Let's talk some hoops.

Jimmy Butler's first half for the Bulls this season:

46% FG, 34% 3P, 83% FT, 5.8 RPG, 3.2 APG, 1.8 STL, 20.4 PPG.

"All-Star" "#1 Option" "Most Valuable" "Stud" "Max Contract"

Luol Deng's first half for the Bulls last season:

45% FG, 27% 3P, 81% FT, 6.9 RPG, 3.7 APG, 1 STL, 19.0 PPG

"Trade him" "just a guy" "Not worth $10M a season, let alone $14M"

Also keep in mind that Jimmy Butler's numbers come in a season where the Bulls have more offensive threats, making it hard to double team any one guy. Jimmy Butler is able to get easier shots based on Dunleavy, Mirotic, Rose, Brooks creating space while bigs can't leave Pau, Taj, and Noah down low.

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Rick Hahn is the best GM in baseball.

Luol Deng is an old 29...will be 30. Remember he came into the league at 19. It took Deng years to get to that point. Butler is new. Why not go with the newer, younger option?

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Deng wouldn't drive to the hoop even if he could do it in an escalade.

Butler > Deng

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Jalen Rose was also the leading scorer when he played with bums. Deng was on his last leg and Butler has just arrived.

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Be well

GO BEARS!!!

The numbers are eerily close but I would go with Butler. He just looks like he impacts the game more than Luol Deng ever has. He may not but if you watch the game it looks as though he does. The Bulls also became better after trading Deng last yr another indication of his lessened value. Deng has had little to no impact on the two teams that he has played on since leaving the Bulls. These numbers are closer than I would've originally thought though.

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Current Deng stats:

48% FG, 37% 3P, 75% FT, 5.1 RPG, 1.8 APG, 1 STL, 14.3 PPG

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Why does age need to come into it right now? We were talking about someone already under contract. I'm well aware of when Deng was drafted.

Deng was always underrated by Bulls fans. Butler's season is comparable to Deng's, and might be having an easier time of it than Deng has. But fans don't want to give Deng credit.

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Rick Hahn is the best GM in baseball.

Deng was not, and is not, on his last legs, as this stat line shows.

He would be a fantastic 3 on this current team. Do you trust the decade of solid play Deng gave the Bulls, or a half season of Butler?

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Rick Hahn is the best GM in baseball.

I don't know if he is worth ten mil a yr at this stage. Would you want yeah but not at that price. Butler may not be a max guy but he is a better player than Deng. Deng is also putting these numbers up for a team that may not make the playoffs. Wade and Bosh are playing well so it's not like he has to carry the team. He doesn't impact games. You can point to games this yr and locate Butler's impact. Deng doesn't do that

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Deng is an older Butler. Both are great players to have.

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Be well

GO BEARS!!!

Deng can only get worse. Butler is improving every year. Butler gets to the line when he wants. Deng has never been as good as Butler is now IMO.

Butler 7.4 fta per game
Deng 3.6 fta per game

Butler is 5th in the league in FTA's with Harden, Cousins, Westbrook and Lebron ahead of him. Thats impressive.

FT attempts are already reflected in ppg. There aren't 'better' points and 'worse' points. You could argue too many FTA is a result of risky play. Haven't Lebron, Westbrook, Cousins, Harden and Butler all been hurt this year and last?

Deng is a two time all star. Last year Deng is comparable to this year Butler. And butler has not improved every year. Last year was a regression. Next year could be with the possible emergence of Snell.

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Rick Hahn is the best GM in baseball.

Butler is better than Deng. Deng stunk in Cleveland and his numbers are pedestrian now. It could be argued that his 19 a game was a result of fewer scoring options. With more options his average went down both in Cleveland and Miami. Cleveland was dysfunctional if you want that excuse but in the case of Miami what gives? They are after all the championship team that everyone here appears to covet. Why aren't his numbers and more importantly his impact greater? The Bulls also improved last yr after he was traded. They didn't even receive anything from the trade and yet they improved instantly.

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Terrible thought. Real bad.

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Par for the course with this guy. Deng has also had a number of injuries over the yrs. Are his injuries due to non-risky play since he doesn't go to the line much?

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Lots of ways to get injured in a game besides drives to the rim. If Rose was still out Jimmy's numbers would be higher.

Butler is younger, more explosive and can create his own shot. He can also actually dribble the ball without have to look at it and is capable of driving to the hoop.

That's right up there with the idea of having 'too many baserunners'.

... ♫ Too Many Cooks ♫ ...

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Power is always in the hands of the masses of men. What oppresses the masses is their own ignorance, their own short-sighted selfishness.
- Henry George

So those players were not all injured, costing their teams victories by missing time? I must have imagined it.

Was it Nas that told me I was wrong in thinking Bulls fans undervalued Deng's contributions to the Bulls? Nas, are you reading this thread?

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Rick Hahn is the best GM in baseball.

I was all in on Deng before you came around. I saw what he brought to the game. It wasn't always something that will show up on a stat sheet. Jimmy Butler is very similar but much younger and better now.

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Be well

GO BEARS!!!

Deng's first four years:

48% FG, 27% 3P, 3.7 FTA 76% FT, 6.4 RPG, 2.3 APG, 1 STL, 0.5 BLK, 15.6 PPG. 33.3 MPG

Butler's first four years:

43.8% FG, 32% 3P, 4.1 FTA, 80% FT, 4.2 RPG, 1.9 APG, 1.3 STL, 0.6 BLK, 11.2 PPG, 29.2 MPG

I was a Duke fan in high school. Not sure you're correct on this.

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Rick Hahn is the best GM in baseball.

I was the Deng fan of the board before you arrived.

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Be well

GO BEARS!!!

This board is a small pimple on the ass of sports fandom.

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Rick Hahn is the best GM in baseball.

Butler's first he didn't play in a third of the games and Thibbs gave him less than 10 minutes a game.

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I didn't total up points or stats. I did per game. And you can tell by the minutes that they are comparable. If you want to obtain Per 36 Minutes stats, do so and post them here. Luol would still "win" those.

Is it a positive for Butler that he wasn't NBA ready and Deng was? And Deng played one year at Duke; Butler had four at Marquette.

I like Butler. But he is a younger Luol Deng. He is less good at shooting mid range jumpers, and better at driving to the hoop. But they are VERY similar. It is unfair to Deng, now or when he was a Bull, that he wasn't getting the recognition that Butler is getting.

Luol Deng is African by way of England. Maybe fans cannot get behind a player like that as easily as they can with a Jimmy Butler.

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Rick Hahn is the best GM in baseball.

Most rookies redshirt under Thibs. It has proven to be effective.

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Be well

GO BEARS!!!

This is an example of your basketball knowledge or lack thereof. Yeah you are right I can learn a lot from you. My bad this wasn't you also. I feel like I'm debating man-e- faces from he-man fame. You really have a lot of basketball acumen to export.

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This is an example of your basketball knowledge or lack thereof. Yeah you are right I can learn a lot from you. My bad this wasn't you also. I feel like I'm debating man-e- faces from he-man fame. You really have a lot of basketball acumen to export.

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Please break down as to how or why you think so.

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Rick Hahn is the best GM in baseball.