bortz G Iowa

_________________
"That's what the internet is for. Slandering others anonymously." Banky
“Been that way since one monkey looked at the sun and told the other monkey ‘He said for you to give me your fuckin’ share.’”

Not even close on either accounts.

The best class in the past 10 is probably, and somewhat sadly, the 2003 class which featured Briggs and Tillman. Grossman also provided value before it became apparent that he's a good backup QB and not a starter.

I say sadly because they missed badly on Haynes, and after Briggs and Tillman there's not much to be proud of. But I don't know if there's another class in the last ten years that yielded two eventual pro bowlers like 2003 did. Does anyone remember?

_________________
Successful calls:

Kyrie Irving will never win anything as a team's alpha: check
T.rubisky is a bust: check
Ben Simmons is a liability: check
The Fields Cult is dumb: double check

2013 CSFMB ROY

Maybe we should let these guys play a game or two first.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

2004 draft was a very solid class:

Tommie Harris
Tank Johnson
Bernard Berrian
Nathan Vasher

The class didn't have longevity but these players were pretty good for the short window.

Best draft of any NFL team ever!

BEARSSSS!

_________________

BEARRSSSSSS!

I'm just glad we (and yes, I am using we) aren't working under the stupid rookie redshirting done by Lovie? There is no way in the world Mills would have been given a shot at starting under Lovie and I have a feeling he would have brought in a veteran LB to cover for Williams.

The answer to this question is obviously Butkus and Sayers. Two guys who were not just HOF but transcendent types of talent.

_________________
O judgment! Thou art fled to brutish beasts,
And men have lost their reason.

1983 is it without a doubt.

60% of one of the best offensive lines of all time and what should have been 2 Hall of Famers.

I'll bet Sayers would tell you it was his draft, though. Then he'd tell you again.

_________________
You know me like that.

This sounds like a pretty good idea, or maybe even give it a year or two.

_________________
2018
#ExtendLafleur
10 More Wins

notice the Packers fans starting to sweat

_________________
O judgment! Thou art fled to brutish beasts,
And men have lost their reason.

Wow that is amazing right there.

_________________
"He is a loathsome, offensive brute
--yet I can't look away."

It is. But, that's how spoiled Bear fans were in this stretch. Today, we're getting all excited that a guy or two might be able to play. But -

In 1981, they got Singletary, Van Horne, Margerum, Todd Bell, and Jeff Fisher.
In 1982, they got McMahon, Gentry, Kurt Becker, and Waechter was a serviceable guy.
In 1984, they got Marshall, Rivera, and Gayle.

They were just loading up during this time period. In 4 years, they got 17 future starters and some other bench pieces. Including 2 Hall of Famers and talents like Covert and Marshall. Incredible.

_________________
You know me like that.

Just goes to show how what Lovie did with his talent was more impressive than what Ditka did with his.

_________________

Goes to show how great Ditka was at developing talent as opposed to Lovie.

_________________
You know me like that.

so anointing this years class best ever..... but not acknowledging last years can almost already be declared one of the worst in the last 10 years?

1 - mcclellin, i just dont see it at DE.... could possibly play LB with his speed
2 - Jeffrey - possibly the only one who has a chance at being something
3 - hardin - was injury prone at college, got injured pre-season last year.... hasnt done anything this year
4 - Rodriguez - had issues with police in college... had same problems in pros... was cut after 1 unproductive season
6 - Frey, is this years zack bowman.... (guy who gets praise in training camp) let's see if he actually wins the nickel job
7 - forgot his name, but he's not on the bears anymore


if you ask me that's D grade already.... so i'll reserve judgement on emery

Goes to show....





.....crap.

_________________

To be fair, I don't think the majority of draft busts under Lovie went on to validate their draft positions for other teams. Cedric Benson and Justin Gage became somewhat useful elsewhere, but at least in the case of Benson, still did not meet or exceed draft day expectations.

Lovie did turn the Bears into a formidable defensive team when he had sufficient talent. They finished in the top 5 in points allowed four times under his watch, including third overall just last year. In 2005 they finished first overall, or 45 points better than the next stingiest team (http://espn.go.com/nfl/statistics/team/ ... /year/2005) It seems the best statistical years for the defense coincide with the tenures of Harris and Peppers, both of whom helped galvanize the wealth of Lovie-Angelo defensive talent behind them (Vasher for some time, Tillman, Manning, Briggs, Brown, Adewale, and so on) into top 5 finishes. Briggs, Tillman, and Harris became pro-bowlers under Lovie's watch, and he maximized Urlacher's strengths to the fullest. So, on at least one one side of the ball, he did a pretty good job of developing talent to fit his specific scheme, IMO.

_________________
Successful calls:

Kyrie Irving will never win anything as a team's alpha: check
T.rubisky is a bust: check
Ben Simmons is a liability: check
The Fields Cult is dumb: double check

2013 CSFMB ROY

_________________
You know me like that.

I don't credit him with Briggs and Urlacher's development. U in particular was a stud before Lovie walked in the door and I mildly object to saying he used Urlacher to his fullest potential but it's possible.

