That is very cool. Your post above certainly had me enraged.

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My work here is done again

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"That's what the internet is for. Slandering others anonymously." Banky
“Been that way since one monkey looked at the sun and told the other monkey ‘He said for you to give me your fuckin’ share.’”

Still pretty early in their careers as they're both 25 and under.

Just like Khalil Greene and Bobby Crosby seemed destined for great careers so were Johan Santana and Brandon Webb. All 4 were pretty much done by 30.

It was quite a job I must say.

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This thread seems sorta ridiculous now. Nobody would take Starlin.

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Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

The fact that Robin Yount was a first-ballot guy (did Selig cook the books?) shows you that Jeter would also be first-ballot if he had played anywhere else. Yount was also a butcher at SS (44 errors one year).

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Were Greene, Crosby, Santana, and Webb considered the equals of "the core four"?

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

Core 5 now with Russell. And Ill bet the core 5 out homers that group!

That's not a tough bet.

I just laugh at guys like THE INQUISITOR re-posting Keith Law saying "the Cub offense is going to get good in a hurry". There is little doubt Keith Law thought Crosby and Greene were going to be All-Stars for "many years to come".

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

I like Keith Law. He's paid to make those predictions. You just have to take it for what it's worth. They've got a handful of guys that have a chance to be good.

Yeah, but so does everybody. I just think- and I don't mean this with regard to the Cubs specifically- that all these projections are overstated. I mean, some of these guys making proclamations about these players have never even seen them. If Keith Law were really so smart, he'd be running a team instead of writing a blog. What he does is a lot closer to doing what you and I are right now than to being Jim Hendry.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

But everybody doesnt. The Cubs didnt just a few years ago. The predictions might be overstated or too confident but not all minor league systems are equal.

But you didn't really know that a few years ago. Obviously, they're not all equal. But a lot of times it's the guys you don't think about that are better than the guys you do. If we were having this conversation in 1998 Keith Law would be telling us how much better Jeff Austin and Ryan Mills are than Mark Buehrle.

Sure, the Cubs have depth. But if two guys make it as regular everyday players with significant careers in Cub uniforms, that's pretty good. The depth is a way to achieve that. But that isn't to say there isn't some organization out there that only has two guys worth discussing and they both make it and are better than the best two Cubs.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

No, its not an indictment of other teams its just saying the Cubs have a nice bunch of players knocking on the door of MLB

You keep getting good young prospects and eventually some of them are going to produce (Pirates, Indians, even the Royals won 86 last year)


The thing Ive been thinking about recently is how for all the discussion on Theo and the plan its really just going to come down to if Ricketts will spend the money to fill in the holes correctly

Didn't the Royals have three of the top five prospects a few years back? Hosmer, Moustakas, and someone? Moustakas is a turd. Hosmer is common. They aren't going to win anything.

Even a guy like Bryce Harper. He was talked about like he was Al Kaline. Now he looks like a platoon player.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

They won 86 games last year, which as weve all discussed many many times is enough to get hot and win it all.

Yeah, Id bet Bryce Harper will not be a platoon player. His problem has been health, not production.

Harper is 21 turning 22.

Right, but now you're describing the White Sox. Not what the Cubs supposedly aspire to be.

In addition to his health problems, Harper has a problem hitting lefties. But he's still a kid. Maybe he can develop that part of his game. Or maybe he's just Gary Roenicke. Not a bad player.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

I know. So what? This type of thinking is part and parcel of the fetishization of prospects and "young guys". Every guy just doesn't automatically get better. In fact, it looks like Harper is getting worse.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

But most do at that age

Most don't start a big league career as young as he did. He looks to me like a guy who peaked in high school. I'm sure he'll be a useful big league player for a long time. I just don't see him as a guy you build a team around.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

His career average against lefties is .246 and he's batting .375 against them this year.

And ok, so he might not be a superstar? Thats fine. Useful players are a good thing.

It seems your main point here is "prospects dont always work out"

I think that's understood.

No. My point is that just because a guy is hyped doesn't make him good. His performance is what makes him good.

Javier Baez has AAA numbers like Andy Wilkins. But someone has decided Baez is the next big thing and Wilkins is just a turd. That isn't analysis. It's just claptrap. Of course, someone will mention the respective ages of the players. That may or may not be pertinent. But it's probably a good bet that Javier Baez will never have an MLB season as good as the one Connor Gillaspie is having right now and we all know Gillaspie is bad at baseball.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

This is taking two extremes and trying to force them together to make your point. The truth falls in the middle. Right now Cubs fans would be disappointed if Gillaspie's season this year is Baez's ceiling but we can't look at it in a vacuum. If he does that as a piece of World Series teams we will say he was a great prospect that worked out.

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The recent assault on Javy Baez numbers is missing what he has been doing. At one point he was batting in the .180's, to climb to .250, something has been going right. No doubt he didnt do well in AAA right away but his numbers the last month are very good.

I know an ALL STAR SS who batted .208 his last 30 games and is batting below .200 in July.

_________________
"That's what the internet is for. Slandering others anonymously." Banky
“Been that way since one monkey looked at the sun and told the other monkey ‘He said for you to give me your fuckin’ share.’”

You're just being anti Cub and arguing against Bernstein now.

You keep bashing Baez as if the previous dominance in the minors never happened. Like people just decided he was good to piss you off. The guy hit 37 homeruns last year and scouts drool over his swing. Why does that bother you so much?

And then you end it with some silliness about Connor Gillaspie that Bernstein probably said. Im not gonna answer for Bernstein's trolling.

The climb in average is very nice along with the recent power surge. My favorite development story line has been his K rate:

April: 34.92%
May: 34.45%
June: 29.31%
July: 22.08%

GOOD! I rather he stays in AAA all year and continue building on the improvements in approach.

Everyone dominated at some level. Most eventually stop dominating.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

I dont think you're being reasonable.

Baez has struggled, figured it out and then dominated every level. There is not much to not like. He's been on a tear lately. So what now?

Ignore that? Focus on the bad?

Will you be happy if he is Mark Reynolds?

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don