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PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2013 9:13 am 
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Frank Coztansa wrote:
Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:
But, if you are going to throw there, it's a 2-second play. The guy either breaks wide open or you immediately throw it in the stands. I assume Cutler had been coached as such. If not, it is Trestman's fault but as Tresty describes it there, it seems that is what he also believed the play should be.
Agree 100%. Either the guy is open or you throw it away. I suppose if there is an opening, Cutler runs it himself but on a goaline stand odds are that will not happen.

Still a terrible play call though. I would have no problem with that being done from the 5 yard line, but not at the 1. Run it 3 times and get the TD. Michael Bush is making millions to sit on the bench, evidently.


This is why I posted the quote. It was surprising to see Trestman take a pass on some self-criticism, even if he's still right about Cutler.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2013 9:15 am 
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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Probably nothing, but thought it was worth posting anyway:

Quote:
“The thought process was we’re going to go four downs, and that was the situation. We had already scripted. We were going to throw the ball on first down. It was a play we put in for this game and they did a very good job of covering it. They covered the flat, they covered the corner portion of the route. I think if you asked Jay he’d want to have that one back. Probably would have thrown the ball away and we would have had three downs to score. That’s how I think he would see it. He would want it back, obviously, as we want to come out of there with...it’s a clean touchdown or we’ll throw it way. Other than that there’s not much more you can say about it.”


http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/fo ... full.story

This is Trestman responding to a question about the goal line interception. I thought it was interesting that he blames Cutler for the throw and not, even perfunctorily, the play-call. My initial reaction at the time of the play was one of indifference because the receiver was open, but I can definitely reason with those who said they should have ran the ball from the one yard line instead of trying to get too cute.

Since you could go either way with the pass vs run choice in that scenario, I just found it interesting that Trestman did not use his post-game interview to deflect blame away from Cutler for the play; in fact, he indirectly tries to vindicate himself by repeatedly saying that Jay would like to have the throw back, and that there's "not much more" to say about, essentially, Cutler being the one to blame for the turnover. I thought there was definitely more to say about the play, such as the obvious counterpoint about simply running the ball behind your shiny new offensive line, the same one you trusted to get one yard on a crucial fourth down last week.

Again this is probably nothing, but I was struck that Trestman passed on deflecting blame away from Cutler when most coaches/players use similar opportunities to deliver intentionally vague soundbites like "I've got to do a better job there with the call," or, "I've got to put our players in a better position to succeed," etc.


Trestman is correct. Personally, I would prefer that they had run the ball. But, I understand a different approach with this personnel.

But, if you are going to throw there, it's a 2-second play. The guy either breaks wide open or you immediately throw it in the stands. I assume Cutler had been coached as such. If not, it is Trestman's fault but as Tresty describes it there, it seems that is what he also believed the play should be.

Chalk it up to a learning experience for Cutler since Jennings made it all better a few minutes later.


Hopefully it is a learning experience, but at the same time you'd think a 30 year old QB would recognize a good time to throw it away. Maybe this quote is also an indication of how Trestman seeks to handle Cutler? Total accountability, no catering to his ego or personality...?

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2013 9:23 am 
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2013 9:27 am 
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veganfan21 wrote:
Hopefully it is a learning experience, but at the same time you'd think a 30 year old QB would recognize a good time to throw it away. Maybe this quote is also an indication of how Trestman seeks to handle Cutler? Total accountability, no catering to his ego or personality...?


That's a better way of saying what I was trying to say. He needs Cutler to think a certain way and I like that he's putting it on players to make the smart play.

I guess you could argue that Trestman should take blame for calling the play at all but, if executed properly, throw it to wide open guy or throw it away, it's not much more risky than just handing it off and plowing it up the middle.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2013 9:38 am 
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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:
That's a better way of saying what I was trying to say. He needs Cutler to think a certain way and I like that he's putting it on players to make the smart play.

I guess you could argue that Trestman should take blame for calling the play at all but, if executed properly, throw it to wide open guy or throw it away, it's not much more risky than just handing it off and plowing it up the middle.
But handing it off and plowing it up the middle (thats what she said) is actually the smartest play to be made.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2013 11:06 am 
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Jaw Breaker wrote:
One thing seems to be clearer each week: Eric Weems needs to be cut. That crap near the goal line was almost disastrous.


It was a very smart play. At worst the Bears get it at the 2. Instead they got it at the 20.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2013 11:11 am 
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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Hopefully it is a learning experience, but at the same time you'd think a 30 year old QB would recognize a good time to throw it away. Maybe this quote is also an indication of how Trestman seeks to handle Cutler? Total accountability, no catering to his ego or personality...?


That's a better way of saying what I was trying to say. He needs Cutler to think a certain way and I like that he's putting it on players to make the smart play.

I guess you could argue that Trestman should take blame for calling the play at all but, if executed properly, throw it to wide open guy or throw it away, it's not much more risky than just handing it off and plowing it up the middle.


If you're winning it doesn't matter but I have to believe that approach doesn't get you many fans in the locker room.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2013 11:14 am 
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Nas wrote:
Jaw Breaker wrote:
One thing seems to be clearer each week: Eric Weems needs to be cut. That crap near the goal line was almost disastrous.


It was a very smart play. At worst the Bears get it at the 2. Instead they got it at the 20.
Yeah. It was a situation that only helps the Bears. More players should be that smart.