My issue with Lovie and my theory with the poor drafting record of the Lovie Era is more with his style. I think that style defense is difficult to draft for. It's not a style that is prevalent in the college game and requires a lot of "projection" on how a guy's athletic ability would fit in the system. Most times the projections were off.

I think a bit more traditional defense is easier to draft for because you have more evidence of their ability to play those particular schemes.

But, that's just my theory.

The best defensive players in the Lovie Era were all drafted prior to Lovie (Urlacher, Briggs, Tillman) or guys like Peppers who were proven elsewhere.

_________________
You know me like that.

I've got to run right now if I want to make it on time to the set of Saw 8, where I play "Backwards-Turned Male in Large Crowd #6," so I'll reply in full at a later time. For now, I'll agree Urlacher was established before Lovie came along, but Briggs and Tillman were only in their second year once Lovie was hired, so I'm not sure if it's reasonable to say we can't credit Lovie for Briggs and Tillman. I'll give you Peppers and Urlacher, but Harris and Vasher were also good players under Lovie, in addition to pro bowlers Briggs and Tillman. In fact, I think Harris was as big a star as Urlacher before injuries caught up to him.

Your thoughts about the difficulty of drafting for the scheme are interesting; I'll have to think more about that. But they did have several respectable statistical showings, despite the difficulty of drafting and the draft busts, and if they won in in 2006 it would have been because of the defense that season.

_________________
Successful calls:

Kyrie Irving will never win anything as a team's alpha: check
T.rubisky is a bust: check
Ben Simmons is a liability: check
The Fields Cult is dumb: double check

2013 CSFMB ROY

_________________

The projections were infamously off more often than not, but at the same time I don't know if we can establish causality between the Bears' system and the repeated draft failures. The system tried to replicate the success of the late '90s, early '00s Bucaneers, and when the Bears had their own triumvirate of star defensive players at the precise positions that make the system "go" (Harris, Brown/Adewale and Urlacher specifically, but others as well), they did just fine statistically, and in the standings as well. I say this to demonstrate that the system had precedent, as both a scheme and personnel philosophy, that may complicate the assertion that it was a difficult scheme to draft for. The post-Super Bowl defense suffered because they lost the one asset that allowed them to create pressure on the QB by rushing just four lineman (Harris). When Peppers replaced the sack/pressure generation that disappeared along with Harris, the defense came alive once again and functioned at a sufficiently effective rate to vault the Bears back into the playoffs. As with the Bucs, the system can and does work provided you have sufficient talent at key positions on the line and in the middle of the field (Sapp, Rice, Peppers, Harris, Urlacher, Brooks, etc.)

This is a personnel issue, in my opinion, more so than an issue with the system. Ascertaining how players will fit into this or that system is part of every team's draft strategy, and I think the Bears' failure in this regard has more to do with Angelo's player evaluation methods than anything else. Remember, it's not like the failed draft picks excelled elsewhere. He didn't miss out on drafting cover two players, he often missed out on drafting NFL-level players period. That being said, I do believe Lovie developed the players he inherited, as well as the players he coached as rookies, into an upper-echelon type defense that nearly won a Superbowl, and carried other teams into the playoffs.

_________________
Successful calls:

Kyrie Irving will never win anything as a team's alpha: check
T.rubisky is a bust: check
Ben Simmons is a liability: check
The Fields Cult is dumb: double check

2013 CSFMB ROY

I agree that any enthusiasm about this year should be tempered by last year. To me, the only way you call 2012 a success is if McClellin and Jeffery became bona-fide starters at DE/LB and WR 2, respectively, and Hardin becomes a decent rotation guy, if not a starter.

_________________
Successful calls:

Kyrie Irving will never win anything as a team's alpha: check
T.rubisky is a bust: check
Ben Simmons is a liability: check
The Fields Cult is dumb: double check

2013 CSFMB ROY

I don't think the book is written on Mc Clellin but it is pretty clear that he isn't an every down DE.

I think Hardin has one more year to prove himself. He has not shown much skill in any facet of the game, even as a guy you knew on draft day would take time to develop. Last year was a wash because of the injury but I expected him to show something on special teams this year which he has not.

_________________
O judgment! Thou art fled to brutish beasts,
And men have lost their reason.

Lost your mind
1 Dick Butkus LB Illinois
1 Gale Sayers RB Kansas
7 Dick Gordon WR Michigan State
8 Brian Schweda DE Kansas
10 Dennis Murphy DT Florida
11 Frank Cornish DT Grambling State
14 Dave Pivec TE Notre Dame
20 Ralph Kurek RB Wisconsin

_________________
I'm going to bounce from the spot for awhile but I will be back at some point to argue with you about this hoops stuff again. Playoffs have been great this season. See ya up the road.

I'm out.