Even if the Bears picked it up and ran it and then fumbled it would still be the Bears ball at the 2 yard line. They get whatever is better of the two results.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2013 11:14 am 
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Nas wrote:
Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Hopefully it is a learning experience, but at the same time you'd think a 30 year old QB would recognize a good time to throw it away. Maybe this quote is also an indication of how Trestman seeks to handle Cutler? Total accountability, no catering to his ego or personality...?


That's a better way of saying what I was trying to say. He needs Cutler to think a certain way and I like that he's putting it on players to make the smart play.

I guess you could argue that Trestman should take blame for calling the play at all but, if executed properly, throw it to wide open guy or throw it away, it's not much more risky than just handing it off and plowing it up the middle.


If you're winning it doesn't matter but I have to believe that approach doesn't get you many fans in the locker room.


Well,

#1 - You don't need to be their friend. They need to open their mail, drink their coffee, and do their job.

#2 - What's so offensive about saying that you guys need to run the plays the way they are designed and if you don't then I'm going to call you out on it in the hopes that you get the message that this is how it needs to be done.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2013 11:18 am 
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I guess since the Bears last 2 coaches were player coaches it seemed like the smart way to go. Neither coach lost the team because the players loved them. When things go bad for a coach that takes Trestman's approach the team usually quits. Sure you can argue that is probably better because the guy gets fired and mediocre isn't your floor.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2013 11:24 am 
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WWDD - What would Ditka do? He would have strangled McMahon. Conversation over.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2013 11:27 am 
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leashyourkids wrote:
WWDD - What would Ditka do? He would have strangled McMahon. Conversation over.

Bears!


Trestman doesn't have it in him to be that type of an asshole.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 17, 2013 11:14 am 
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Have we confirmed Weems knew what he was doing?


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 17, 2013 12:03 pm 
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rogers park bryan wrote:
Have we confirmed Weems knew what he was doing?


No referee insight, just observations:


Quote:
Now, to actual game play, and the Eric Weems play - the Vikings couldn't have scored a touchdown on it unless Weems picked it up and fumbled it, which was not going to happen; Weems said on Twitter afterward that he knew the rule all along that after the Vikings already touched it, they couldn't score a touchdown on it, and the worst case scenario is they'd pick the ball up where it eventually was touched. The best case scenario is the touchback which, by comparison, works out great. I'll admit, it's not a rule I knew.


http://www.windycitygridiron.com/2013/9 ... otted-down

Quote:
Eric Weems said he knew exactly what he was doing in the second quarter when he tried to retrieve a punt in the end zone. The ball squirted away and nearly was recovered by the Vikings in the end zone. But it would’ve been a touchback for the Bears regardless because the Vikings touched the ball first.

“I was going to lateral it, do whatever,” he said, “because there’s no consequence once they touch it first. Anything goes.’’


http://www.suntimes.com/sports/22584182 ... shift.html

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 17, 2013 12:12 pm 
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veganfan21 wrote:
Probably nothing, but thought it was worth posting anyway:

Quote:
“The thought process was we’re going to go four downs, and that was the situation. We had already scripted. We were going to throw the ball on first down. It was a play we put in for this game and they did a very good job of covering it. They covered the flat, they covered the corner portion of the route. I think if you asked Jay he’d want to have that one back. Probably would have thrown the ball away and we would have had three downs to score. That’s how I think he would see it. He would want it back, obviously, as we want to come out of there with...it’s a clean touchdown or we’ll throw it way. Other than that there’s not much more you can say about it.”


http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/fo ... full.story

This is Trestman responding to a question about the goal line interception. I thought it was interesting that he blames Cutler for the throw and not, even perfunctorily, the play-call. My initial reaction at the time of the play was one of indifference because the receiver was open, but I can definitely reason with those who said they should have ran the ball from the one yard line instead of trying to get too cute.

Since you could go either way with the pass vs run choice in that scenario, I just found it interesting that Trestman did not use his post-game interview to deflect blame away from Cutler for the play; in fact, he indirectly tries to vindicate himself by repeatedly saying that Jay would like to have the throw back, and that there's "not much more" to say about, essentially, Cutler being the one to blame for the turnover. I thought there was definitely more to say about the play, such as the obvious counterpoint about simply running the ball behind your shiny new offensive line, the same one you trusted to get one yard on a crucial fourth down last week.

Again this is probably nothing, but I was struck that Trestman passed on deflecting blame away from Cutler when most coaches/players use similar opportunities to deliver intentionally vague soundbites like "I've got to do a better job there with the call," or, "I've got to put our players in a better position to succeed," etc.


The play call didn't lead to the INT though. Cutler's decision to throw it over the middle did. Should have just thrown it away and get to 2nd down.


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 17, 2013 2:54 pm 
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 17, 2013 2:58 pm 
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Bucky Chris wrote:

The play call didn't lead to the INT though. Cutler's decision to throw it over the middle did. Should have just thrown it away and get to 2nd down.


Well no play is designed to throw an INT, but yeah, Cutler should have thrown it away. I think the criticism is more about taking advantage of the field position at that time (1 yard line) to run it, as opposed to putting the ball in the air and risking an interception. Now, of course running can lead to a turnover as well, but interceptions occur more frequently than fumbles anyway, and especially so in high-traffic areas like a congested end zone when you're throwing from the 1 yard line.

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